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In my opinion it is a lot harder to pick winners now than it was when I was younger. I don’t know what has brought this about and there are a lot more non runners than there used to be. Saturdays have always been hard from a punting point of view but I find it nearly impossible to pick a winner on a Saturday now. Yet there are still people winning the scoop 6 lucky buggers is all I can say to this. I know Saturdays are a lot more competitive than the rest of the week but this has always been so, yet I can remember say in the sixties picking a lot more winners than I do now. Whatever has caused the difficulty in winner finding is going to kill the golden goose I see a lot more of younger punters who are not interested in having a bet on a horse race but they will bet on other sports e.g. football.golf,boxing and even cricket. So I think it is about time that someone with a bit of influence should have a closer look at horse racing before it dies and make some changes. As for myself gone are the days I would go into a betting shop full of optimism I now put my bet on expecting to lose but I cant help myself because I love the sport and I will have a bet until the day I die which should’ent be long now, someone needs to take the bull by the horns and make a change somewhere or the end is nigh.
Well your right of course, it is a lot harder to pick winners now than it was 10 or 20 years ago.
This started with the competitive racing initiative and has been gradually extended – the demise of novice chases is a graphic example. The BHB thinks that by making racing harder the punter will happily lose more money. As you say this is very short sighted. New punters finding it very hard to win simply drop racing and bet of something else, just as the bookmakers want them to. For some reason the BHB cannot see this.
It’s as easy as it’s ever been to pick winners. Or rather – it’s as easy as it has ever been to make an overall profit (if you can get on).
Punters don’t need to bet in races that don’t suit their style of betting.
For sure Saturdays are (on average) more competitive than they were, with more open handicaps. But (betting one horse in a race) this means you do not need as many winners to profit – with bigger prices……And if wanting “more winners” then nothing stops a punter from betting 2, 3 or 7 or 8 horses in a competitive handicap; effectively taking combined odds of something like 5/4 or odds-on…
…And there are still enough non-handicaps to bet on without needing to bet on any Saturday handicap. I seldom bet in big flat handicaps these days.
Unlike SP and late betting – I’d be surprised if the best price over-round in Early Odds betting is not better than it’s ever been. Giving punters a great chance of showing a profit.
Value Is EverythingWell your right of course, it is a lot harder to pick winners now than it was 10 or 20 years ago.
This started with the competitive racing initiative and has been gradually extended – the demise of novice chases is a graphic example. The BHB thinks that by making racing harder the punter will happily lose more money. As you say this is very short sighted. New punters finding it very hard to win simply drop racing and bet of something else, just as the bookmakers want them to. For some reason the BHB cannot see this.
A) When novice chases were less competitive it was directly mirrored by shorter prices. So punters needed more winners to profit than they do now. ie Less competitive races don’t give punters any greater chance of showing an overall profit. For some reason some punters can not see this.
B) Bookmakers only want more competitive races because more money is taken in them. ie Most punters do not want to bet in uncompetitive novice chases (because of the shorter prices). It makes perfect sense (whenever possible) to achieve competitive racing to attract as much money as possible for the levy AND at the same time giving a greater number of punters what they want. So if you don’t like it Paul – blame your fellow punters, not the BHA or bookmakers.
Value Is EverythingIn the sixties , there were no exchamges , the game was straighter , and crucially only a couple of meetings per day …you could really study the form
Today its impossible , football is easier to bet on , much more fun , and yes 100 per cent punter friendly
Someone needs to get the finger out !!!
I dont know who this Ginger is , but boy is he living in a bubble ….
I don’t suppose there’s ever been a time when consistently beating the book has been easy, but nowadays with instant detailed form, video replays of every race, exchanges betting to practically zero percent, and a bigger percentage of favourites winning than ever before surely makes it as good a time as any to plunge onto one !! Anyone remember in the pre broadcast days when a jockey on a ‘good thing’ would come down ‘out in the country’ ? I can, I’ve been on one or two in my time !!
In the sixties , there were no exchamges , the game was straighter , and crucially only a couple of meetings per day …you could really study the form
LOL
In the 60’s there was:
Nowhere near as much camera patrol film.
Was one well known case of a jockey going around Chepstow in fog, stopped, waited for them to come around again, joined in and won the race.
There was no TV coverage in Betting Shops let alone two Racing Channels RUK and ATR to look for sculduggery.
Bookmkers kept information about clients far too private. They are not allowed to do so these days.
There’s a far better paper trail nowadays which has made it far easier to spot foul play.Just because you did not hear of the sculduggery in the 60’s does not mean it did not go on. In fact it was almost impossible to spot in those days – so highly probable it was rife.
Why does anyone need to bet on every race?
It does not matter if there’s “just a couple of meetings per day” or five meetings in a day; what stops punters “really studying form” on one or two meetings of the five (or whatever)?
Value Is EverythingI dont know who this Ginger is , but boy is he living in a bubble ….
It’s a wonderful life, living in this bubble. I am someone who makes a very good, consistent overall profit (a living) from studying form, with no inside information what so ever. Something that would be absolutely impossible if sculduggery was as prolific as you suggest Pathindmarsh.
Value Is EverythingToday its impossible , football is easier to bet on , much more fun , and yes 100 per cent punter friendly
Racing is easy(ish) when you know how to evaluate form in to chance.
