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When I read the title, I wondered how you intended to stifle the many yawns likely to occur as a result of this thread…
Personally, I can’t wait until Auteuil and the emergence of the juvenile hurdlers followed by the actual jumps season and I wouldn’t attend a free admittance flat meeting taking place across the road unless I had a very good reason. I’ll keep a vague interest in Frankel and maybe go to Doncaster if Camelot is on for the triple crown. But by and large, I’m not really interested in the flat. So in the meantime, I will spend some time abroad, watch the Tour De France, watch the Euros and try to get my dick wet. What I’m not going to do is go out of my own way to bemoan the flat season for those who really enjoy it as that just wouldn’t be gracious.
I have suggested that you’re a troll but I’m not positive on that one. I mean your emergence came about after another was booted but I just don’t think you’re sophisticated enough for that. I would suggest you’re intellectually retarded but you’ve demonstrated that you’re somewhat well read. I’m quite sure though that you are emotionally retarded. The timing and content of your posts suggest you have issues with alcohol and gambling and your constant (admittedly successful) cries for attention suggest that there are several things missing in your life and your acting out is an attempt to fulfil your insecurities or at the very least distract you from them.
So I propose that you take a step away from the computer, go a month without watching any horse racing, stay away from the bookies and unravel something about yourself. Get to know your family. Talk to somebody who could develop into that someone special. Learn how to play an instrument or take up a language. Explore the world… it is full of discovery! You’re a long time dead my friend and you could be so much happier than you are today.
Or not… I don’t really care what you do from here as this will be the last time I respond to one of your cries
I’ve got a healthy sex life, thank you. As for the rest: gold medal for pomposity! Well done. Hope you get your dick wet.
Let’s go through your points one by one Prof.
"The form is all over the place".
Really? Buy a good form book Prof, you might not find it as difficult then.
"the eternal 2 year old to 3 year old improvment problem".
Is it that bad? There are things to look out for. (Simplified) Small 2 year olds often don’t train on. Big 2 year olds often improve greatly. Get Timeform, thre’ll take the "p" and "P"s (show you the ones likely to improve).
"the whole all-weather complication stirred in".
Stick to the better quality racing and there’s not much all-weather form to worry about. And when there is I don’t have much trouble.
"all-weather racing is basically *****CENSORED BY THE JOCKEY CLUB*****".
I gather that is somehow supposed to mean it’s bent. Well don’t bet on it then if you feel that way. Amount of skulduggery is greatly exaggerated by losing punters. What goes on is usually in the lowest grades, therefore is easily sidestepped by any punter.
"Middle East crap that no punter I know is interested in; too much guesswork, too little hard info".
If there’s too little form to go on then don’t bet. But I am "interested in it Prof
so you know one punter that is. Just one bet, one winner (Cirrus Des Aigles). Had I had two it would’ve been another winner (Cityscape)."odds on favourites, weird turn-ups".
If there are odds-on favs that get beaten, then surely a punter can get good value winners?
"You can’t bet confidently and anyone who says they do is telling pork pies".
Then I guess I must be telling porkie pies.
Stop this "I can’t make a profit, so nobody can make a profit" crap. Take a look at my flat thread in DLAP. Bets in 12 races so far this season, 7 winners (5 main bet winners). I’ve even increased stakes recently, so no lack of confidence here. Of course there are things to take in to consideration at this time of year. Be selective; look for trainers in form; horses with a good record after a long break (if on reappearance) etc."A month in, and I’m bored by it. I had Rougement (guess) and Colonel Mak (Form study) and about two others".
I’d get bored with it Prof, if I didn’t have enough winners.
"it’s hard work considering the sheer volume of racing".
Consider specialising. Find out what type of racing suits you. May be ignore the Class 4 and worse? If sprints aren’t your thing cut them out too. Then you’ll have more time to study and only need to watch a smaller amount of racing.
