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reet hard wrote:
The full article is on the RP website now.
I still find it hard to believe that a jockey of Culhane’s standing can have his whole career threatened for doing no more than jockeys have done for centuries. There is no question of any dishonesty in his actions, yet it is still seen as a victory for racing’s integrity? If racing had real integrity, these guys would have nothing to pass on in the first place.
MickyMo73 repies:
I really couldn’t agree more to be honest. When I read the full article I was thinking to myself, “well what’s he done”. He is a jockey and he has passed info to his family and friends more likely regarding the chances of his rides. Does this mean that when ATR interview a jockey on the ‘Geton’ show and the jockey thinks that he will win on such and such a horse, this is then passing on information? Where do you draw the line?I despair. 32 out of the 37 horses in question were laid to lose or not be placed.
When have you ever heard a jockey on ATR or anywhere in public say:
“Trust me. This horse won’t win today even though it’s favourite. I suggest you all lay it”.The answer to your question is NEVER.
But please tell me what is wrong with Culhane telling his family that he doesnt think the horse will win so he suggests they lay the horse.
In fact, as long as Culhane rode the horse to the best possible placing (and it hasn’t been proved that he didn’t), then I will still ask what has he done wrong?
OK, judging by what people have said Culhane is upto more bad than good, but purely speaking on the reason he has been suspended, if he has told familiy and friends that he doesn’t think his horse will win, and he has given the horse the best possible ride without winning, then what is wrong with that?
MM
With an over-round of about 26% on a 4-runner race, I think my first reaction would be no bet. Might be difficult to lay those prices.
Rob
Lol, compare that to Ladbrokes and then you will be coming back and saying I am generous lol.
Mike
I love your signature Basronic. I take it your a big Zafonic fan, just like myself.
Those words you quote were from the brilliant Graham Goode if I am not mistaken. But for me his most famous words where when the horse was just about to take up the running in the 2.000 Guineas;
"And Zafonic is pulling double, he is absolutely pulling double"
I loved that comment, I loved that race, I loved the performance, I loved the commentary – brilliant.
Mike
I’m with the Shadow on this one, I’ve been on the wrong end of more than one dubious (in my opinion) Culhane ride in my time.
Just more than one lol. Yes I have been on the back end of some very dodgy Culhane rides, but as I don’t know the guy personally or know anyone who knows him, then I guess I am just going by what is printed on why he has been suspended. A guess that’s a bit naive of me with knowing what actually goes on.
Mike
Need I start?? Not sure what I can get away with as far as libellous postings go so can’t be as to the point as I would like to be but needless to say Culhane couldn’t lay straight in bed. Only passing on information to his family for no reward? Do me a bloody favour – do we all look completely stupid??
That’s fair enough if you know something we or I don’t.
But if he has been given a 12 month suspension for giving information to his family then why is that so bad?
It’s pointless having this conversation because we don’t know what info he has passed on, but all I am saying if his information is to say that he thinks so and so will win then is that really bad. If he has been banned for something else as then why the hell don’t they come out and tell us exactly what he has been banned for instead of letting people speculate.
I know a jockey who got told he must not win on a horse because the price was too big and the connections couldn’t get enough money on without it looking suspicious. He was an apprentice at the time and he was told that if he didn’t ‘stop’ the horse he would never ride for the stable again. Imagine being told that as a young apprentice trying to make your way in the game. Needless to say, he stopped the horse and it then bolted up next time when the money was down.
What I am trying to say here is that it’s often the connections who know exactly what the horse is capable off and it’s often them who can start of the ‘passing of info’, and not always the jockeys.
Hang on fellas, that is what he claims he has done. Twelve months is getting off exceptionally lightly for Culhane, he is damn lucky to only have got that. Twelve months is a disgrace IMO, he should have got three years minimum.
What should he have got 3 years for?
What do you know that I don’t?
The full article is on the RP website now.
I still find it hard to believe that a jockey of Culhane’s standing can have his whole career threatened for doing no more than jockeys have done for centuries.
There is no question of any dishonesty in his actions, yet it is still seen as a victory for racing’s integrity? If racing had real integrity, these guys would have nothing to pass on in the first place.I really couldn’t agree more to be honest. When I read the full article I was thinking to myself, "well what’s he done". He is a jockey and he has passed info to his family and friends more likely regarding the chances of his rides. Does this mean that when ATR interview a jockey on the ‘Geton’ show and the jockey thinks that he will win on such and such a horse, this is then passing on information? Where do you draw the line?
It appears that both Tony Culhane (12 months) and Dean Mernagh (9 months) have been suspended from race riding for (in Culhanes case) "aiding or abetting individuals to lay or back horses with the benefit of information" and (in Mernagh’s case) "breach of rule 243, which was for communicating inside information to certain parties for gain of some form of reward".
I must stress that neither jockey has been suspended for fixing races.