I’ve seen very doubtful football matches where players seem to put in half-hearted efforts when there’s very little to play for. You’d almost think a particular scoreline was agreed beforehand. Also seen a game where a draw was all that was needed for one team to win the league and the other to escape relegation. After around 85 minutes of a boring match, that looked like a “you have the ball”. “No, you have the ball”, where nobody seemed interested in scoring. Then one player took a speculative shot from well outside the box. Happened to go in. You’d expect the scorer and team to be extatic; but no – he seemed embarrassed and team mates hardly congratulated him. The other team seemed angry they’d had had the audacity to score. Guess what happened next? Straight from kick off they passed it between themselves with no serious challenges; going straight up the other end and scoring 1-1. 😉Value Is EverythingThere is a huge amount of ego involved in sports betting, as I suppose there has to be if you embark on something knowing that less than 10% make a profit. I think some of the comments here are pure ego, as if to say “I’m great at this, but I’m not winning, therefore nobody can win without being bent.”
It’s also classic addictive behaviour, trying to blame external factors for your losses. “I’m not winning, but it’s [highlight as applicable] The BHA / bent jockeys / bent trainers / too much racing / bookies / all-weather racing / too many runners / too few runners…who are to blame”.
Could it be that you’re just a rubbish punter? 😉
This sounds like delusional muppetry YF….I will spell it out
I would like to do a 6 horse accum all 4/6 or slightly shorter ….but the complications for having confidence in any one of them winning is massive
Whereas …I can very easily find 6 matches , out of all football leagues, spain , Hilland , Italy , Germany , and the UK to score 2 goals per game , and hey presto I get 1047 for my 50 quid
Its so much easier than racing , so my point is , the Rust geezer, wants to get a five per centincrease in punter betting on horses , well matey you need to think of some way to make it more attractive than the example I have given
Of the young blokes I know….9 out of ten bet on football , mention racing and they say ..your having a laugh
so what is the future 25 years from now ??
I have a close friend who bets in the hundreds ( never below ) and sometimes
in the thousands . He takes any loss very badly and chews over it for days on end.He asked me where he was going wrong when one particular bet he had struck went down the
pan. I answered by asking him how he came to pick the horse in question and why
he fancied . He proceeded to bore me for the next ten minutes about draw, ground,
jockey, jockey form, horse form , trainer form , course etc.My response : why did he over-cook the egg and neglect the bloomin’ obvious.
The horse he backed was Canford Cliffs ( £1.5k to win ) the 2O11 Sussex Stakes.
I, like may thousand of other ordinary souls backed the winner of the race – because
it was the OBVIOUS choice. Don’t over complicate things .
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
A winning machine he was, but a freak twas he. Though, a good adage, Himself. Though, in application it will vary.
If football was so easy, Ri…pathindmarsh why are you on here worrying yourself with horse racing? You should be rolling the dosh and leaving racing in the dust as you wheel spin away into the sunshine in your new Bentley.
How are ten young blokes you know and your own betting preferences relevant to the future of racing?
Football is the sport with the highest turnover in the UK sports betting industry. It may be easier to find seemingly appealing betting opportunities and accas with juicy potential returns, but there is a reason that bookies are very happy to lay those bets.
The bookies had a tough week in the football season just gone when 19 of the top 20 ‘spots’ (i.e. the 20 worst results for the industry in a Saturday of European football) all won. Think of the muggy accas, all the tweets from your mates screenshotting their returns, all the payouts etc. I was quoted that the probability of such an event ran way into the millions and hadn’t hit the industry since the late ’90s.
With that rarity in mind, I don’t think racing should strive to put people under any illusions. People need to know that this isn’t a sport for reckless punting on a fistful of 1/2 shots. It is a cerebral challenge, where you refine your methods for your whole life, try to beat the bookies in the value game and earn profit only if you put the work in. It’s difficult to win and we should relish that – that’s why the likes of Tom Segal and Hugh Taylor are aspirational figures. People should want to look up to the winners, become one and become the hero of their mates, their forum or wherever they talk about racing.
In my opinion, Rust and his team should look to make more of the challenge, rather than dupe people into slapdash betting en masse. Make people competitive, encourage people to debate form publicly and ally their money to their opinions, make people strive to out-think the traders rather than trying to lucksack a big win before spewing it all back. Being right is fun. Being clever is fun. Beating people is fun. I think that should be the undertone of the sport’s marketing going forward.
In the sixties , there were no exchamges , the game was straighter , and crucially only a couple of meetings per day …you could really study the form
Today its impossible , football is easier to bet on , much more fun , and yes 100 per cent punter friendly
Someone needs to get the finger out !!!
I dont know who this Ginger is , but boy is he living in a bubble ….
I’ll tell you who Ginger is. He bets full time and makes a healthy profit, proven by his posts of selections on here. I’ve an idea, why don’t you just post your football bets on here and we will see how good you are… no I thought not.
You’ve done pretty well for a new member on here ( if that’s what you are), only six posts and already insulted several longstanding mmbers.
Perhaps you should learn that it is not how many winners you back that counts, it’s how much profit you make.
Unlike SP and late betting – I’d be surprised if the best price over-round in Early Odds betting is not better than it’s ever been. Giving punters a great chance of showing a profit.
Something doesn’t ring true with you Gingertipster. You’re apparently a pro punter who consistently makes a profit yet you are forever trumpeting bookmakers and what value can be had with them.
It is common knowledge that bookmakers don’t entertain people like you, these bogus early odds that you state are such good value are only available to regular losers not regular winners like your good self.
Most bookmakers should be done under the trades description act but out of these “bookmakers” which do you regularly bet with Gingertipster?
Coral – Power – Boyles – Chandler – Betfair Sportsbook – Betfred – Betway- Bet 365?
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