"The thought of doing any Flat form study makes your heart sink. As I understand it, we, the paying punters are supposed to be jumping for joy at this mess. Well, I ain’t".
If it’s that bad then may be it’s time to find something else to do Prof. If you don’t enjoy studying the form, then you’re unlikely to be in the right frame of mind to find winners.
"Is anyone really excited at the prospect of the Guineas or the classics? As a spectacle maybe, but as a betting opp? I’d rather sort out the winner of a class 3 chase in the depths of winter".
Then you have got it bad. I can’t wait. Love punting on this and every Classic. The ground question just makes it even more interesting. May be you should just pack up the Flat form books and concentrate on Jumps Prof.
You do get a
"sporting chance of winning"
on the flat. Just got to be good enough to take it.
"At the start of the Flat I find myself watching the depressing sight of horses going backwards, and wagers going down by a nose and all that. Having losing runs that simply would not happen on the jumps. It’s boring and annoying. It is only my opinion. Maybe it has to be this way, I don’t know".
Oh God, you’re even beginning to depress me now.
It’ll happen over the jumps too. Might be "boring and annoying"
Prof, but even knowledgeable punters go through losing runs now and again.
"What I do know is, you will never find new fans on what March and April have to offer. Never".
Probably gets some new recruits, but the better the weather and quality of racing, the more interest / new fans are gained. Goes for jumps as well as flat.
"Now of course, there will be a squadron of defiant anoraks posting after me who say the Classics are the best thing ever and yadda yadda, and they are entitled to their opinion. I enjoy the Derby and so on. But".
That’ll be me then.
Each to his own and all that, but I find early season betting very profitable, whether over jumps or flat.
Just for a change, why not write a thread that’s bright and cheerful Prof, with all the things you like about racing?
You should become a Timeform salesman, Ginger. Alas, when Ladbrokes had it for free I found better profits by ignoring it.
I don’t know why you bother with racing at all Professor. The only pleasure you seem to take from it is in not taking pleasure from it.
As a matter of fact I take a lot of pleasure and, perhaps more importantly,
diversion
from it. But the game needs rigorous public criticism and debate, and as I’ve said many times here: I suspect the racing forum elder statesman do not really approve of that when all is said and done.
I had things to do yesterday so ignored the whole day’s racing and had a watch when I got in last night. It looked yawnworthy to me (but most Newmarket racing looks boring to me, maybe it’s the track). I checked again this morning, to make sure a few glasses of vino hadn’t made me unduly harsh or cynical. But no, the 2000 guineas
was
boring, and as a betting proposition punters either had to rely on guesswork or rumour. It may have been heaven for anoraks but to this normal human being it didn’t look like anything worth jumping up and down about.
The Waste Land
APRIL is the cruellest month, breeding
Lilacs out of the dead land, mixing
Memory and desire, stirring
Dull roots with spring rain.
Winter kept us warm, covering
Earth in forgetful snow, feeding
A little life with dried tubers.We shall not cease from form study
And the end of all our punting
Will be to arrive where we started
And know the place for the first timeWith apologies to Eliot.
…anything but the crappy old start to the Flat. Such a bore, such an insult to punters.
Oh, I don’t know though.
What’s "crappy"?
What exactly don’t you like Prof?
What’s a bore?
What’s an insult to punters?The start of the Flat is hard work. The form is all over the place: the eternal 2 year old to 3 year old improvment problem, the whole all-weather complication stirred in (and all-weather racing is basically *****CENSORED BY THE JOCKEY CLUB*****, the Middle East crap that no punter I know is interested in; too much guesswork, too little hard info. odds on favourites, weird turn-ups. You can’t bet confidently and anyone who says they do is telling pork pies.
So, instead of taking the proper have-at-you-sir attitude to getting to grips with the day’s card, one mentally turns off. A month in, and I’m bored by it. I had Rougement (guess) and Colonel Mak (Form study) and about two others, but it’s hard work considering the sheer volume of racing.