Mike
I agree SC, Appleby didn’t choke he just played poorly. The conditions weren’t that great with some strong winds (though not as fierce as in the US Seniors lol), though you would have thought Appleby could play well with wind. I just think the same as you, he played well for 3 rounds but couldn’t maintain it on the last day, that’s why, like Figgo says, he should be watched, because when Appleby does string it together he is a real force. But Like I say, he is a streaky player and will only play at his peak for around 6 weeks – but it wont be suprising to see him win a few times in that period.
Yes Monty did me a good turn yesterday. I actually had slightly more riding on Fasth but my heart wanted Monty to win so that has to be a first for me – my hear ruling before my wallet lol. No doubt I will be backing him this week at Loch Lomond and no doubt I will be backing Fasth again if he plays. I havent seen the field yet or the prices, but if Monty and Fasth do play and they are anywhere near the 20/1 mark I would be foolish not to back them each way again.
I will have a look at the field tomorrow and post my selections on Wednesday, but I know Goosen likes it around there, and because of his racent form he might be worth a bet if the odds are any value. It will be interesting to see if any Americans play in the event as I am sure most of them will be over here now trying to get used to the British weather and trying to get a low down on Carnoustie.
Speak soon,
Mike
I don’t think an apology is required. His view just seems very myopic. Monty’s problem isn’t his putter, it’s that pig-stubborn head of his. When he takes the huff, the putter instantly becomes his enemy. We’ve all seen this more times than we care to mention over the years, and he was simply having another spell of it prior to last week.
On a slightly tangencial point: Monty may have proved that he can still win, but do you think his chance of that elusive major has now gone?
Monty’s chance of that elusive major has most certainly gone in my opinion, but I would love to be wrong of course. The only time I have fancied him for a major recently was the 2005 Open when he was playing well leading up to the tournament and it was in his backyard (St Andrews). If only Tiger Woods wasn’t in the field that week lol.
I wouldn’t have given Monty any chance of winning the US Open last year but I was almost delighted to be proved wrong, but he played the worst ‘under pressure’ shot of his career as he fully admits. Judging by his latest form though, and back in Scotland, then I really think that this Open must surely be his last serious chance of winning a major, but as we all know, it’s his attitude that can sometimes get the better of his brilliant play.
I think a person like Monty deserves to win a major for what he has done in the game. We all know about his achievements on the course, 8 Order Of Merits, his Ryder Cup record, not forgetting his countless runner spots in majors etc. But Monty does a hell of a lot off the course in terms of ‘giving back to the game’. He is involved with numerous charities and fund raising events and he really is a lovely personality. His personality on the course is completely different to off it, what you see on the course is just a will to win to the extreme that does go over the top – we all know that, but I dare say we would all love to see him win a major.
Mike
With respect to these recent comments about all sorts of golfers being bottle-merchants, I think you have to put things into context. In football, you have only a split second to think of your next move. In tennis it’s 10 seconds tops. In golf it’s the best part of 5 minutes, and if you hit the front early it can be 24 hours of contemplation. That must be bloody difficult, even for the most mentally sound competitor. In saying that, I think Adam Scott is a serious nervous wreck when it comes to the crunch.
I’m looking very much forward to the Open and at this early stage, I’m looking at Stuart Appleby for a top 5, or top 10 at least. Good show in the Masters, made an Open playoff in 2002 and is having a good week at Congressional.
Appleby is a ‘streaky’ player, a guy who must be followed when he is in form as he will quickly rack up 2 or 3 tournament wins in a short space of time. Appleby looked to becoming back to somewhere near his best but his final round last night has to be very worrying.
I have to admit that this years Open has me baffled. Apart from being very confident of a good showing from Niklas Fasth, I don’t really have any other strong fancies. A few years ago I couldn’t see Monty not contending at St Andrews and I backed him accordingly, so I was delighted to see him finish 2nd to Tiger. I mention that because I am getting the same feeling again about Monty. He will be back in his home country and his tee to green over the last 2 weeks has been majestic, himself admitting "I know exactly where the ball is going". But two years ago I backed him each way at 100/1, this year I guess he will be much shorter after his recent form so he may not be value.
I’ve already backed Fasth at bigger odds than he is currently trading at and I will probably back Monty regardless of the price becuase I would hate not to be on him if he ever won that 1st major. So my selections at this moment would be 2 each way bets on Fasth and Monty. I have a strong feeling that Els will go well, and so too could Geoff Ogilvy who plays difficult courses very well. Well, thats 4 selections so I better stop now lol.
Mike
Not sure about their achievements on the court, but those 2 lads could seriously do with a decent hair stylist.
Mike
I think it would be hard of me to say any of them are annoying. I love watching the racing, whether its on the BBC, Ch4, ATR or RUK and without the presenters the shows wouldn’t happen.
