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All the people I know who criticised the choice said it was because they believed that he would put Denman on the floor because his style wouldn’t sit with the horse, and it didn’t.
Ok, personally I’ve never been a fan of AP, but I adore Denman and if I thought he was right for the horse I’d have been happy enough. But he’s just not somehow. Remember, Hen Knight once said he wasn’t right for Best Mate; there’s a big difference between being the "best jockey" and the "best jockey for the horse".
Exactly! You wouldn’t say Culloty was a McCoy or a Walsh but he was the right jock for Best Mate.
Anyone wanting AP McCoy to **** up today got just that and more,he couldn"t have made a more spectacular exit if he"d tried! The first mistake was forgiveable,but he should have given Denman time to recover,instead he went for a bigger than big one and that is what caused the horse to fall! Denman was a tired horse when he made the first mistake,irrelevant of what his weight was prior to the race,he was an unfit horse! Connections thought (including Ruby) he could still have won even if AP fell and remounted,maybe tongue in cheek but no way was that the Denman that is unbeaten around Newbury!I have supported Sam from day 1 but not even he would have won on Denman today,he would have still been beaten even if he had stood up! Poor show all round!
I’ve been on AP’s case but i think the mistake that got rid of him was the horse not having got his marbles back and being too brave. I don’t think AP had a say in the matter.
Most of you will know I’ve never been Denman’s most ardent fan although I was one of the very few who said he would come back and come back he did.
Now we have some people saying again he is finished and other blaming Tony McCoy.
I doubt unless he’s injured if that race will have set Denman back 1" and as far as Tony McCoy is concerned I’ve never read so much dribble in all my life. He took a pull he changed his mind……wtf do these people get these ideas from? do you actually watch the racing or do you do make it up as you go along.
When I watched the race I remarked to me friend on the first circuit he wasn’t travelling at all well. Tony was having to ride him to get him to stride on and that shouldn’t have been the case against that lot. Fence after fence he was also having to get him to come up which again is not the usual for Denman.
I’d say without a shadow of a doubt Denman would not have won today even if he hadn’t made that mistake then fell at the next. As far as the mistake goes I’d say AP felt him going and didn’t want to push him into the fence and the big horse put down on him. He did exactly the same thing last season when tiring did he not?
I’d say he was slightly fitter as he was when he took on MDB at Kempton but that horse was no where near 100% today.
I believe the man to blame is PN he does this so often with his horses before the big one. He tries to get them there just fit enough to win and that’s it. He doesn’t have the Henderson knack for it IMO and very often gets it wrong like he has and almost has with Kauto in the past.
I doubt if this will make any difference to what happens in the Gold Cup other than Denman fans getting a bigger price
Your entitled to your opinion of course, but it doesn’t mean your right.
It’s simple for me – McCoy is not presenting a horse well at a fence this season and he’s the last man i’d want to book . Today he showed it with his indecision. If AP couldn’t decide whether to go long or short what chance did the poor horse have?
Aren’t i clever ? I said "he gets them undecided and they lose confidence" !
He gave Denman the idea they were going long then changed his mind and decided to leave him to get in close. The horse got mixed messages and couldn’t get his feet up in time . Great jockey he WAS . Take my advice and don’t back him over fences and put Skelton,Schofield or anybody on Denman in the Gold Cup.
Hello everybody.
Whilst I feel desperately sorry for Sam I am starting to get very excited about seeing AP ride the big horse.
Owners have hard decisions to make,and they have to do what is best for the horse.
They know what they want and they know the horse better than most of us.
Racing isn’t a popularity contest,it’s about trying to do the right thing to enhance your chances of winning.
AP and Denman doesn’t sound too bad does it?I read somewhere that some punters think AP can’t present a horse properly at a fence.
Such statement make me shudder and wonder what sport people are watching.
It’s little wonder there are so many rich layers out there.Shudder away, that’s me. I’ve seen it so many times this season that it can’t be a coincidence. He gets them undecided then they lose confidence. It’s coming to the point where if he’s on my fancy i’m not going to bet in the race.
Two winners in the last 14 days at 1-4 and 1-7.
I know he’s 14 times champion but recently i regard McCoy being on a horse i fancy as a negative.
I’m not saying the following would have won but again i backed 2 of his that were favs and disappointed – Killyglen and Song of Songs.
Killyglen a lovely jumper started making mistakes and was pulled up and Song of Songs who was given too much to do. It’s not sour grapes cos i had 3 good winners on the day.
You only have to watch others like Geraghty, Lee ,Maguire etc. to see the difference. There are so many good young jocks around too – look at Griffiths and Skelton today.
I’ve got a theory with McCoy – back him on hurdlers but not chasers.
Yet again a sound jumper jumped appalling with the man on board, namely Will Be Done at Ascot. I should have known better.
Didn’t he win a Thomas Pink (or whatever) and a Hennessy in the same year?
Shame he had so many problems after.
Lovely big horse that Mad Max. Apart from the obvious Party Politics what would you say were other unusually big horses?
I’ll offer up French Holly…
If he jumps well ,which i assume he does judging by his fixed brush run, then he might only need one chase run before Cheltenham.
Fair enough the gallops were frozen but Me Voici and Reve de Sivola both won so unless Diamond Harry was more affected then it’s safe to assume that as was thought, he isn’t likely to be a top-notch hurdler and should go chasing now – which is what they are doing. Can’t wait.
I’d like to say well done to Haydock for trying to get racing on before all the know-it-alls put the boot in.
We have two camps here: the ones who think every horse should be trying to win every race it runs in , and the ones who think that some trainers work on the principle that they’re not machines and do what will benefit in the longrun.
But i digress as that’s not the point of this thread so could someone give a brief synopsis of what the RUK were saying as it’s only been hinted at so far.
There’s lies , damn lies and statistics.
I refer you the last line of my previous post.
I’ve looked at your figures and they show a trend…so what.
That’s knowledge you’ve got there, like knowing that Brennan wins on Tom George’s horses . It’s one piece in a huge jigsaw.
McCririck is a big stats man does that make him a great judge ? Different trainers have different training methods and we have to gather knowledge about the way they operate and apply it.
“In the case of Kellystown Lad , in a post race interview Murphy said that since getting him from the pointing field he had to teach him to settle and that was the reason for the two unplaced efforts previously. “
How do other trainers manage to get their ex-pointers to learn to settle? You don’t see too many wild mustangs making their first start under Rules for Paul Nicholls. It should be borne in mind that this horse had actually managed to win three points in Ireland (when racing prominently on each occasion), so the excuse seems a bit thin on this occasion.
So Murphy’s either a bad trainer or a liar or both.
Ah opinion’s a wonderful thing.
