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I think you’re getting yourself into a real tangle, Joe – that still doesn’t make any sense.
The point we’re all making is that the BHA are wrong in how they’re acting on public perception and also have a shaky grasp of that perception. Focus on explaining why the anti-whip boys are wrong – don’t pander to their incorrect beliefs. We should be totally inflexible and not even entertain this as a debate. As discussed, the consequences of opening the door too far just don’t bear thinking about.
I don’t think your post makes any sense, Joe. Fuzzy logic.
You don’t have a problem with the whip and you recognise that Dene Stanstall’s ‘Animal Aid’ jokers have been banging on about it for years, but still you think ‘the sensible thing’ would have been to have caved and withdrawn the whip already?
Surely that would just have accelerated the nightmare scenario you map out. Racing would have been seen to acknowledge a problem with the whip and would leave itself vulnerable for the next thing (NH racing) and the next thing (the sport itself). The sport would be fighting for life already with antis able to point to precedent to back up their case.
What happened to standing up and fighting when you know you’re right? We all (well, most of us) know the whip is perfectly fair and humane while being absolutely essential in making a competitive sport out of horse racing. We love the sport so let’s stand up and put up the grittiest most staunch fight we can to retain the status quo rather than meekly saying “you couldn’t be more wrong…but I guess it looks kinda bad” as seems your preferred response. We should all dig in hard.
Winner very impressive there, SSP very slow.
Think a few didn’t run to form but Oaks form just looking appalling at this point.
Interested in the theory behind those Lily Langtry bets, GT. Personally in quite deep on South Sea Pearl at some decent prices (aftertime klaxon!). 11/4 is a bit stingy about her now and does follow-on from the conversation we had about poor Ballydoyle team tactics the other day, but do feel the two ‘Peach’ fillies should set this up for her. She’s a dour stayer and will need the assist.
Granted a proper test, she’s better than 98 and receives such a chunk of weight from two fraudy high 100s mares. Certainly agree with opposing those and can kind of see the Pilaster angle (strong pace, wants a test) but the vibes are just so toxic with her – looks laboured as well. The form of her win over Maid Up last year suddenly looks pretty dire as well.
Also don’t really believe in Manuela De Vega. Had a better trip than most in a dire English Oaks and enjoyed a nice position on the Curragh pace bias last time but found disappointingly little. Think she’s regressive.
Pathetic indeed, absolutely useless especially given all the build-up there was on RUK.
Add Racing UK to the BHA, Racing Post, HRI, TRF and all the other dismally-run organisations in and around this sport.
Cheers – yeah actually some 6 places around at 33/1 now if you’ve got a SkyBet. Might tap somebody up to get me on for an e/w double with the big-priced fancy at Redcar, then spend the evening contemplating my retirement!
Crosshue Boy @ 33/1 for me. Some 5 places action.
It’s a convoluted case for him and you need a forgiving heart but I’m willing to make a few excuses:
– Didn’t take to Aintree in the Becher Chase
– Seemingly ‘not off’ or not fit prior to that run, over hurdles and latest at Wexford
– Unlucky to fall in the Scottish National when sent single figures extremely well-backed
– Rushed out 9 days after that experience in a G2I think he’s on a good mark and I’m glad to see the jockey who knows the horse best (Harley Dunne) finally given the chance to ride him on a big day.
Trash talk? I think he’s a very good horse and thought he was a leading contender. Think it’s fair to question whether he’ll make it to the 2000 Guineas intact – not questioning the level he’s running at by any means.
Not sure if this is a language barrier thing for you, bol-dog?
Impressed by Penisturbo though the question is now whether Godolphin can get him to the Guineas.
You’d probably be able to fill the Newmarket racecourse stables with the scrapheap of horses Appleby, bin Suroor and Al Zarooni failed to get to the Classics in one piece!
What a race – Penisturbo, Visinari and many more!
No bets for me but potentially one of the highlights of the week – I’m almost looking forward to the post-race sectionalista v caveman digs as much as the race itself!
Hope Willo is on Racing TV duty this afternoon.
Arbalet worth a second look next year when picked up by another trainer at the sales. The vultures are circling around old Hugo Agogo now.
And how far would poor old flat out inferior Crystal Ocean have been beaten by the idling winner without the full quota of strikes? 3l+ imo.
LOL at the BHA handicapping wallah deciding yesterday’s result vindicates his view of CO being the world’s best horse by the way. The side-on shots clearly show Enable swinging the lead until he comes alongside.
Not sure he is, Kev.
Have a watch of awkward devil Major Crispies in his recent hands and heels outing. He’s not running better in that sphere because the jockey isn’t allowed to whip him – he’s getting closer because his rivals aren’t being whipped. On-the-bridle backclass becomes more important than current maximum (i.e. on and off the bridle) ability.
It’s incredibly frustrating to watch when you’re familiar with the horses involved and know that they can and can’t do with the benefit of the whip.
https://www.racingpost.com/results/40/nottingham/2019-06-05/732466
I personally find this race a great example of why whipless racing is a bad thing. It’s a display of horses galloping rather than a competitive sport.
Well, you’re just manipulating and misunderstanding his point with your little wordplay and tangents aren’t you?
You didn’t really respond to the very valid point that a ‘whipless trial’ would almost certainly be deemed a ‘success’ and used as a big tool for leverage by the anti-whip boys. Because to someone who only understands the sport superficially (and I’d include the BHA, pretty much anyone who isn’t at least breaking even betting on racing over a large churn and most spectators and posters on this forum), how can it not be a success? If nobody gets put through the rails and it’s a good clean race, it’d likely be job done and point proven as far as the antis are concerned.
By the way, I don’t really agree with old Ginger in that only straightforward sorts would be entered as many of the current hands and heels races are populated by sour old goats who “go well for a girl”, do all their work on the bridle and humour unorthodox/inexperienced riders. But that’s just an aside.
Realistically we need insight from the individuals and groups who have an appreciation and understanding of finishing speed %, sectionals etc and their relevance to hands and heels racing versus its viability as a competitive sport and betting proposition. I have no confidence that these people are being involved in anything the BHA does.