It’s hard to fault some of the Ch4 presenters as they have done it for such a long time, and the same comments can apply to BBC in a sense. I much prefer ATR’s presenters and their coverage to the Racing UK’s efforts and I have to agree witht the above that Sir Bob is wonderful entertainments. Some of his chats with Norma MaCauley were brilliant television. I like Jason Weaver on ATR also, he is becoming very accomplished. The only thing I would say negative against anyone would be the way Matt Chapman is always referring to ‘smut’ lol, it sounds as though the guy hasn’t had a decent night with a woman for a long time lol.
Mike
Monty 1st
Fasth 2ndThankfully this result salvaged my ‘sports betting’ weekend lol.
Mike
Hi SC
Yes I may have gone over the top with describing Adam Scott as a bottler, but I would say that most of the tournaments he has won from the front have been in far less company than the ones he has lost from the front. I know Butch Harmon thinks he is a wonderful player and you have to respect his opinion, but for me he is just not a betting proporsition until he can regularly contend at the highest level.
One thing you will notice when it comes to betting on big tournaments is that they are generally priced up in relations to their world ranking, regardless of how well they are currently playing. For example Woods will be favourite, Mickelson 2nd fav, Furyk 3rd fav, Singh and Scott high in the betting, along with Goosen. Goosen is a perfect example, he is always around the 20/1, 25/1 mark for the major events, yet his form over the last 18 months would warrant him to be at least 50/1 in my opinion, if not bigger.
Regards The Open, well I think if you go on current form it’s impossible not to back Niklas Fasth each way – in fact I already have backed him at very big odds. He is currently leading the European Open at the K Club but there is a weather delay, but his 4th in the US Open, then his win in Germany and his form this week despite having a heavy cold puts him up there as probably the in form golfer out of everyone.
Tiger Woods is a wonderful golfer but I am always against him at the odds, he is just always too short in the betting. After his 1st round of 3 over in this weeks A & T he was not even in the top 100, yet he was priced at 7/1 before the 2nd round, absolutely ridiculous, whether he goes on to win the tournament or not. I am a massive Colin Montgomerie fan and I am delighted to see his form over the last 2 weeks and I will definitely be having an each way bet on him also, but for him its between the ears with regards his winning chance.
I don’t think a European has won a Major since Paul Lawrie so you would have to worry about that and go for some non Europeans, and at the moment I am struggling to put up any selections but I will closer to the time. I am fed up of backing the likes of Luke Donald in Major’s so no doubt he will come good when I am not on.
But as for now, my main selection would be Niklas Fasth each way, but I will select more nearer the time. Right now I am going to watch the remainder of the European Open and hope that either Fasth can hang on to his lead or Monty can win as those are my 2 bets this week (I mentioned it on the main racing forum).
All the best,
Mike
Without a shadow of a doubt I prefer NH. The Cheletenham Festival is just one of the sporting events of the whole calendar in my opinion, but then again Royal Ascot is for those who love flat.
You asked for a reason why we prefer what we do. One of the main reasons I prefer NH is because the horses are round a lot longer. You can follow a top class horse from a 4 year old right through to a 14 year old. Just look at horses like Spot The Difference, absolutely remarkable in my opinion.
Then you have horses like Istabraq and Best Mate who win their main even 3 times and could have went on to win a few more if not for injury, fatality, foot and mouth etc. Apart from sprinters on the flat, you very rarely get to see a horse go more than 5 or 6 seasons in that sphere, but as long as they stay injury free, they can be there for what seems forever over the jumps.
Mike
Why label those you are referring to as "the Irish" Reet Hard? Only three of the horses (Authorized, George and Yellowstone) who competed are Irish; five of the jockeys who rode in the race are Irish. You’re referring to the O’Brien horses, and I think it’s preferable for everybody that you refer to them simply as that.
Bringing nationality into a wonderful event like yesterday’s Eclipse is beyond moronic, shameful, and has no place on a forum of this calibre. I think the clever thing to do is edit your post substituting "The Irish" with "The O’Brien stable".
A look through many of your previous posts indicates that you’re inclined to agree with any vaguely anti-Irish stance, Clivex.
Lol, come on guys, lighten up.
I hardly think he needs to edit his post simply because he used the phrase ‘the irish’. For crying out loud the term ‘the irish’ is referred all the time.
Even the bookies price up markets like "how many winners will the irish have"? Are you saying they need to re-phrase this and say how many winners will the combined stables of O’Brien, Bolger, Wachman,Weld, Oxx, Lyons, Stack etc have?
Yesterday there were 4 English trained runners and 4 Irish trained runners, so there is absolutley nothing wrong with the term ‘the irish’ when referring to O’Briens horses. In fact I think I heard the saying at least 10 times yesterday on Racing UK.
I think it’s time to put the Eclipse behind us now, me included.
Mike