The thought of doing any Flat form study makes your heart sink. As I understand it, we, the paying punters are supposed to be jumping for joy at this mess. Well, I ain’t. Is anyone really excited at the prospect of the Guineas or the classics? As a spectacle maybe, but as a betting opp? I’d rather sort out the winner of a class 3 chase in the depths of winter: you know you’ve got a chance of thrills and spills, and a sporting chance of winning, which is all i require. At the start of the Flat I find myself watching the depressing sight of horses going backwards, and wagers going down by a nose and all that. Having losing runs that simply would not happen on the jumps. It’s boring and annoying. It is only my opinion. Maybe it has to be this way, I don’t know. What I do know is, you will never find new fans on what March and April have to offer. Never.Now of course, there will be a squadron of defiant anoraks posting after me who say the Classics are the best thing ever and yadda yadda, and they are entitled to their opinion. I enjoy the Derby and so on. But.
…anything but the crappy old start to the Flat. Such a bore, such an insult to punters.
That was a truly fantastic ride on Papamoa in the novices’ handicap hurdle at Perth.
Pushed along from before four out and still a good 15 lengths behind the leader at two out. But she kept at him and conjured a flying finish from the gelding, despite only using three strikes after the last and no strikes at all between the penultimate and the last flight.
Now on 38 with 11 booked rides left this season. 40 now seems very achievable.
Good luck to her!
Indeed – it was a very good finish!
But fine, if you’re ok with betting Prof, then my "concern" is misplaced. Just please try to find the reasons for things happening before you post another negative post. And explain things in the original post. Otherwise it just
looks like
a punter who’s miffed about a losing bet and has to have a moan.
…
I’ll take your word Prof, that it is not.Look, ginge. I have told you this till I’m blue in the face: I am not an institutionalised bettor, by which I mean I don’t take everything at face value. It is a hard game to win at, and is in its essence a farce of concealed information. That is beyond dispute. You and your supporters on here live in a sort of Manichean universe: all those who criticise what goes on, even in the tiniest way, are BAD AND BITTER. Those that accept everything that happens at face value are jolly good chaps.
It happens that I don’t see it like that. You will never get away from this essential truth: racing is sport financed by losers, or money bet in vain. The nuances around that fact will always make it be perceived by the general public as a mug’s game. You can lecture us with maths till your googie withers, but those facts stand, old son.
Come on PTS – you just saw one of the greatest staying hurdlers ever win for the 17th consecutive time, breaking all previous records.
If you can’t get enthusiastic about that…
I hear you, but we all knew he’d win, he was 5/1 on, Crack Away Jack, who has eaten god alone knows how much punters’ money, suddenly shows some each way value (opened 50/1 £8250-£250 Each Way – someone had an inkling…) It wasn’t a race it was a procession. Good on all concerned but it didn’t do much for me.
The rest of the afternoon, no winners or near winners for me. My own fault: I don’t get on with this meeting, but once you start looking at Form, you see things, or you think you do and down goes the money.
I used to be a National fan and good at finding the winner, but the last few years I kind of look at it as an embarrassment, a cruel affair with a usually-knackered victor with four miles of mess, injury and death behind it. Poor old Ballabriggs, almost dead on his feet.
I did "consider what you have written" Prof. You couldn’t get "enthusiastic" about Big Buck’s setting a new consecutive wins record, because he was a 1/5 shot. And moaning about the 50/1 shot who you say "someone had an inkling". Ye Right. Hardly a massive move is it? In to 33/1, just one "point", just 1.1% difference. And this in a race which was particularly advantageous for each way betting, an 8 runner race with a long odds-on fav. And with the obvious 5/1 shot Smad Place unseating something had to be second. Restless Harry also falling, bringing down Won In The Dark. The enigmatic dodgepot Tidal Bay badly hampered. Poungach having his first run for some time ran as if needing the run (probably noticeable in the paddock). That leaves Crack Away Jack and the totally outclassed Accross The Bay, former beat the latter by just 3 1/4 lengths. So the now Tom George trained horse did not need to improve to finish second.
