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Saudi Arabia must be the best football league worldwide.
A false equivalency and the cracks are already happening. The LIV golf tour is a perfect example. It won’t be long until it hits all the sports that the Saudi interest’s have invested in.
But FWIW – Per Goggle AI, the average player salary in the EPL is £4.16 million to £4.68 million annually. In the Saudi Pro league the average player salary is around £5 million. Not a big difference and not as much as you might think.
I have more thoughts on British football, at the national level, but I want to stay on topic as much as possible.
Ruby – I agree that Mullins is a top trainer and the placement of Selma De Vary was smart, just like Ethical Diamond’s in last year’s Breeders Cup Turf. But before I am willing to put Mullins at the top of heap, he will continue to have to “poach” more top NH races in France before I put him in the same category of the ones I mentioned. BTW, who did Mullins get Selma De Vary from, Emmanuel Clayeux. I appreciate you helping me to make my point.
Not sure if you have ever owned any race horses (I had a few many years ago), but the first priority was to sell the horse for a profit, minus any who have residual stud/breeding value. The French trainers know this and Mullins owners spend an exceptional amount of money to get a winner. Whether or not he improves them, there is now way for you or me to say, unless you have first hand knowledge from working in the yard. Simple as that. It’s down to basic math and economics.
French owners/trainers do not want to run their horses in the UK and Ireland for lesser purses. The top 10 non handicap NH races in France have a top at €820,000 and #10 is €200,000. In the UK it’s €715,000 and €172,000. In Ireland it’s €350,000 and €100,000. Alright, the UK is close in comparison with France, but Ireland is significantly less. Why chase money abroad, when you can stay at home and earn more? Winx was a perfect example this. Where was Selma De Vary going to run in Ireland for what he won at Auteuil this past Sunday? or at the Punchestown festival?
I respect your knowledge of the sport and am enjoying this colloquy. As you acknowledged that the source of almost all of Mullins superstars are French bred and recruited; why is not the same in France? Why are no French owners buying UK or Irish breds and racing them in France?
In France, none of the current top 20 earners were bred in the UK or Ireland. All were bred at home.
”Sure Mullins is in a different league when it come to racing in the UK and Ireland, but in France he may struggle to keep up with the likes of:
Lageneste & Macaire
Chailiie-Chaille
Leenders
Nicolle
Mele
Clayeux
George & Zetterholm
Just to name a few.”Outside of France, almost nobody in the world would know these names yet they know of Willie Mullins in almost every other racing enthusiast country of the world.
The trainers you list may be good but Willie is a legend. Won the Breeders Cup Turf with a handicap hurdler. Let’s see the names you’ve mentioned equal that feat.
If you look at the most prestigious French NH races you’ll find out that (almost) all of them are staged at Auteuil with the Grand Steeple being the equivalent of the Cheltenham Gold Cup and also the Prix la Haye Jousselin being another worthy target.
I started following NH Racing on a daily basis back in 1991. The two most versatile winners of those races were The Fellow (won twice KG, a Cheltenham Gold Cup, 3rd in the Hennessy) and First Gold who become a GB and IRE regular after winning both races between 1998 and 2000. The latter was very good and had G1 success at Aintree and Punchestown, but the didn’t stand a chance against Best Mate and never figured at Cheltenham in two tries.
What I’m saying is despite the poor prize money most Cheltenham GC winners are more versatile than almost any of the Grand Steeple winners I’ve seen in over 35 years.
The French breed still remains superior by a wide margin, but so does Willie Mullins when it comes to improving horses.And he’ll have no problems brushing aside the likes of George & Zetterholm, Daniela Mele, Aranud Chaille-Chaille and a few more. Macaire and Lageneste and Francois Nicolle are in a league of their own, but Willie would be able to compete with them on a daily basis.
The French breed still remains superior by a wide margin, but so does Willie Mullins when it comes to improving horses.
100% agree.
but Willie would be able to compete with them on a daily basis.
I hope that will be the case, NH racing in France would be better for it.
As for Townend, his ride in the Prix Alain Du Breil was nothing special. He had the best horse and rode him appropriately. Generally speaking, he is a competent rider. As riders go, he would be considered in the top echelon by many, just not me. Great horses make above average riders look like superstars. Remember, it’s always down to the horse.
