- This topic has 93 replies, 24 voices, and was last updated 15 years, 8 months ago by
.
- Posts
- Total Posts 17716
This is how I see it;
IRISH CHAMPION
104.61 Cape Blanco
99.11 Rip Van Winkle
99.06 Twice Over
99.01 Beethoven
98.51 Sea Lord
97.51 Famous NameSUSSEX STAKES
98.62 Canford Cliffs
95.32 Premio Loco
94.57 Beethoven
93.82 Dream Eater
85.82 Mac Love
64.82 EncompassingJUDDMONTE
92.77 Twice Over
92.02 Byword
88.02 Cavalryman
85.52 Dick Turpin
82.52 Jakkalberry
80.27 Cutlass Bay
79.52 Stimulation
70.52 BushmanKING GEORGE
107.39 Harbinger
93.14 Youmzain
93.09 Daryakana
92.84 Workforce
86.84 ConfrontECLIPSE
97.89 Sri Putra
97.39 Viscount Nelson
92.39 Dar Re Mi
71.39 ZacintoIRISH DERBY
98.77 Midas Touch
97.27 Jan Vermeer
96.27 Monterosso
93.27 At First Sight
93.22 Carraiglawn
87.72 Coordinated Cut
86.97 Puncher Clynch
78.97 Dubawi Phantom
77.72 Bright HorizonPRINCE OF WALES
88.53 Byword
87.28 Tazeez
85.78 Stimulation
85.73 Wiener Waltzer
84.23 Glass Harmonium
84.18 Debussy
84.13 Shalanaya
82.38 Presvis
82.33 Mawatheeq
76.33 Allybar
64.33 CavalrymanQUEEN ANNE
102.06 Goldikova
102.01 Paco Boy
98.26 Dream Eater
97.51 Zacinto
95.51 Dalghar90.04 Ouqba
75.04 Cat Junior
57.04 Calming InfluencePRIX DU JOCKEY CLUB
105.85 Lope De Vega
102.85 Planteur
102.10 Pain Perdu
101.60 Behkabad
101.55 Viscount Nelson
101.05 Lumineux
101.00 Ice Blue
99.00 Hansom Devil
98.25 Dancing David97.20 Ivory Land
95.70 Green Rock
95.20 Shamalgan
93.70 Royal Bench
90.70 Russian Dream
90.20 No Risk At All
87.70 Celtic Celeb
87.20 Tip Toe
87.15 Classic Hero
86.65 Big Creek
84.15 Prince Pretender
– Vivre LibreI think the right horse has won and the form shouldn’t be crabbed due to the nature of Cape Blanco’s performance as all 6 horses have run their best race of the season on perfect good ground and that is testiment to Cape Blanco who was a target for 5 horses who’ve put in seasonal bests yet managed to pull clear easily, even if you account for the 7lbs which would theoretically have cost Twice Over and Rip Van Winkle 3.88 lengths they’d still of been beaten so Cape Blanco rates as a serious animal
there’s a few possibility’s. I think.
For value rip needed to win(needs more group 1 wins) but the pace maker stuffed it up and didn’t go fast enough.
Twice over was following rip thinking he was the danger.
so that’s them both out of the race.
Entitled to improve a fair bit as a 4yo as well I’d say, being a mid/late-April foal. Always thought it was a shame Oratorio wasn’t kept in training so hopefully they’ll make up for it by perservering with Cape.
Seems a 10f specialist to me though, couldn’t see him winning an Arc, but could see him cleaning up every 1m2f G1 going in Europe.
Only race he has disappointed was the Jockey Club and lets be fair that race shaped like a big handicap than a G1 and was a very rough race.
What impressed me most about his performance even though the obviously gave him to much rope, Cape Blanco seemed to be going away from the field, only Sea Lord ever got close to him RVW was making stridres on the rest but made and probably was losing more ground to Cape Blanco and you cant use the ground as an excuse for RVW, Cape Blanco hates it as much as RVW.
John,
Are you saying that Rip and Twice ran to form and all Cape Blanco, Beethoven and Sea Lord improved enormously?