There’s an awful lot of ifs in there to explain half a grand’s worth of bet. But you like gobbing off about mathematics, so I will let it lie.
I back one horse in a race, at most two.
If they lose fair and square it’s not a problem to me.
I often complain about racing because at heart I believe there is fundamental dissembling in PARTS of the sport, and not just the all-weather end. I say that as someone who consistently backs good winners, not as a betting shop serial loser. Ultimately, that dissembling to a public which bets in good faith and on which the sport depends becomes, to me anyway, distasteful.
I don’t say it can ever be resolved, but I do reserve the right to complain.
I am not the kind of person who ever subscribes to the pack mentality; the pack mentality on here being that to complain is somehow infra dig, and the act of a fool and that everything is wonderful and all criticism is the fabled pocket talk.
PS: Objecting to Saturday’s disgusting spectacle is, I hope you will agree on this at least, not pocket talk.This was a thread started about the Thursday of Aintree Prof, not Saturday. With many top class races and Big Buck’s setting a new win record… Yet all you could do was moan obout it being an "enthusiasm sapping afternoon".
It’s obvious that you need to back winners to enjoy racing. Your assertion "If they lose fair and square it’s not a problem to me", does not fit with what I see from your ramblings.
Yes it was, but my general points are valid.
I enjoy many races for their own sake, so you are wrong about that. As I said in an earlier post, the races I have enjoyed the most I did not even have a bet in. Instead of massaging your clearly vast ego by trying to get the last word, you should maybe pause and consider what I have written.
…
But you don’t "complain" do you Prof.
You just start thread after thread with titles moaning about something or other. And then don’t even tell us what you find so deplorable. Just three little dots.
See above post.
If racing doesn’t abolish this cruel and ridiculous race, it will ultimately set in motion a chain of protest and legislation that will in time ruin the English Turf in general, and bring about the end of National Hunt.
With a few honourable exceptions, the people who make up this sport are ignorant, perhaps wilfully, of this danger. They think they can carry as they are. This is a mistake that will be paid for very heavily in time.
The problem of the National is here to stay. It will not go away.
British Moral Panics (c) are often absurd and ridiculous. On the face of it, the one about the National is. My first thought was: When they’ve sorted out battery farms, vivisection, factory farming, low pay for humans, starting wars for oil on the basis of lies, children smoking skunk and stabbing each other to death on a regular basis, pensioners lying in their own filth in hospitals, mass unemployment and the Islamic terrorist threat, when they’ve done all that, maybe we can start a moral panic about a horse race.But life in England doesn’t work like that. The main thought should be the long-term preservation of the sport/game of racing horses, and the National will from here onwards be an albatross round its neck, or a leper’s bell if you will, announcing animal cruelty to a nation which is sentimental about animals and increasingly given to activist bandwagons.
I lot of rubbish is written in the Racing Post each year about how the National is ‘racing’s shop window’. Well, it isn’t a very good advert: brutality, injury and usually a winner most people couldn’t find by sticking half a dozen pins in. If it was a good advert, the sport would grow each year as newcomers develop an interest in it; but year on year public interest in the Turf declines, these days precipitously. The ‘shop window’ does nothing.
So dump it or have it sink the ship.
You have been warned.
Big Buck’s is a legend.
Then it can’t be an "enthusiasm-sapping afternoon", can it?
It seems your posts signify what mood you’re in Prof. Can just imagine you throwing your form book at the TV screen. If betting causes such mood swings / reaction Prof, it could be you have a gambling problem. And before you say it, it does not matter if a punter is ahead or down on the year, he/she can still have a problem. Please talk to the people close to you and examine your consience and think about getting in touch with Gamcare. Concerned for you Prof.
