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Sorry about that DJ, i know i come across as an arrogant tw@t, but that’s a failing on my part and  not my intention
Handicapping is imhaho one of the most interesting topics,  and i rather enjoy reading about and discussing ratings with other like minded people, i like them have an opinion and all i’m doing is giving mine
We all approach racing differently and i’m sure TF and RP handicappers have come up with an informed opinion of what rating they think is correct and not plucked a number out of the sky
I’m just disageeing with em ;)
(Edited by empty wallet at 11:09 pm on Nov. 20, 2006)
i was just kidding around ew, i,m sure the handicapper hears what they say as long as he doesnt pay too much attention, thanks for the welcome btw, some very intersting observations and information being exchanged on here so i pay close attention:o
Empty
No worries. Not trying to start a fight. I have always maintained that ratings are just another expression of opinion and should be taken so and not as Gospel.
Look forward to plenty of good debate with you throughout the winter. As long as you stop taking b*****ks
!:biggrin: :biggrin:Quote: from davidjohnson on 11:31 pm on Nov. 20, 2006[br] As long as you stop taking b*****ks<br>!:biggrin: :biggrin:
<br>Thats your opinion, which you are entitled to,  mine is different :biggrin: :biggrin:
<br>
(Edited by empty wallet at 11:52 pm on Nov. 20, 2006)
I lost interest in Brave Inca long ago, after Cheltenham in fact.
Even the bravest, fastest, toughest horse (such as Brave Inca) can only give their all or close to it for a certain amount of time, at least without a substantial break in between. Particularly the most courageous ones.
And I’m not sure after three punishing years, Brave Inca will ever get back to his best level in the past.
Though my main hope is Detroit City, I’ve put a little on the Haredy Lad, in case what I suspect has been an intentionally lighter campaign does mean he can come back to near his best.
He’s won 5 Grade 1 races in 4 years, to Brave Inca’s 7 – including one this year.
I don’t believe Nathan Detroit’s had to slug it out once so far. If so, it will have been in a tiddler of race.
I’ve been sticking my neck out to my embarrassment lately with a fair degree of regularity, but I will be surprised if Brave Inca wins the Champion Hurdle this year.
Quote: from Grimes on 12:17 am on Nov. 21, 2006[br]
Even the bravest, fastest, toughest horse (such as Brave Inca) can only give their all or close to it for a certain amount of time, at least without a substantial break in between. Particularly the most courageous ones.
How close do you think BI ran to that form on Sunday, 5, 10, 15, 20lbs?
Complete and utter over reaction to BI’s run on Sunday. I actually do not think when he won the race his form was much better than his run on Sunday. The likes of Essex were close up that day.
As for all the battles, the reason why he has been in so many battle is because he is lazy not because he is struggling. While he often looks like he has had hard races he actually has not simply because he is only doing the bare minimum in each race. Where as other horses who are exuberant and flashy often look like they have done it easy but in reality they have put massive effort in to producing massive performances.
Trainers of Grade 1 winners have just seen their charges beaten by one of last year’s leading novices on their season reappearance. Do you really expect Mullins or Murphy to come out and say ‘Yep, we we 100% and beaten by a better horse
Why not?
Are they expected to make false excuses?
Why not?
Are they expected to make false excuses?
All trainers do it. How many times did we hear excuses from Paul Nicholls every time Moscow stuffed Azertyuiop….supposidly Azertyuiop was either unfit or didnt like Sandown….
Quote: from clivex on 3:39 pm on Nov. 19, 2006[br]My first was that the best irish hurdler might have been at Ascot yesterday  and that Detroit City supporters willbe quite happy.
Brave inca is often not at his best first time of course, but i still thought it was an ordinary performance. Has his time passed now?<br>
Thats one way of looking at it.  The way I see it and so does his trainer is that Hardy was overseas quite because the best hurdlers werent there. ÂÂÂ
For me his performances restates that the current crop of 2 to 2 and half mile hurdlers trained across in Britain are not up to scractch and if Detroit City is to have any sniff of being a champion hurdle horse, he would have to be showing the level of form he is at the moment.  I like the grey a lot but proof surely what a ridiculous price he is.  I see 7/2 at at the moment with HE at 16 with many layers….what would that equate to in a match bet.??
(Edited by SirHarryLewis at 2:50 pm on Nov. 21, 2006)
SHL
Aidan
PN is not generally in the habit of telling the world that a horse is fit as he can be and then excusing defeat with "needs race big time"
hes as straightforward a trainer as you can find
Also its complete rubbish to say that all trainers make excuses everytime one of theirs is beaten
Didnt see too many excuses after Kautos win last saturday . Hourigan was particularly generous i recall
Clive do you seriously think Colm Murphy genuinely thought his nortoriously lazy Brave Inca would be "fit" for his seasonal debut? I remember at the time of the launch of the new Bula Hurdle C Murphy saying Brave Inca would be unlikely to run in it because he wouldnt be ready as is rarely ready this time of year for a race of that nature.
Well, i concede that he didnt say fully fit (I think…), but surely you saw the upbeat comments before the race?
I didnt back him so not talking through pocket
When it comes to a horse like Brave Inca I think it would be tough to be sure about his fitness particularly on his seasonal debut. While he might well have done plenty of work at home he is the type of horse that probably does feck all at home.
I’d be surprised if he can’t improve a good bit on that run on Sunday, empty wallet.
I tend to think in terms of speed figures rather than pounds, particularly in terms of non-handicaps.
It may well be that Aidan is quite correct about him being a lazy horse, and seeming to have to fight hard to win.
On further reflection, I dare say if he doesn’t win the CH, he may not be far away, but have a feeling the up-and-coming brigade may prove too strong this year.
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