- This topic has 34 replies, 1 voice, and was last updated 6 years, 5 months ago by
.
- Posts
I thought we ought to have opinions regarding this and after Mrsraymo giving me an ear bashing because she backed Clondaw!! LOL
Before stating my opinion let me say this is not my pocket talking because I backed Champagne at Tara at 25/1 and Caid Du Lin at 7/1 who finished third and fourth in the end !
I think that you cannot DQ Copeland and not DQ Diego for the simple reason that Diego forced Copeland to not be able to jump the fence! I think somebody on the TV (Mick Fitz) said they had their whip in the wrong hand which made it hard to correct Diego’s wandering. If this is so then surely it becomes a careless riding issue and not just a horse was unlucky issue.
Opinions please
And I know there is probably nothing in the rules regarding this as far as jumping the fence is concerned but to my mind the jockey was at fault and should have been dealt with appropriately.I backed Diego du Charmil on Saturday, so naturally I am pleased he kept the race! However, I admit I was fully prepared for him to be disqualified and surprised that he kept the race.
I do not think it was anyone’s fault and I am not sure the jockey could have done much about it. I am satisfied he jumped the fence but there is no doubt that he knocked another horse out of the race when it was still in with a chance. It was clearly not deliberate but I am not sure it should matter.
It was an unusual incident and I doubt it sets any kind of precedent but it does look a bit strange when a horse can force another runner through the wing of a fence and keep the race!
Here’s what I wrote elsewhere- bear in mind pocket talking as I backed the winner.
Capeland started it! He spotted the loose horse first and tried to follow it, Bryony hadn’t time to change her stick over but pulled his head round to the right to try to switch right behind DDC ( and, if she’d been a stride further back or DDC had stayed straight for one more stride, she would have done it).
I reckon DDC saw Capeland drifting in his rearview and followed suit, even though he was in front. But agree poor Capeland had no chance and if DDC hadn’t barged him then Bryony would have got him over. He still would’ve only come second mind you …but I would say that wouldn’t I?
DDC jumped the fence and was within the flag. I don’t think you can DQ him for reckless riding as jockey aimed him straight and wasn’t attempting to take Capeland’s ground- perhaps he should have reacted one stride earlier but I don’t think think he deliberately failed to act.
Capeland also within the flag (assume that’s what the whippy white plastic thing was?). I think the rules out to be amended such that if you have red on your right and white on your left, you’re good! Although I suppose if a previous horse splats the flag then that would stuff you up so that’s probably why they can’t have that rule, unlike in eventing.
I don’t think Capeland should have 9th beside his name, he should have a more honourable CO.
Capeland went straight the whole time until DDC forced him to go left, i can’t have that reasoning at all.
I’m with you Raymo for all the reasons you said – DDC should have been chucked 100%. This gives precedent to push horses out of the wings going forward.
There was no advantage to DDC though. If he stayed straight, he would have won and as it was he was good (and lucky) to get back up to win. I don’t agree that it sets a precedent for encouraging jockeys to shove each other through wings because
a) they don’t want to kill each other and
b) It would almost always risk their own horse. Who in their right mind would deliberately allow or encourage their horse to ram another two strides from a chase fence? So dangerous and at best they would compromise their own horse’s chance, as DDC’s was compromised on Saturday.Anyway, you couldn’t really do it deliberately on a normally straight-jumping horse without it being crashingly obvious. The only horse you could do it on anywhere near reliably would be the likes of Yorkhill and any jockey who tries to go through a narrow gap between Yorkhill and the left side of a fence is a damn fool.
The only precedent that comes to mind is Dr Leunt in the 1995 Triumph although there have probably been several since.
As far as I assumed, the horse must stay on the track lest it be disqualified. Diego may well have jumped the larger part of the fence but his hind legs strayed from the course. While discretion isn’t necessarily a bad thing, I prefer clarity over ambiguity. If my understanding of a horse staying on the track is correct, Diego should have been disqualified and Capeland was carried out.
Does anybody have the relevant guidelines to hand?
his hind legs strayed from the course.
It’s not a dressage arena or a rugby touchline though- where’s the edge? Remember that race a few years ago where the horse cleared off towards the stables but got dragged back on course by the jockey and, IIRC, got up to win? Can’t find it as can’t remember its name. It was a right handed UK chase course I think.
DDC rose on the take off side, jumped the birch, stayed within the wings and landed on the landing side. How could he be disqualified for taking the wrong course?
Should he have been DQ for forcing Capeland out? That’s another question and one I couldn’t answer. But Capeland should not have been DQ, and had the stewards considered the two events (interference and taking the wrong course) in chronological order, how could it be justice to DQ him? That’s like a court finding a murdered man guilty of being an accessory to his own death.
Both should have been DQ’d. Diego for causing interference and Capeland for not jumping the last. Even though not his fault he didn’t jump the last. How DDC cannot be DQ’d after carting his main rival out the race I have no idea (although I do appreciate it wasn’t intentional).
Capeland didn’t jump the fence so regardless of whether he was at fault or not he can’t be considered a finisher.