In relation to the point you make above, both Twice Over and Rip finished pretty much the same distance apart in the International at York. Both Beethoven and Sea Lord rated 115 and 118 respectively were attempting 10f for the first time yesterday, it is not beyond the realms of possibility that both horses did in actual fact improve for the step up in trip.
In relation to Stoutes poor form affecting Workforce’s performance (I agree he didn’t show his true running) in the King George, you seem to utterly rule out the fact that Stoute trained the winner of the fore mentioned race.
JohnJ
It’s possible both Beethoven and Sea Lord improved, but I believe unlikely.
When a stable is "out of form" it does not mean all horses from the stable will run poorly. Also in my experience, older horses (4yo +) are more likely to run to form at this time than younger horses (2 and 3yo). Probably due to being immune from whatever virus is effecting the yard, after having it earlier in their careers. Hence Harbinger’s win.
Stoute’s strike rate in July was very poor compared to previous years and early this season.Value Is EverythingI believe that Ballydoyle had the same "Poor stable Form"in the first half of the season and that they will blossom now that the late season horses are starting to bloom(Await the Dawn,Flying Cross). Beethoven showed last years form on Saturday also. So I would now fancy Ballydoyle for the St.Leger.
Ginger,
How would it be unlikely that a Group 1 winning two year old over 7f would improve for a step up to 10f?
JohnJ
the pace maker stuffed it up and didn’t go fast enough.
That is emphatically NOT what the sectionals tell you.
If Cape Blanco’s class and not his breeding gets him to win over a mile and a half what is the source of his class? Will he pass on his class to his get or will he just pass on his breeding? I find this whole discussion about his breeding very interesting. It is as if people don’t want to admit they misjudged the quality of his breeding. Just like STS last year.People argued over his breeding yet they were all wrong.
- Total Posts 17716
He destroyed yesterdays field, funny to think before the race people were questioning why O’Brien was even running Cape Blanco!
JohnJ
On that note JohnJ I tipped Cape Blanco over the internet to a friend in Australia who was up late for the race. His immediate response was "Betfair radio fellas say it can’t win". There certainly was a lot of negative sentiment about regarding Cape Blanco and I expect it to continue.
In another thread on this forum earlier this year ( may have been on subject of Coolmore 3yos ) I was laughed at for writing a post saying Cape Blanco was Coolmores best 3yo. At that stage he was entered for a trial race that others thought signified a low ranking in the stables opinion. Cape Blanco has had knockers all year. Some of those that have taken a set against the horse will only continue to try to justify their negativity.
Simply enjoy and ignore the detractors.
Makes me feel even sicker now, as I had my biggest ante post bet ever on Cape Blanco to win The Derby, dam Aidan!
Odd tactics by Murtagh on Rip Van Winkle, riding him at the back, when his best runs in my opinion have come when ridden prominently (Lockinge and QE2)
Rip Van Winkle has never ran in the front going over and at 1m2f, guess AOB thinks he wouldnt have the stamina of what Cape Blanco could do.
What did Timeform rate Cape Blanco for Saturdays win? Thought the 127 awarded by RPR low myself.
the pace maker stuffed it up and didn’t go fast enough.
That is emphatically NOT what the sectionals tell you.
where are these sectionals ? I didn’t know this data was available .
Was a great ride by the Jockey. Unbelievable clock in his head for a irish "Journey man" jockey and thats with the greatest of respect. I not a massive fan of Seamie but that ride was exceptional. I love him to keep the ride in the Breeders Cup Classic but i sure they be thinking about Await the Dawn for Breeders Cup Classic. As Mick Kinane always points out that all Coolmore Horse’s struggle on the Dirt(in the classic) but they are not bred to go on it. The only Horse that has run to his form was Giants Causeway who was bred for the job. I suspect they Await the Dawn will be heading state side with Rip, Lillie and Meow
the pace maker stuffed it up and didn’t go fast enough.
That is emphatically NOT what the sectionals tell you.
where are these sectionals ? I didn’t know this data was available .
They’re not available.You have to time them yourself.
Who was the pacemaker in the first quote supposed to be ?
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.