2015 Cheltenham Gold Cup

I hope they put Coneygree away for the season now as that must have taken a lot out of him. It will be interesting to see his schedule for next year. Definitely the King George but would Haydock be a bit tight for his style of running.

And if they’re both fit and well do you think Mullins and Ricci would run both Djakadam and Vautour in next year’s Gold Cup?

I wouldn’t worry so much about his soundness. My concern would be that this all-out give-everything in every race must burn a horse out. It was one of the reasons I was cagey about him after Newbury. I’ve yet to see a horse that can continue putting up these gut-wrenching runs, and his half-brother, Carruthers had that same gung-ho style at the start of his career and, I think, burned himself out.

I’d put him away now until well into next season and hope for the best. I take the point about the grinders struggling, but I think Don Poli does just what he has to do, and I think Vautour is a creature from another planet.

Steeplechasing wrote:

I wouldn’t worry so much about his soundness. My concern would be that this all-out give-everything in every race must burn a horse out. It was one of the reasons I was cagey about him after Newbury. I’ve yet to see a horse that can continue putting up these gut-wrenching runs, and his half-brother, Carruthers had that same gung-ho style at the start of his career and, I think, burned himself out.

I’d put him away now until well into next season and hope for the best. I take the point about the grinders struggling, but I think Don Poli does just what he has to do, and I think Vautour is a creature from another planet.

Carruthers was temperamental from an early stage in his chasing career Joe. Could give up if taken on.

Coneygree reminds me a lot of the way Desert Orchid did things. And he went on for ages Joe. I don’t see the difference how a horse runs, they’re equally likely to get “burned out”. Possibly people don’t notice so much when non-front runners lose their enthusiasm because they’re only one of many and back in the field. When a front runner loses its enthusiasm it’s noticed.

However, Coneygree is an eight year old, therefore has limited time at the top. He’s also had injuries in the past, so like any horse (front-runner or held up) who’s been fragile in the past – there’s a danger of a returning problem.

Time of the Gold Cup puts a question mark against official ground conditions on the Chase course today. Racing Post say “Slow by 5.5 seconds”. Even with top class racehorses you’d expect a slower time at this distance on “Soft, good-soft in places” imo. More like an exceptional time on Good-Soft.

imo All of last three starts were not run on ground as soft as the official going report. I think Coneygree will be effective on “Good” ground; although has a bit of a rounded action so may not be able to take much racing on that surface.

Steeplechasing wrote:

Although I’d had a small consolation bet on Coneygree after Newbury, I’d never say I fancied him and thought him awful value today. I hate getting the championship races so badly wrong, and I thought Many Clouds would win that, and that Bobs Worth would have done much better. I also fancied Sam Winner to run a race, so appalling calls from me. And I ended up screaming on Djakadam because I’d stuck him in one of those daft fiver accumulators, and the other three had won. All in all, a dreadful Gold Cup for me. The only saving grace is that, with Holywell’s performance, my @ass is safe from the view of TAPK

I suppose that’s worth a lot, really!

I didn’t see him as value either Joe, so you are not alone there.

I was the opposite with Bobs Worth, because I had labelled him Sideshow Bob after his Lexus effort. Nicky says he doesn’t go on the soft but I don’t think it was that soft today and the fact of the matter is that Bobs Worth won his Gold Cup in a time of 7m 4.9s compared to 6m 42.7s clocked by today’s winner so I just can’t see where you could argue that the ground has done him in.

Many Clouds, like Coneygree had form with Houblon Des Obeaux, who finished last of the 11 who completed today. Both horses increased their margin of superiority over Houblon today, but much more so in the case of the winner, who handed out a 42 length beating on this occasion, compared to the 7 lengths he had beaten him in The Denman chase. Even if we say Houblon has run poorly, Coneygree has made a lot more of that fact than Many Clouds did today. I always saw Many Clouds as more of a Grand National type and hope he runs there after this tough race.

Silviniaco Conti hasn’t run to the expectations of his highest rating in the field. Probably Cheltenham isn’t his track and he was never allowed to dominate the way he has in some of his races on soft ground. His Charlie Hall effort was put down to a combination of being short of fitness and the faster conditions, perhaps Kempton in true mud is his forte.

