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Tomorrow’s advice:-

Watch Frankel closely JUST before they go into the stalls. If he still has four legs at that point, relax and watch him come home with his head in his chest.

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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I only saw her running 7 mins before the off.

No wonder she won, with that head start!! LOL

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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I wouldn’t put too much store by what Born To Sea does as connections say Camelot hated the ground at the Curragh and AOB is very sweet on him which says a fair bit and any horse that wins the 2,000 and the Derby is well above average. It is clear they want to win the Triple Crown with him and the horse can do no more than run where they enter him.

What happens after the Leger who knows but if all goes well and he runs again the Arc looks more likely as if Frankel wins this week at York there is no point going up against him.

It all boils down to whether you accept the sound bites at face value or not. I know which race most trainers/owners would like to see on their horse’s CV

I have my doubts and see Camelot’s owners being a bit like Dr Strangelove:-

"How I learned to stop worrying and love the Leger"

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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Try throwing up some names of hoses who you think should have run here

Garden Hose, Fireman’s Hose, Pantie Hose………

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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@stevecaution….sorry steve was rushing down the thread after getting back from Newmarket and misread your post as Gingers

Good luck Steve and Ginger for the coming week and York..Come on Frankel..sure he’s not even going to notice the extra 2 furlongs

Thank you, I am due a change of luck. After Strong Suit on Saturday I decided on Reckless Abandon as my sole Sunday bet. Cut the grass, fell asleep on the Sofa and woke up 15 minutes AFTER he had won.

Main bet of the week for me is Ortensia. I think she looks different class on faster ground and has only Bated Breath to beat in my mind. I was not convinced by her before her win at Goodwood, where jockey William Buick said she was "Head and shoulders better than the opposition"

As the late Monkee Davey Jones sang:-

"Then I saw her race, now I’m a believer!!"

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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Three things we learned here:-

1.Golden Lilac is not as good as was previously thought

Crazy talk. Elusive Kate confirmed herself to be quite decent here, and on their previous meeting there isn’t much between her and Golden Lilac over a mile. Golden Lilac had the nightmare run and thus pulled her head off this time, clear excuses.
If Golden Lilac isn’t as good as we thought then neither is Elusive Kate, Cirrus Des Aigles, and a long list of other horses.

The quality of Excelebration’s win nothing spectacular since he was fully extended. We know how good Cityscape is; he didn’t have the race run to suit and still stuck on for 2nd. Moonlight Cloud found trouble again and stormed home very well but we still don’t know whether or not she’ll stay a strong-run mile.

Making excuses for Golden Lilac is becoming the norm, rather than the exception. I am not an Elusive Kate fan either.

The reason I pick Golden Lilac in particular is that someone told me she was a CERT for the Arc this season. We all have our opinions. To those on her for the Arc, I would say, good luck with that project!!

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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Now now lads!!

Clive Cox was interviewed on Attheraces today and, after what seemed like an eternity, Chappers eventually broached the subject of next years Guineas. Clive Cox was of the opinion that the horse was all speed but that he had not entirely ruled out the possibility of trying him over further. I don’t think we will see him over further than 6f this year, so I am not going to back him for the 2000 Guineas. If he turns out to be a freak then so be it.
Thanks to everyone who replied.

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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Aiden has already called Camelot a once in a lifetime horse and you can bet your bottom dollar, if he wins the St leger well, he’ll kiss the Blarney Stone and spout some more superlatives our way.

It’s then a case of whether or not he believes it himself on whether he sends him to France or not but I personally think there’s not a cat in hells chance.

He’ll tell us he’s the best he’s ever trained then he’ll stand on a chunk or rock that fell of the Blarney Stone pull up lame and never race again.

I doubt if Ricky’s prediction that he’ll prove himself big time in the Arc will ever come to fruition.

I backed Camelot for the Arc before the Epsom Derby but have little confidence in collecting. It seems hard to believe that the owners suddenly feel they are all getting on a bit and want to win the Triple Crown so much. The Arc is THE race to win if you have a horse good enough to do it. My wallet would love to see him win the Arc but I have my doubts he will run.

