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Pilsudski – who didn’t get off the mark till his 5th race.
True, but he was a far more backward type than Peeping Fawn was. On her debut, she looked for all the world as though a step up in trip would suit her, and subsequent events have gone to prove that that was the case, so why was she persevered with over a mile? Just to have a crack at the Irish Guineas?
Just a question for yquemi21,does he think that stoute or cecil,could of trained horses like dylan thomas,peeping fawn,Holy roman emperor, or even johanasburg and keep them on the go racing 7times in a season and still keeping theM fresh all the way through??
Of course
and not sure that they would have got only one win in eight attempts out of a talent like George washington either….
AOB is superb at keeping certain horses fresh but hes hardly unique in that respect.
I have some misgivings about his targeting sometimes. The last running of Myboycharlie in bottomless ground seemed pointless to me and cant have had any benefits
Ah yes..the one thats lost his way…..always get them mixed up for some reason
Could it be said that running him in that last race was a sign of of too rigid an approach and that could be down to the original point raised?
True, but he was a far more backward type than Peeping Fawn was.
If he was so much more backward why did he run twice at 2?
Maybe the fact that both horses turned into multiple Group 1 winners had something to do with them being allowed to come on bit by bit in lower-class company?
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If he was so much more backward why did he run twice at 2?
That has always been the traditional way of introducing backward types. They’re given a couple of gentle introductory races as juveniles and then put away to strengthen up over the winter. For whatever reason, it was unable to race Peeping Fawn at two, so she couldn’t follow this tried-and-trusted introducton to racing. However, running her in four maidens in a six-and-a-half week spell hardly qualifies as being "allowed to come on bit by bit", as you’ve put it.
Personally I don’t rate Henrythenavigator that much, but was his last run really that bad given that he was giving weight to what is now the champion 2yo, and the subsequent 4 length winner of the Group 2 Beresford Stakes who is now fav for the RP Trophy on Sat?
However, running her in four maidens in a six-and-a-half week spell hardly qualifies as being "allowed to come on bit by bit", as you’ve put it.
"Bit by bit" is a relative term – she’s obviously a horse who was developing both physically and mentally at a tremendous rate.
Put it this way – when you win 4 Group 1s in a row with a horse, you get to say that whatever you did with the horse must have been the right thing for it because it doesn’t really get much better than that.
What sort of races could Peeping Fawn go for at distances in excess of the mile trip? She finished third in the 1000 Guineas proving she was more than competitive at that distance.
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"Bit by bit" is a relative term – she’s obviously a horse who was developing both physically and mentally at a tremendous rate.
Put it this way – when you win 4 Group 1s in a row with a horse, you get to say that whatever you did with the horse must have been the right thing for it because it doesn’t really get much better than that.
Fully agree with all of that, but at the same time there’s no way of proving that what they did was any better than taking it softly, softly with her. Who knows, she may have turned out even better had the latter approach been adopted.
Aidan, I’m no expert on the Irish fixture list but there must have been a mile-and-a-quarter maiden for three-year-old fillies somewhere?
Why go a mile and a quarter maiden when she has since proved well up to winning a mile maiden and probably a mile Group 2-3…or maybe even better again.
Personally I don’t rate Henrythenavigator that much, but was his last run really that bad given that he was giving weight to what is now the champion 2yo, and the subsequent 4 length winner of the Group 2 Beresford Stakes who is now fav for the RP Trophy on Sat?
and he didnt beat anything home either…
But thats not really the point. If the ground bothered him that much (im not sure) why not wait for a more suitable target?
Just looks to me like a bit of an infelxible approach…
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Why go a mile and a quarter maiden when she has since proved well up to winning a mile maiden and probably a mile Group 2-3…or maybe even better again.
Okay, she won her valuable mile maiden… at the fourth attempt. She would almost certainly have won at her first attempt at ten furlongs, after her debut. As for "a mile Group 2-3", I’m sorry but I don’t quite follow you. She’s proved herself the best of her age and sex at middle distances but she isn’t anywhere near that, on the form book, at a mile. Mind you, it would have been interesting seeing her over a mile later in her career, once she was the finished product.
What a daft thread. How can anyone question the competency of O’Brien ?
What so daft about it Sam, the word genius is often lightly thrown where Aidan O Brien is concerned. Hell did he invent the wheel or what ?. good horses invariably make good trainers, and with the facilities, staff and high rollers with pockets so deep that they would reach Australia and back, why wouldn’t he be successfull. Any journeyman trainer would do the same job if they had the backing O Brien has. He made his name training numerous NH winners, where his wife deserved just as much if not more of the credit. He & she campaigned their horses like M. Pipe, run them up hills and get them as fit as husky dogs and run up a sequence. Yes Magnier & Co took a chance with O Brien, he has been successfull, but who wouldn’t be with the best breeds and an endless bankroll.
Magnier & Co took a chance with O Brien, he has been successfull, but who wouldn’t be with the best breeds and an endless bankroll.
I wouldn’t be, since you ask.
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