Lord Windermere’s connections said they felt the ground had gone against their horse but the fact is that this year’s race was faster than that of last year by two seconds. I strongly suspect he was simply a fluke winner.

Road To Riches was a long range punt for me at huge odds in The King George, he went to the Lexus instead but his performance today makes me wonder what would have been had he headed to Kempton. He has beaten the King George winner today, and the form line through Many Clouds and Dynaste, who was runner up in the King George, suggest my 25/1 shot would have been far from outclassed in the Boxing Day showdown. Que Sera etc but he’s run really well today, for a horse who was on very few peoples minds after his J N Wines success.

Today’s race seemed one where it paid to be up front and Djakadam was the only one who seemed to come through. The held up horses never really came into it and several dropped off as the race progressed. Ruby Walsh looked gutted, as if he felt sure Coneygree would tire off the front. He managed to reel in Road To Riches on the run in but couldn’t catch the game winner.

I wouldn’t want to be the handicapper trying to sort all that out with 35 length improvements and top rated being well beaten. Coneygree looks to have made exceptional progress from his previous defeat of Houblon Des Obeaux, even if we allow that horse an off day. Djakadam is assured of a hefty rise, his official mark of 157 is clearly all wrong and it shows the difficulties we all have, and why nobody can ever be complacent about the game, when this Hennessey disappointing favourite, has just turned a 28 length deficit with the winner of that race, Many Clouds, into a 23 length superiority ie 51 lengths, on just 9lb better terms.

Even Nostrodamus would have found it hard to see some of these turnarounds.

10/1 Coneygree for next year with Bet Victor if that tempts anyone?

They’ve said this morning that is it for the season, and that he’s come out of the race very well….fresh, eaten up well and almost like he hasn’t had a race!

Likely to return in the Betfair and then a crack at the King George, and they reckon he’s better going right handed!

Loving this horse like I do I took a bit of 25’s a few weeks ago (only small) for next seasons King George….after his Feltham win and the time he ran as opposed to Silviniaco Conti in the KG…

He’s now a best priced 7/1 with Betvictor and I still think that’s an outstanding bet as we know that is his definite target and is very likely to get his ideal conditions….I’d prefer to take those odds than 3/1 on Vautour at this stage…

And like I’ve been saying they still think there’s more to come with him!

As far as Silviniaco Conti goes there are many possible reasons:

There’s one fact yesterday that stands out for me. Pulled too hard to show his form, Fehily having to tug on the reigns. Was that because he does not like Cheltenham? Was it because he can’t go slow enough to stay? Was it because they held the horse up and does not like being behind horses these days? Ridden differently than has done for both Betfair and King George. Probably a mixture of those reasons. But imo would not have stayed the trip at any course being so free. If mine he’d go for the Ryanair next year unless there were fewer front-runners in the Blue Riband… Get a view of the front and just hope he settles.

So many highlights this week, hard to know where to start.

I had high hopes for Holywell but with the rain yesterday morning, his chance was significantly lessened and in the circumstances he ran ran a cracker in fourth, well clear of those in behind. A pity for many of us on here that he couldn’t get into third but on that ground you’d have to be happy with him. On good ground he’d have had a bigger say.

You do get the feeling however that this was his chance and next year’s race could be significantly stronger, with the three who beat him all improving and Don Poli and Vautour other possible contenders.

On first impressions the right sort of horses filled the places. The front four were the unexposed types who have been showing improvement and there was a lot less of the shock factor about this year’s result than last year’s.

Coneygree is still a novice and as such you’d expect there is more to come from him next season. Djakadam is only a six year old and the improvement he has made from the Hennessy to the Thyestes to Cheltenham is phenomenal. He put any stamina doubts to rest yesterday and while I couldn’t have had him at the prices yesterday, he certainly delivered on the hype. Road To Riches is another to have come a long way in the past year and who is to say there’s not more to come from him too.

A huge well done to the Bradstocks for what was a brave decision: if it had backfired they were wide open for what would likely be widespread criticism. You can’t but like Coneygree’s attitude and there’s something I think every racing fan admires about a horse who goes he does from the front.

Well done Zamarston

I see Timeform agree with you about Carruthers’s gruelling races Joe.

Interesting…what did they say?