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Sure NW and CNC, I know this (bloody) interview.
The danger is indeed eminent, that Gosden wants to prepare Calyx’ exit from here.
If it was for honest reasons and for the sake of the horse, fair enough, but I am afraid
he just wants to keep them apart to protect his hype horse.
Then history would repeat, as he did similar mismanagement with Cracksman, but I am also still hoping it won’t happen like this, as it were anything but decent and fair sportsmenship
It couldn’t just be that Gosden is looking after Calyx for the best interests of the horse? Just as he looked after Cracksman for the best interests of the horse.
Value Is EverythingGinge, id tend to agree with you.
CNC, the positive comments early on, do you have them handy? Sorry I’m out at the moment.
What leads you to believe it’s that a trainer of that level doesn’t know when to start a horse training for the season?? He may not have stood up to trainin quite as well and needs time? With Gosdens record in the race, I wouldn’t be massively confident even if he did show up given its off the back of an injury!
Twitter: Jackh1092
Hindsight is 20/20 so make the most of it!Well even a trainer of that level (I don’t deny his world class at all) is only human and can make mistakes
CNC and NWalton, at least the last sentence in this interview has the potential to be hopeful:
“He will tell me when he is ready, whether that is in April or straight into May.”
I would appreciate it if “straight into May” would equal straight into the 2000 G, but we will see.Jack – the fact that Gosden has never won the 2000 Guineas could well indicate that Gosden doesn’t prepare his horses as early as other trainers. That seems a very reasonable working assumption to me.
I’ll try and find the quotes from his previous upbeat update. Don’t have them to hand at the moment.
Just found the quotes about Calyx from the 13th October…
“He’s in great form and just trotting and playing about at the moment [after suffering an injury earlier this season],” Gosden said. “It would be wonderful if they could [meet in the Guineas], Calyx seems very sound and happy now so let’s hope he comes back.”
The fact in October Gosden says Calyx is ‘very sound’ suggests he’s doing more than just looking after the horse. How much more sound can a horse be than ‘very’?
Gosden did think at the time, Calyx would miss the big backend 2-year-old races but should be fine in three months.Obviously has taken longer than he thought, which is no fault of the trainer
I’m just confused by his quotes on 13th October. If he is ‘in great form’ and not just sound but ‘very sound’ then why hasn’t he trained him in readiness for the first major classic of the year? Normally high quality horses who are ‘in great form’ and ‘very sound’ are trained for success.
Jack – the fact that Gosden has never won the 2000 Guineas could well indicate that Gosden doesn’t prepare his horses as early as other trainers. That seems a very reasonable working assumption to me.
I’ll try and find the quotes from his previous upbeat update. Don’t have them to hand at the moment.
Agreed that’s part of my reasoning for not fancying him even if he showed up here vs TDH.I would have thought if any horse was starting in the Greenham for Gosden it would’ve been Calyx given he’s never went further than 6F on the track. So that would be a worry for me straightaway.
Though for me, the fact that Teddy Grimthorpe is watching Calyx “every morning” i’d say they are both in agreement with what’s going on + it’s not just the trainer wanting to dodge another one of his horses.
PS thanks for finding i was at a pool match, but popped on here to see what was going on haha
Twitter: Jackh1092
Hindsight is 20/20 so make the most of it!https://gg.co.uk/news/headlines/calyx-pleasing-gosden-but-no-date-set-yet-for-return
Here is a version of the interview with JG and once again we are left to guess will he/won’t he.
it’s worse than Teresa May’s Brexit Deal. 
Gosden does this every year…because he can, he is looking after Prince Khalid’s interests and those of ALW and add to that the fact that TDH’s future at Stud is already assured surely he can afford to go easy on his star player, perhaps The Greenham and on to The Derby ..leaving the way for Calyx to have his Guineas run if he is sound but doubt, like others here he wants them to take each other on…
Jac 
Things turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out...Surly if Calyx was being trained for the guineas they would said by now. If you have a horse for that classic then you train them for it, you dont iffy and maybe about a race of that statue.