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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Chappers the new Derek Thompson?

Am I getting confused here:-

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i237/scorrie57/thommo.jpg

Matt (Different Gravy) Chapman

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i237/scorrie57/Chappers.jpg

Derek (Calm down Ash) Thompson

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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Too much speed, light frame, no stamina in the pedigree.

Won’t make it to the Guineas.

Shame if he doesn’t make it there. A rather unconsidered horse I think. You get the feeling that if he were trained by Cecil or O’Brien then punters would be licking their monitors and writing Tennyson like eulogies.

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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We shall sea, only on this forum could the first winner of the triple crown in half a lifetime either side of the pond have his form crabbed down to handicap level.

Have the bookies paid out already?

Always a little dangerous to hand out the prize before the race is run. He will face better rivals than Born To Sea in the St Leger

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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My late Mother-In-Law and I used to argue about whether Sean Boyce or Matt Chapman was the better "Man in the booth"

She maintained that Chappers was better craic, albeit a bit prone to one too many "Yeehars" and "Getting Jiggy with it" on far too regular a basis. I preferred Boycie’s no nonsense approach as being a bit easier on the ears.

"Boycie?, Boycie is worse than Ronseal" she said one day. To which I replied "What do you mean?"

"Well at least Ronseal will eventually come off the "F…ing fence!!" was the reply.

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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I don’t think you can use Born To Sea as a reliable yardstick. The horse has some soundness and consistency issues and can’t be guaranteed to produce the same level of performance from one race to the next.

Add in that Camelot beat him in the Irish Derby in spite of non-ideal conditions and running somewhat flat. With all of this in mind, Born To Sea’s defeat seems irrelevant.

Using Born to Sea certainly has its limitations, but then, what else are we supposed to use as a form guide?

Nothing Camelot has beat has put up any significant performance. Given Camelot is likely to context only 1 race in his career outside of his own generation, we have to start looking for other ways to measure him.

Camelot is a talented horse whose peak ability is not known yet. Camelot is a strong example of why we should not overstate the accomplishments of winning percieved prestigious races (Derby for instance). These percieved races all have their ups and downs in standard, and must be assessed individually. As of today, Camelot and his racing substance does not meet the hype.

Derby runner-up Main Sequence runs in the Great Voltigeur this week and is favourite at about 3/1, with Sir Henry’s Thomas Chippendale/Noble Mission, Gosden’s Thought Worthy/Shantaram and Godolphin’s Encke the main challengers in the betting. Surely this will throw up a worthwhile formline and potential, much needed, boost for Camelot’s form.

Did anyone see Camelot’s workout at Leopardstown? I watched it but could only comment that I thought Fame and Glory was Denman, such was the burly look he had about him.

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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I am no further on really regarding stamina but nice to see him go in again. I note that, despite Richard Hannon stating that he wouldn’t take him on again with Sir Prancelot, they did exactly that!! Oh well, maybe he has learned his lesson now and will lower the sights a bit for his fellow.

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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I do not think he fully stretched at Goodwood and his slightly wayward course when he quickened was fair warning for those blinkered enough to take 1/7 about a horse running over a new distance and new going.

What price do you reckon he should be then?

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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to try and expose any lack of stamina in Frankel.

This assumes there is a lack of stamina. If there was the remotest chance of him not getting the trip he wouldn’t be a 1/7 shot.

It could be argued that being as big as 1/7 takes in to account that doubt, as if there were no doubt he’d probably be 1/20 as in the Sussex, Nic is after all, only rated 2lb higher than Farhh.

I think he should be 1/10 or shorter. I don’t think Nathaniel will run and if he does I don’t give him any chance on the line through Farhh. I will be looking for winning margin betting on the race and going for a big number of lengths. Sir Henry said months ago that he thought Frankel will be better for the step up in trip and it is easy to visualise some tired horses in behind going into the final furlong where Frankel could well draw away, even from Saint Nicholas Abbey (who I have never rated as highly as some people do).

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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I think after today’s run we can add Masked Marvel to the list. Pretty feeble efforts in all runs this season and why he was only about 3/1 or so today is a greater mystery than The Marie Celeste

Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

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