“But FWIW – Per Goggle AI, the average player salary in the EPL is £4.16 million to £4.68 million annually. In the Saudi Pro league the average player salary is around £5 million. Not a big difference and not as much as you might think.”
The difference being the average player over here would be among the elite over there and the average player over there would struggle to get into division 4
Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
“… but so does Willie Mullins when it comes to improving horses.”
Impossible to prove, as Mullins snaps up young horses after one or two runs. It can’t be proven that these young horses wouldn’t have improved just as much if staying with their original trainers.
The difference being the average player over here would be among the elite over there and the average player over there would struggle to get into division 4
True, but who cares! Last time I checked, this was a horse racing forum.
Impossible to prove, as Mullins snaps up young horses after one or two runs. It can’t be proven that these young horses wouldn’t have improved just as much of staying with their original trainers.
Well said!
”Impossible to prove, as Mullins snaps up young horses after one or two runs. It can’t be proven that these young horses wouldn’t have improved just as much if staying with their original trainers.”
I do remember some horses getting switched from Willies to Paul Nicholls a few years back.
It was a disaster. Stormy Ireland was one of them and didn’t win a single race for Nicholls even when tried at Bangor.
She was switched back to Willie and won a G2 & G1 on her first 2 starts.
One example doesn’t make a point.
If improvement would be so certain, why didn’t the previous connections of so many G1 winners keep the horse? I mean they knew what they had. Why bother selling a guaranteed future G1 winners for maybe just a few hundred thousand pounds or euros?
Do you seriously think that GW would have won that many G1s under Macaire and Lageneste? Maybe a few at Auteuil, but certainly nothing in GB or IRE.
Same applies to Galopin Des Champs. I’m sure Arnaud Chaille-Chaille saw lots of potential in him, but why didn’t he persevere with the horse?
Quevega was a decent, multiple bumper winner at three for Damien De Watrigant. But, it was the switch to Willie, Ruby, David (Casey) that made her the horse she became. Or was Mr. De Watrigant too lazy to keep her sound for another 6-7 years?“If improvement would be so certain, why didn’t the previous connections of so many G1 winners keep the horse?”
Because they were offered a sum of money they found acceptable. It isn’t rocket science.
“but who cares! Last time I checked, this was a horse racing forum.”
You cared enough to Google Ai on it.
I wasn’t that bothered …
Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
I’m with Gladiateur on this one. It’s all down to the economics of racehorse ownership.
Concerning Gaelic Warrior, there is just “too” much speculation as to why Christopher Bryan sold him to the Ricci’s.
1) No evidence of Bryan having a Grade 1 winner.
2) Maybe the horse had physical issues. Last run in France was Jun 21, sent to Mullins in Jan 22. 6 months to heal? 6 months to be prepped for sale? It’s anyone’s guess.
3) Maybe he was a long term “pinhooking” prospect. Perhaps, this is/was the business model for Bryan. His first race was a listed race, so they must have had a high opinion of him, but not enough to persevere. Bryan has only had 5 horses in France, including GW, since 2019 (the others are/were mediocre). Clearly, this is/was a hobby for Bryan and the Ricci’s must have made him an offer he couldn’t refuse.You could say the same thing for Galopin Des Champs.
Sold by Damien Bonne, who is more prominently involved in French harness racing. I would venture a guess that he had no interest in the long-term prospects of GDC. Won a Class 2 in his first start in France. Once his potential for sale became apparent, Bonne had no problem letting him go. This was another classic example of pinhooking.Quevega was plucked from showing ability in modest French province races from Bearn Arabians. Clearly, she was bred/raced to sell. Mission complete.
All three were privately bought for what I would guess were 6-figure sums that were significantly profitable for the previous owners.
In a previous post, I asked if you (Ruby) have ever owned racehorses. You didn’t answer, so I will guess the answer is no. You seem to think that trainers make the call on whether or not to keep or sell a horse. They don’t. At the end of the day, it is irrelevant as to whether or not the French trainers could have improved those horses. What is relevant is how much money the owners earn from the sale.
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