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.
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Now watch your diabetes Ginge
Am well controlled at the moment Ghost.
Value Is EverythingPlease! A little tension is good but this is all getting a bit much. No offence to those concerned.
Please! A little tension is good but this is all getting a bit much. No offence to those concerned.
There is no "tension" on my part okjoe.
Value Is EverythingPlease! A little tension is good but this is all getting a bit much. No offence to those concerned.
Apologies for any offence caused Joe. There is no tension, I’m just telling it the way I see it in as simple terms as I can in order that it might get through.
It is not nice to be accused of lying, particularly when the person involved hasn’t got their own facts straight first, and are quoting amended figures to make their supposed point.
As I have said, I am not a follower of Timeform but I had a ball-park figure in my mind based on a Timeform rating I saw for Big Time not long after the Railway Stakes, and it was as near as damn it the same as the official rating at the time.
Checking back on it now it was on the Darley website that I saw the Timeform rating and it is on the page where they discuss their stallions and they reported that:-
"Kheleyf’s two-year-olds continue to impress, with his son Big Time allotted a rating of 108p following his impressive maiden victory followed by a close second in the G2 Railway Stakes."
Timeform now rate Big Time on 118, so even a poor manager of numerals can look at a 1/2 length margin with Sudirman on both occasions and work out that the improvement needed by the old protagonists from the Railway Stakes to The Phoenix Stakes, based on the original ratings for the Railway race, was not, as some deranged badger might claim, 2lbs.
Certain posters on forums never have the backbone to admit when they have made a mistake and quoted the amended figures as the original ratings, preferring instead to waffle on and try to discredit other posters
Timeform have actually gone back and admitted they got their figures wrong in assessing the Railway Stakes first time round. They have upgraded the figures so that they now show that Big Time and Sudirman had less improvement to make than they first thought. That is all very well in admitting they made an error in the first assessment and correcting it to show an overall more accurate record of a horse’s progression, however it does mean that their figures for the race in question
before
the Phoenix Stakes showed that the 1-2 needed to make good improvement to defeat War Command.
So don’t worry about it Joe, there’s no tension, just a robust distancing from one humble punter to another with a rather self absorbed and inflated ego and to whom hubris is a byword.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Q. What’s the difference between a blue tit and the ginger tit?
A. the ginger tit used too much fake tan lotion.
Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
As I said Steve,
on the whole
I think your
racing knowledge is very good
, usually enjoy a debate with you because you
know so much
. (Sorry you don’t feel the same). But when it comes to 2 year old maiden form – I think you’ve
something to learn
. It’s only my opinion mate and such a small area of horse racing,
not worth you getting so worked up about
. However, please Steve, when talking about others – please get your facts right in future.
Mark[/color]
Possibly the most patronising/condescending paragraph I’ve ever read on this forum. Damning with faint praise with the use of ‘on the whole’ is especially belittling.
Complete bull…. Andrew.
I use the same phrase about myself.
"On the whole"
I have a
very good racing knowledge
,
something to learn
about some aspect or another. I could do with being better at "conformation".
not worth me getting worked up about
.
I must stop being so patronising/condescending towards myself.
I meant every word of that paragraph Andrew, so don’t go looking for any xxxxxxx hidden meaning to any of the words!
How the xxxx can it be "Damning with faint praise" to say that "on the whole" someone’s "racing knowledge is very good" and that they "know so much" about the game?Now me being the biggest target for your abusive behaviour allows me to say that its not big and its not funny being a patronising prat.Stick to backing half the horses in training,you have single-handedly found a niche market there and a profitable one…..’On the whole’!
Timeform have actually gone back and admitted they got their figures wrong in assessing the Railway Stakes first time round. They have upgraded the figures so that they now show that Big Time and Sudirman had less improvement to make than they first thought. That is all very well in admitting they made an error in the first assessment and correcting it to show an overall more accurate record of a horse’s progression, however it does mean that their figures for the race in question
before
the Phoenix Stakes showed that the 1-2 needed to make good improvement to defeat War Command.
But that is not what you actually said was it Steve?
You said,
“We are supposed to believe that this horse finished 6 1/2 lengths behind Sudirman, then didn’t improve next time, then he magically improves third time to finish almost exactly the same distance behind Sudirman. This is no doubt this assumption was made so that they can give credibility to THEIR THEORY THAT SUDIRMAN HAD TO MAKE GOOD IMPROVEMENT TO BEAT WAR COMMAND, it just wouldn’t do that War Command might have been disappointing"
.
“Their theory”
was NOT that
“Sudirman had to make good improvement to beat War Command”
.
“Their theory”
was the Railway Stakes can now be rated higher. So Sudirman did NOT need to make
“good improvement”
. Claiming that Sudirman has been rated as making
“good improvement”
is NOT true.
Had you not mentioned a
“theory…”
, why mention a
"theory"
if all you are talking about are ratings BEFORE the race? And instead made it CLEAR you were talking about BEFORE the race, there would have been no confusion. Your comments (in the same sentence) about
"it wouldn’t do that War Command might have been disappointing"
leaves no doubt (
AS IT WAS WRITTEN
) you were talking about AFTER the race Steve.
If it is a mistake in translating of what you wanted to write and writing, then fair enough? It is a bit nonsensical in places as it is,
“This is no doubt this assumption was made”
. Anyway, it is now agreed, Timeform’s rating changed because of the new evidence (the one/two going on to finish first and second in the Phoenix) and that they did NOT rate Sudirman as making “good improvement”, just 2 lbs.