Mark
Do me a favour, Ginge, and stop attempting to suggest I’m a gambling addict. You’ve been on this tip since the FOBT thread and it’s silly and obvious behaviour on your part. In my humble opinion it is you who show signs of addiction: your almost neurotic placing of ‘saver’ bets seems to me to be a form of pre-emptive loss-chasing, and your tipping thread could be interpreted by addiction specialists as the tell-tale inflated behaviour which is seen in gambling addicts. However, I think addiction specialists are quacks; you evidently take a different view.
I back one horse in a race, at most two. If they lose fair and square it’s not a problem to me.
I often complain about racing because at heart I believe there is fundamental dissembling in PARTS of the sport, and not just the all-weather end. I say that as someone who consistently backs good winners, not as a betting shop serial loser. Ultimately, that dissembling to a public which bets in good faith and on which the sport depends becomes, to me anyway, distasteful. I don’t say it can ever be resolved, but I do reserve the right to complain.
I am not the kind of person who ever subscribes to the pack mentality; the pack mentality on here being that to complain is somehow infra dig, and the act of a fool and that everything is wonderful and all criticism is the fabled pocket talk.
PS: Objecting to Saturday’s disgusting spectacle is, I hope you will agree on this at least, not pocket talk.Big Buck’s is a legend.
Then it can’t be an "enthusiasm-sapping afternoon", can it?
Mark
Dear ginge, I think you need to look up the word specious in the dictionary.
]
It was a great afternoons racing and worth watching for Big Bucks win alone, so what if he was an "unbackable" price, (although I would dispute that – you show me a bank who offers a 22% return on investment, tax free).
I cannot understand how some people seem to be unable to watch and appreciate a race without being obsessed by betting. If they are that desperate to make money there are other far less risky ways of doing so.
A fantastic achievement and I thought Mark Johnson’s commentary at the end was absolutely spot on – that long silent pause was absolutely on the button.
Who needs Animal Aid when we have people like Professor Rubshawe….
In fairness it is quite easy to make a decent case against the National without invoking the hysterical approach of Animal Aid.
I have moved to being a great fan of the race to now being very ambivalent about it and, to be honest it wouldn’t take that much to tip me towards the "get rid of it" side of the argument.
The race is too in your face and hard to avoid if you are a racing fan. I’m at Chepstow tomorrow but, like at the other meetings, there is a 65 minute gap in racing so they can show the National on the big screen, so it’s hard to avoid – I will probably either go and walk the course or go into town and do some shopping whilst it is on.
Big Buck’s is a legend. I am just saying that it didn’t get my blood up much as a race. I do not have to win to enjoy racing. I was in the press stand at Epsom the day Sea the Stars won, and I didn’t have a penny on him. I had a brilliant day’s racing and lost hundreds. There have been plenty of similar. My favourite race ever is the 2009 Arc. On that occasion with not a penny wagered: it’ll be a hot day in January before you’ll find me betting on anything less than 5/1.
I think my problem with AIntree is that it’s the end of the Jumps (which is sad) and usually heralds a very hard and EXTREMELY annoying period on the Flat. It is the changeover period. Yes, I should stop betting for two months. Having said that I found COLONEL MAK 33/1 at Donny. When you back and win things like that with confidence in your biro-holding fingers, you feel you should be able to unpick anything. Not the case unfortunately. I should just stick to handicaps.
so you know one punter that is. Just one bet, one winner (Cirrus Des Aigles). Had I had two it would’ve been another winner (Cityscape).
Stop this "I can’t make a profit, so nobody can make a profit" crap. Take a look at my flat thread in DLAP. Bets in 12 races so far this season, 7 winners (5 main bet winners). I’ve even increased stakes recently, so no lack of confidence here. Of course there are things to take in to consideration at this time of year. Be selective; look for trainers in form; horses with a good record after a long break (if on reappearance) etc.
It’ll happen over the jumps too. Might be 