Calyx like persian king are by Kingsman a first season sire, it could be that they haven’t trained on as well as might of hoped so are giving them a little more time.
Jack – the fact that Gosden has never won the 2000 Guineas could well indicate that Gosden doesn’t prepare his horses as early as other trainers. That seems a very reasonable working assumption to me.
Which past Gosden 2000 Guineas candidate/s weren’t ready in time?
Value Is EverythingI think the point is fairly self explanatory to be honest – relative to other trainers Gosden leaves a bit to be worked on with his horses. If Gosden is such a great trainer, and I think most people would agree he is a very good trainer, and he is very determined to win a 2000 Guineas one might have expected him to achieved that by now. Lesser trainers have.
It suggests to me if doesn’t value the 2000 Guineas as much as other trainers, such as Aidan O’Brien – who has stallion fees to sharpen his mind. Therefore it it reasonable by assume by proxy of a lack of a winner that he doesn’t have his horses 100% for the Guineas but instead focuses on targets later in the season.
It’s not that he can’t get a horse ready it’s that he chooses not to compared to trainers.
Isn’t judging by a lone stat a bit simplistic, CNC?
Gosden has more top middle-distance horses than milers, but are you aware that he’s got a very good record in Guineas Trials?
Are you suggesting he wants to win the Trials but not the Guineas itself? Why would that be?
Why would Gosden get Kingman ready to put up one of the best performances we’ve seen in a Guineas Trial (good enough to win many a 2000 Guineas) – and then (if you’re right) not have him ready for the Guineas itself?
Gosden’s strike rate in the early months is often better than his overall strike rate.In truth, he hasn’t had many 2000 Guineas horses and the ones with good chances have both had good reasons why they didn’t win the Guineas/why they ran how they did. If wanting to judge Gosden on what he’s actually done with his Guineas horses – and what he’s done that time of year/at the meeting – take a look at my post on page 12 of this thread.
Value Is EverythingI think you’d agree it is clearly easier to win a Guineas Trial than the Guineas itself. One can probably afford to have a horse less than 100% fit and still win a trial.
As for relying up one stat: it’s not really one though is it? I believe Gosden starting training in the UK in about 1990 so he has clearly a maximum of 29 opportunities to win the Guineas. Realistically, it takes time to get oneself up to speed in the training ranks, so even if it took him 10 years to get his yard in a situation where he could attract Guineas quality horses he still had 19 opportunities to win a Guineas and hasn’t hence nineteen opportunities not one.
I agree with you to pick out a single horse as an example and to base an argument on that would be simplistic but 19 years worth of horses is entirely different. Hence I’m not sure engaging you on the Kingman example will be fruitful given my last point.
I will take a look at your post on page 12 shortly.
CNC-
I presume to find out if that example is fair, one would need to look at the 19 races + see what he had running in them…
Gosden does this every year…because he can, he is looking after Prince Khalid’s interests and those of ALW and add to that the fact that TDH’s future at Stud is already assured surely he can afford to go easy on his star player, perhaps The Greenham and on to The Derby ..leaving the way for Calyx to have his Guineas run if he is sound but doubt, like others here he wants them to take each other on… Jac Jac,
let me get this straight you want a trainer to run a horse like Calyx who is coming back from a long layoff after having run over 6fs twice in the Guineas over a horse that is fit + ready and has proven himself over the distance? This is getting silly if you ask me. No one on here has a clue how ready Calyx is, Mr Grimthorpe has been watching him daily, so i’d say if he was disgruntled it wouldn’t take much to change that. He obviously isn’t. Coming off a layoff, the horse will need examined after work to make sure no signs of the past injury are there, he won’t be as easy to get fit straightaway. Yet, to make this forum happy he should run him over TDH Twitter: Jackh1092
Hindsight is 20/20 so make the most of it!
it’s worse than Teresa May’s Brexit Deal. 
Jac 
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