However, you also said about Timeform’s opinion of War Command’s Phoenix display:
“it just wouldn’t do that War Command might have been disappointing”
. Yet Timeform WERE disappointed, even using the word “TAME” to describe his effort. So how did your misreading of that happen? Admit it Steve, you did make that one up.
Can’t really see it can be construed as anything else…I can only
judge from what is SAID
and not how a person
means to say it
Steve. But hey, if you are now saying that you did not mean the post how it was written, then for the benefit of the forum I am willing to withdraw the comment about “making it up”. Hows that as a compromise?
Value Is EverythingTimeform have actually gone back and admitted they got their figures wrong in assessing the Railway Stakes first time round. They have upgraded the figures so that they now show that Big Time and Sudirman had less improvement to make than they first thought. That is all very well in admitting they made an error in the first assessment and correcting it to show an overall more accurate record of a horse’s progression, however it does mean that their figures for the race in question
before
the Phoenix Stakes showed that the 1-2 needed to make good improvement to defeat War Command.
But that is not what you actually said was it Steve?
You said,
“We are supposed to believe that this horse finished 6 1/2 lengths behind Sudirman, then didn’t improve next time, then he magically improves third time to finish almost exactly the same distance behind Sudirman. This is no doubt this assumption was made so that they can give credibility to THEIR THEORY THAT SUDIRMAN HAD TO MAKE GOOD IMPROVEMENT TO BEAT WAR COMMAND, it just wouldn’t do that War Command might have been disappointing"
.
“Their theory”
was NOT that
“Sudirman had to make good improvement to beat War Command”
.
“Their theory”
was the Railway Stakes can now be rated higher. So Sudirman did NOT need to make
“good improvement”
. Claiming that Sudirman has been rated as making
“good improvement”
is NOT true.
Had you not mentioned a
“theory…”
, why mention a
"theory"
if all you are talking about are ratings BEFORE the race? And instead made it CLEAR you were talking about BEFORE the race, there would have been no confusion. Your comments (in the same sentence) about
"it wouldn’t do that War Command might have been disappointing"
leaves no doubt (
AS IT WAS WRITTEN
) you were talking about AFTER the race Steve.
If it is a mistake in translating of what you wanted to write and writing, then fair enough? It is a bit nonsensical in places as it is,
“This is no doubt this assumption was made”
. Anyway, it is now agreed, Timeform’s rating changed because of the new evidence (the one/two going on to finish first and second in the Phoenix) and that they did NOT rate Sudirman as making “good improvement”, just 2 lbs.
However, you also said about Timeform’s opinion of War Command’s Phoenix display:
“it just wouldn’t do that War Command might have been disappointing”
. Yet Timeform WERE disappointed, even using the word “TAME” to describe his effort. So how did your misreading of that happen? Admit it Steve, you did make that one up.
Can’t really see it can be construed as anything else…I can only
judge from what is SAID
and not how a person
means to say it
Steve. But hey, if you are now saying that you did not mean the post how it was written, then for the benefit of the forum I am willing to withdraw the comment about “making it up”. Hows that as a compromise?
This it trolling Ginger. You are just repeating the same thing over and over in an attempt to belittle me and to inflate your own sense of importance.
I will save you the trouble of dealing with my criticism of Timeform. This is my last post on this forum. Please delete my account moderators.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
You certainly like ending a post with a bit of drama Steve. In this thread alone:
“Write something cogent that gives this forum an opportunity to consider why you are correct in your opinion and prove that the above parties are indeed talking rubbish.
The gauntlet is down, will you pick it up”?“If you are not going to bring anything other than a number to attempt to prove your point, the matter is closed as far as I am concerned”.
“A very narrow minded view and I leave you to it”.
“Roger and out”!!
“As they say on Dragon’s Den, "For that reason, I’m out".
“As far as I am concerned you are a complete tit and that IS the end of this discussion”.
But it wasn’t the “end”…
The Biggest one of all.
I hope you come back to us Steve, but I wish you luck in your new job as scriptwriter on Eastenders.
I’ve offered to withdraw the offending words, if that’s not enough for you, all I can say is you’re easily offended.Value Is Everything“Their theory”
was the Railway Stakes can now be rated higher.
The above is not a theory. The above is an action that could be taken in response to a theory. For clarity, would you care to state the theory instead.
This it trolling Ginger. You are just repeating the same thing over and over in an attempt to belittle me and to inflate your own sense of importance.
Tactic’s of the Ginger police when he takes you in for questioning I’m afraid Steve and if ginger does not break you with this he will put you in a padded cell and repeatedly spout out the odds percentage table. Best thing you can do is say no comment and try and get TAPK as your solicitor.
Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
If only you knew what I turned down and recommended you for Nathan.
Value Is EverythingI will save you the trouble of dealing with my criticism of Timeform. This is my last post on this forum. Please delete my account moderators.
Steve has drifted out to 10/1 for this years poster of the year awards. I’m taking a chance Matron will not read this post thus not deleted Steve’s account and take the 10’s in a chance Steve will be back and then lay the bet off in early December when Steve is 3.24 jt 2nd favourite.
Now that’s foresight…….Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
If only you knew what I turned down and recommended you for Nathan.
If it’s anything to do with moderation then your banned Ginge.
Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
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