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More people blinded by Gosden’s authoratative posh voice equating to talking sense.
Listening to him speak you would think he was the world’s leading authority on all things racing, when the reality is that he is a competent trainer who has done moderately with some of the finest bloodstock money can buy.
That’s rubbish, when Sheikh Mohammed brought him back from the US he was not getting the best bred yearlings they were still going to Cecil. Stoute, Fabre and Cumani. Then Godolphin came along and that operation got the best
John Gosden imo is currently the best british flat trainer operating, ahead of Stoute.
Actually I am sort of related to Steve but im not sure what the correct term is.
He is my Dads Cousin so what that makes me i am not sure.
Their are a lot of trainers who he enjoys going to visit and some who can be a bit awkward so i wont put any names up incase i get done for libel.
Bumped into him on Saturday at Haydock and over the years he has taken me to a few intersting places
Jack Berry when he was still training on a morning visit to see them galloping which was a real treat.
Doncaster October Sales on a Friday night when a friend of his had a yearling to sell
James Givens Yard when he had his first horse in training on Lincoln Day when I Cried For You ran in the race and was 2nd.
He knows full well that i have a bigger passion for jumps racing as opposed to flat but i still get a free copy of his books which is a bonus and has a massive knowledge of Stallions,Dams and Breeding.
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I think people forget that the first thing a trainer learns when handling the media is the art of lying without lying. The odd one like Paul Cole tells it as it is and he should be admired for it not slagged off. He is a great believer in loyalty to his owners and there’s nothing wrong with that.
Trainers often say say something to the media which is total rubbish and the reason they have said is they have already told the owner the same rubbish. Not every owner is told the truth and trainers will lie to them to keep their interest up. Some because they are dependent on fees, will even keep a horse in training and BS there way round the owner for a couple of years even if they think it will never win.
So trusting everything a trainer says is a very dangerous game when it comes to betting.
Much also depends on who the owner a horse is on how much they will make public. If he likes a punt the last thing the trainer is going to do is tell some reporter or tipster the horse e.g. is a good thing at Newmarket on Friday.
I have read stable tours, interviews etc and quite frankly trainers don’t really say much. They might say so and so which cost $5 million is coming on well and I think he could be a group horse in time. Which tells you about zero the Racing Post won’t tell you when the horse runs.
You can pick up things like "He will need a trip" or whatever that helps but nothing specific.
I don’t think we as punters are entitled to be told anything and should be grateful if we are. We go racing we get good entertainment for a fee and if we gamble we do so to try and make money and don’t give a thought to supporting racing.
Not a very useful book at all. A good idea and a good effort, but trainers comments in the public domain are pointless. All trainers like all 2yos in the spring.
A more useful exercise would be if Taplin could actually have a look at the horse himself and tell us if he thinks it is any good. Have a look at its size, development, conformation. Watch it walk and hopefully gallop and let us know if it is going to be capable of winning a maiden when fit.
Grateful to be told anything??????
Thats madness. Punters are the sports customers every bit as much (if not more economically) than the owners. what business would survive such an attitude? Barely excusable when racing was dominated the market, but it doesnt….
Punters will find other sports if that short sighted view prevaled
and they do….
As for trainers "liking a punt", no doubt many do, but the top guys (which is where taplins books focus is)? Are they really that bothered or even have the time?
Trainers will lie just as football managers do, but its crazy to ignore every last word on the basis that it could be crap….
This thread brings to mind a couple of passages from Kate Fox’s “The Racing Tribe”:
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Trainers, like tribal shamans, witch-doctors and rain-makers, are regularly credited with performing miracles when they are successful, but very rarely blamed when they are unsuccessful………When a horse wins a race, you will often hear the win described as “an impressive training performance by Henry Cecil”, or “a truly outstanding training feat from David Nicholson, who has worked wonders with this horse”, or “ a magnificent training performance from John Dunlop, who has brought this horse to a peak at exactly the right moment”.
When a horse loses however, even when it is an odds-on favourite with no convincing excuses, you will never ever hear a commentator say “Well, that was a poor training performance by Luca Cumani, who really hadn’t got the filly properly fit for this race”, or “Bad judgement by Martin Pipe, who should have known this horse wouldn’t stay three miles.” Such comments would be unthinkable, almost blasphemous.
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…trainers, as tribal shamans, enjoy a particularly exalted position in the social structure of the racing tribe, which overrides the economic realities of their financial dependence on the owners.
Probably the most striking illustration of this exalted status that I witnessed during my fieldwork was at Epsom on Derby Day……My colleague and I were standing on the lawn in front of the Queen’s Stand, observing the crowds….he was idly scanning the balconies of the private boxes through his binoculars when he suddenly stopped and said…
“Why is the Queen being so deferential to that bloke next to her? Look, look at the body language, the submissive posture, the way she’s looking up at him, the respectful gestures, attention signals, everything. I’ve never seen her behave like that before. This is really weird. I mean, who could possibly be higher status than the Queen ? “
“Oh, that’ll be her trainer”, I said automatically.
“How do you know ? You can’t possibly see from here without bonoculars. And you’re not even looking”.
“I’ll look if you like, but it can only be her trainer”.
I took the binoculars and saw, as expected, the Queen nodding and smiling meekly at the imposing, confident figure on her left who was, of course, her trainer…
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Maybe some trainers see value in preserving that mystique. Pull back the curtain and the Wizard of Oz is a lot less impressive.
As a matter of interest, how would folk feel if the Cole quote had instead come from bin Suroor ?
best regards
wit
OuijaBoard.
What kind of book would it be if Steve Taplin wrote just what he thought about how a horse walked, cantered or galloped.
I doubt if Mr Taplin would have seen 50% of the horses he mentions in his book.He obtains the views of the most important person in the horses early life.
The ones that see them walk , broken in and take the first ever gallop. Invaluable information I would suggest.It may suprise you but many trainers describe some of the horses as backward, will not run until the second half of the year, may not even run as a 2 y.o., will not run until guaranteed heavy ground etc etc.
The horses Mr Taplin listed as the ones to follow at the front of the book which he choose from thousands of horses before any had run include the favourites for the 2 yo races at Royal Ascot. So his judgement was correct.
Whist no one has to give opinions on horses they train the elitest view that Paul Cole is out dated has just shows what he thinks of those that pay towards his prize money pool.
Taplin does not want any trainer to say ‘this will win first time out so tell you readers to lump on’ though many have done so in the past.
When anyone reads anything about the majority of unraced 2 year olds in any newspaper most of the information given would have come this book.
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