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I don’t KNOW that he’s a superstar, but blimey I hope he is. Racing can always use a hero!
He’s looked sooo impressive.
Can anyone tell me which other good horses that currently excel at 2 miles were missing from this tingle creek line up? I’m just trying to picture who’ll be in the queen mother at cheltenham. If there are no significant others that weren’t in the Tingle Creek Nicholls could put Kauto Star in that for a warm up! :o
Ok, maybe a slight exaggeration, but an amazing thought isn’t it!
my speed ratings are crude in comparison to some peoples but they are a great betting aid and have helped me make money for seasons now, (not life changing amounts but enough to keep me interested) and i use them as guides along with race reading to show me the class of an animal.<br> <br>In the last 6 years i have had only one chase with a higher speed figure (2004 tingle creek- Moscow flyer) than saturdays run and try as i might i can’t put a dampner on it. And this over an an inadequate 2 mile?  I find it quite probable he is the best chaser i may have seen in my limited racing career, though in all probabilty will never be at a price for me to back now.
Incidently as with the same card 2 years ago, the huge speed ratings also found me the arkle winner that year in Contraband, when  you compared it with the tingle run was favourable for a novice and i’m as sure up to this point as one can be that Fair Along will be my Arkle bet come march.
<br>We lost Best Mate & Rooster Booster last year and then Moscow Flyer, Baracouda, Solerina, Limestone Lad & Rhinestone Cowboy were all retired so the sport really needed a superstar to come through. And what a superstar he is!
KS was almost the forgotten horse at the start of the season and yet after 3 mesmeric performance in 6 weeks, he is now possibly the best horse that some of us have ever seen!
I know that it’s easy with hindsight but I’m really kicking myself about not the 7-1 about him for the OoM at the beginning of the season especially after Nicholls said he would have a busy campaign:o but at least I’ve got him in my 10-to-follow:biggrin:
Impressive, but as DJ has already asked, what did he beat? Still think his jumping will crack on faster ground.
JohnJ.
DJ asked that question though with his tongue firmly in his cheek whilst mmocking the non-believers!
How anyone can crib that performance is beyond me? Some people are just never satisfied are they?! A horse that has won two major races at two vastly different trips with maybe one slight mistake in jumping, and people are still confused. The thing is a machine and anything that beats him this season over any trip (barring maybe a good/fast ground 2m) will have well and truly earned his/her spurs.
I was exceedingly doubtful about his ability to beat VPU over 2m, even given that is was his FTO this season. But he didn’t just beat him – he annhialated him! Admittedly, there wasn’t much else in the field (although I felt sorry for Central House) in behind, but the majority of them will be lining up in the 2m in March.
I love taking on odds-on shots but I will be leaving this one well alone for the rest of the season.
However, I though VPU ran really well in defeat, and will improve. 7/2 for the QM seems a little short in my opinion but we’ll see. And I thought Fair Along did the job very well, under a very good ride by Johnson. He looks a very good candidate for the Arkle.
I know DJ! I’m not cribbing the performance, as I said very impressive. However he is not proven that he is the best chaser in 20 years, which some people are saying here.
Another question, is VPU a good horse or a very good horse? I mean the 2m novice divsion last year were no world beaters. Actually I’d argue that the 2m division is quite poor in general, no Well Chief, Moscow and Azerty retired.
JohnJ.
But on the other hand, well chief, azerty and moscow were probably three exceptional horses running in this division at the same time. Well, Moscow certainly was…
I think that was a rare event in itself and not what i would call an average yardstick for quality in this division
Clivex,
I wouldn’t either, but based on performances beating average horses, how can people declare KS to be the best chaser in 20 years!!!!
JohnJ.
GH,
I know you are the chairman of the Beef or Salmon fan club, but he never has run a race in the UK that could equal his record in Ireland. If you are rating KS by this performance, you are obviously ignoring the fact that Ollie Magern was a length behind BoS.
If trying your trying to compare Desert Orchid and KS at this stage of KS’s career your of your potts. Wait until he has beaten some top class chasers then I will accept that argument.
JohnJ
Good post GH. We all know exxactly what he’s beating – exposed animals like L’Ami and Oneway – it’s how far and easily he’s beating them that’s the point.
Quote: from bear on 9:45 pm on Dec. 2, 2006[br]Regarding KS making the odd mistake, Arkle used to do the same occasionally – remember the oft shown bulldozing of the fence in front of the stands in his 3rd gold cup. He also used to jump to the left  when not meeting a fence on a perfect stride, and if you watch the famous 1st Gold Cup win he was out jumped by Mill House on several occasions. His sheer brilliance as a galloping machine enabled him to overcome the odd abberation and perhaps KS may be cut from something like the same cloth.<br>
That’s an interesting point, bear. Though, it occurs to me also that he might not have quite the robust  temperament Arkle seemed to have.
(Edited by Grimes at 10:31 pm on Dec. 4, 2006)
Even Dessie used to make errors. These type of horses attack their fences and will always make the odd error.
Quote: from Grasshopper on 1:48 pm on Dec. 4, 2006[br]<br>As for these ‘top-class’ chasers you suggest that KS needs to beat in order to ‘prove’ himself – War of Attrition apart – who are these mythical beasts?
And as for War Of Attrition himself – perm any line you want from the Gold Cup (L’Ami) or Down Royal (Beef Or Salmon), and Kauto Star has him cooked.
Kauto Star wins two Grade 1 chases in three weeks – one over 2m and one over 3m – and people still won’t believe what their eyes and the formbook tells them.
What else does this horse have to do?
(Edited by Grasshopper at 1:50 pm on Dec. 4, 2006)<br>
GH,
As I have said he is a very good horse, could be a huge star, which of course I would welcome. Not denying he is special, any horse is special who wins a grade one race. He is obviously more special than that, but remember Edredon Blue won grade ones over 2m and 3m, and in my view more prestigious grade ones.
Anyhow, one of my bones of contention is that some people on this forum seem to think that KS will stuff Kicking King and WoA come Gold Cup time. Oh, and he is one of the best chasers in 20 years, at this stage, thats just hogwash.
Also, Grassy, to read the form of the Nicholson and say KS will have WoA cooked is just ridiculous. I actually backed BoS that day, he loves those conditions. WoA needs good ground, am sure you will back BoS over WoA in the Gold Cup.
JohnJ.<br>
There’s a difference between winning Grade 1’s at 2m and 3m and being the Champion Chaser at both distances. Even in his Championship Chase winning season, it would be hard to describe Edredon Bleu as the best two miler that year, that accolade surely deserving to Flagship Uberalles for his Tingle Creek and Victor Chandler performances. WHilst when he won the King George, he wasn’t the best 3 miler in his stable, never mind the best in Britain and Ireland. If a 17+ length beating of Beef or Salmon and L’Ami fails to impress you, I’m surprised you are so impressed by Edredon’s length and a quater win over Tiutchev. <br>
(Edited by davidjohnson at 11:06 am on Dec. 5, 2006)
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