For me DDC should have been disqualified. I don’t think it’s possible to have impeded a horse more than he he did in that race. I wonder if connections of the runner up are considering an appeal.
Biggest surprise though was the smile on Lorcan Williams face after the race. I can’t imagine Paul Nicholas was smiling after seeing a one two go up in smoke and Capeland potentially injured.
No matter how a horse is carried out, apparently the rules say that is has to be disqualified. It’s a bit like committing a foul during the football match and yet the victim is shown the yellow/red card. That can’t be 100% logic.
There should be softer guidelines in the rule book that allow stewards to handle such matters. It was not that Capeland had no intention to jump the fence, he just couldn’t jump it properly since the leader claimed the whole width of the obstacle for himself and forced him wide. If this happens in a Formula One race, guess who gets the Stop and Go penalty?
Absolutely! I wish the head-on replay was available, but I watched the pan replay about a two dozen times. This is a clear case of interference and careless riding by Lorcan. At no point did he switch his whip to his left hand to correct DDC from drifting left. Additionally, did nothing with his reins to keep DDC straight and he clearly had 3-4 strides to do so before making contact/interfering with Capeland.
This from the Stewards Report: The Stewards found that the interference was accidental in that DIEGO DU CHARMIL (FR) had appeared to follow the loose horse in front and hung quickly left-handed despite the rider’s best efforts, taking CAPELAND (FR) considerably off its intended line. As CAPELAND (FR) had been disqualified for taking the incorrect course, the Stewards were unable to consider the placings in respect of the interference.
This explanation is a joke. “Interference was accidental”, no way. The loose horse was approx. 4 lengths in front of DDC as was already bearing out to the left well before DDC was allowed to altered course. Lorcan had it well within his means to ride DDC in the direction of the inner rail which would have avoided the subsequent contact/interference. “Despite the rider’s best efforts”, Lorcan made NO EFFORT to straighten DDC. I understand that Capeland had to be DQ’d for taking the wrong course as a result of being carried out, but DDC should equally have been DQ’d and placed behind Capeland for the interference.
As for whether DDC would have won the race, without the interference, is impossible to say. It would have appeared that Capeland was poised to jump upside DDC and could have very well gone on and won.
Totally agree, DDC should have been disqualified, Capeland was forced wide of the jump, ludicrous he got disqualified when he was so badly impeded.
No. If you disqualify him, you have to look at horses such as Racing Demon, who had a tendency to hang right and sometimes jumped the extremities. You are opening a can of worms. However, I would have liked the jockey to get a warning – tricky, because evasive action could have made the situation worse, but basically he caused interference.
I made two individual posts about this in the big races section as follows:
1. Kept the race but Capeland got disqualified for not jumping the fence – rules don’t cover exactly what happened as the winner was ajudged to have jumped the fence (although he appeared to mostly go between the outer edge of the tallest part of the birch and the plastic wing).
2. One could argue that by the rules of racing the stewards should have also looked at and possibly thrown out the winner for hampering Capeland when in with a winning chance – would have been harsh mainly because the winner has probably seen the lose horse going around the fence and has gone to follow that one but at no point has the jockey tried to switch his whip into his left hand to correct him.
Stewards probably thought that he has in some form jumped the very outer edge of the fences and decided with the rules not catering for this incident they had to leave him as the winner but extremely harsh in following the rules and disqualifying Capeland for not jumping the fence when there was no possible way that he could.
I could see the argument for the stewards going either way with their decision but with the grey area under the rules of what actual constitutes being part of the fence that needs to be jumped, I can understand them being reluctant to dq him.
To me the best way forward may be to simply cut those taller tufty bits of birch at either end of the fence (assuming they are left like that for decorative purposes only) so that the the whole fence is totally level from wing to wing and thus eliminate any doubt – having said that the likelyhood of that specific incident ever happening again is very low as most horses faced with that option would have probably refused to even attempt to go through that part of the birch.
Just watched it
I think the jockey on DDC didn’t see the need to adjust as although the horse was edging left it was a very late jink at the last second from the horse which sharply changed the direction of which he was going and when that happened the jockey had no chance of straightening him up.
I think it was unfortunate more than anything elseGaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
It’s not a dressage arena or a rugby touchline though- where’s the edge?
Since you’re mentioning other sports then it’s worth noting that there’s no ambiguity over the field of play. Tennis, football, bowls, slalom, rugby… Something is either over the line or it isn’t. Indeed in horse racing’s closest relations – greyhounds and track athletics – you step out of line, you’re out of the race. There was an incident at Doncaster in the doggy St Leger recently which invoked such a ruling. Horse Racing would be very unique if it deviated.Remember that race a few years ago where the horse cleared off towards the stables but got dragged back on course by the jockey and, IIRC, got up to win? Can’t find it as can’t remember its name. It was a right handed UK chase course I think.
I think you’re thinking of this;-https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BL7zEXIboW0
In which case you’ll note that the horse never leaves the track and is steered between the flights as that is the correct course.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.