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Agreed. But how about 2011? Surely winning three Derbys versus one for Galileo must mean something? Derby plus Breeders Cup plus Wading and Camelot?
Given that Montjeu’s record with fillies requires some improvement, then as a owner/breeder then Galileo has to be the logical choice if it is a direct choice at all. Of course its hard to know whether he will become a good broodmare sire at this point, but it depends on breeder preference and Montjeu fillies have been something of a curse.
As an all rounder,Galileo is the best sire in the world.
He comes from probably the greatest bloodline in racing,with BlackSamBellamy and Sea the Stars as half brothers,and King’s Best been a close relative.Galileo’s family line is further boosted this year from Wonder of Wonders classic placed,as well as Wading looking like a top filly for next year,although by Montjeu. This is the first filly by Montjeu that I’ve been really excited about,but I don’t think it’s due to Monjteu’s input,it’s all down to the Urban Sea blood in her I think.
Both have had great seasons but at the end of the day Galileo has a remarkable number of group 1 winners. Off the top of my head:
Frankel
Together
Treasure Beach
Misty for Me
The South african filly
Roderic O’Connor
Nathaniel
Cape Blanco
Golden Lilac
GalikovaI don’t know where that person got it from that Galileo has been quiet since Derby day.
For tough 3 year old Middle distance runners,Montjeu is an excellent stallion
If I wanted to breed a Derby winner I would have to go to Montjue,rather than Galileo. Montjue had three Group One winning fillies in October alone, two of which were over three years old.However I agree that Galileo gets nicer types of fillies than Montjue.Montjue’s fillies tend to be a little unpredictable,no doubt about that. But Hurricane Fly is testament to the Montjue’s talents in the NH sphere also.
Two of those fillies were unfancied ones at Woodbine,one who had been rated in the 90’s IIRC when with John Oxx and the other had been soundly beaten in the Vermeille before that.
I’d like to see them recreate that form in Europe before I praise them a whole lot,those grade 1’s at Woodbine can be grade 1 in name only.
Who was the third filly in October?I wouldn’t necessarily praise a stallion who stands at 75k who got a champion hurdle winner. Coolmore would rather a group 1 one winner on the flat than a champion hurdle winner by Montjeu anyday. If anything,him siring national hunt winners would devalue him as a stallion,no breeder would pay 75k for a national hunt stallion.
So you would praise a stallion who got a TRIUMPH HURDLE winner then? its good to know that a stallion can get top class NH winners because not all colts get to keep there Nuts do they?
they are both very good stallions at the end of the day
So you would praise a stallion who got a TRIUMPH HURDLE winner then? its good to know that a stallion can get top class NH winners because not all colts get to keep there Nuts do they?
they are both very good stallions at the end of the day
I was referring to praising them as just a NH stallion.
Don’t be naive,Galileo can get anything from 6 furlong two year olds to milers at three to Leger winners. Montjeu,for the most part,is not as versatile.
Obviously it is good to get a stallion who can be a NH stallion,but no one who sends a mare to Montjeu at 75k is hoping that they’ll eventually have a horse racing over hurdles. You get get a nice NH stallion at a tenth of the cost.
Top notch Galileos are more versatile, or even classy. All the best over the last 4 years have won G1’s over a greater range of trips.
Galileo for me.
A Group One is a Group One.Perhaps Wading did not win a Group One, but since English races seem to be the Gold Standard many people rated that as high as a Group One in Canada.As for the Champion Hurdle 2011, Montjue got the winner.At least as good as the Leger,no? Just another option.But nevertheless you go to Montjue for a Derby winner.To Galileo for the rest.I look to Camelot to provide Montjue with another Derby winner in 2012.
Since Ballydoyle seem to have more Galileos than Montjues perhaps they are skewing the statistics? Surely the Lollypop at Epsom count in the long run for more than the other accolades?Simply as a racing fan I like the unpredictability of the Montjues.I know they are a risky buy but I cannot afford to buy anyhow.The incredible finish of Pour Moi at Epsom illustrates my point.Like SNA he came roaring down the stretch and left everyone in shock.Better than Frankel in the Guineas for my money.
A Group One is a Group One.Perhaps Wading did not win a Group One, but since English races seem to be the Gold Standard many people rated that as high as a Group One in Canada.As for the Champion Hurdle 2011, Montjue got the winner.At least as good as the Leger,no? Just another option.But nevertheless you go to Montjue for a Derby winner.To Galileo for the rest.I look to Camelot to provide Montjue with another Derby winner in 2012.
How you can compare an all age race in Canada to a two year old race in England baffles me.
How could you rate it as a group 1 next to that?
I also find it difficult how you can compare a Classic winner by a flat sire to a Champion Hurdle winner. A classic winner is bred for the job,Hurricane Fly was ultimately a colt who couldn’t cut it on the flat,so was gelded and switched to hurdles.
You go to Montjeu hoping for a derby winner. If you get a filly,you aren’t happy.
You go to Galileo for anything. You get a colt or filly,you’re happy. That’s what makes him a better stallion.
Someone before me discounted the group one races in canada. So I accepted their rating . Based on their rating I upgraded Wadings victory since it was gotten in GB so to speak.Surely a listed race at Doncaster,Newmarket or Ascot must be as good as a group one in Canada?However for some reason winning the Epsom derby seems to lack the enthusiasm which John Magnier displays for it with his multiple entries every year.
I don’t think anyone is doubting Montjeu’s ability to produce a 12f colt capable of running well at Epsom in June. Galileo can get colts and fillies who can perform over a variety of distances. If you are trying to breed a Derby winner then Montjeu is an excellent choice, however unless you can guarantee the sex of the resulting mating, your investment may not look very good in the short term. Breeding to sell is largely about the short term yield, breeding to race then breed (if you keep the fillies) is a sound policy but one which doesn’t encourage a visit to Montjeu given his record with his female progeny.
Even though Galileo’s stud fee is higher, I think most commercial breeders would regard him as better value for money than Montjeu.
Someone before me discounted the group one races in canada. So I accepted their rating . Based on their rating I upgraded Wadings victory since it was gotten in GB so to speak.Surely a listed race at Doncaster,Newmarket or Ascot must be as good as a group one in Canada?However for some reason winning the Epsom derby seems to lack the enthusiasm which John Magnier displays for it with his multiple entries every year.
That was me who said that.
That doesn’t automatically mean one can upgrade a group 2 in Britain,but I understand where you are coming from.
I mean from the point of view that Miss Keller rated 100 when with John Oxx,well short of group 1 level.
I’m not quite sure if you’re serious or exaggerating about the Listed race being the same level.
I disagree about your point. The Derby is probably the biggest race in Europe,if not,only beaten by the Arc. What do all Derby winners have in common?
Pour Moi
Workforce
Sea the Stars
New Approach
Authorized
Sir Percy
Motivator
High Chaparral
Galileo and others. All are or will be,in demand at stud,the whole point of breeding,hoping to stand a champion stallion.Galileo has proved his progeny can carry the bloodline class with
Teofilo
a group 1 winner in his first crop.
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