- This topic has 59 replies, 25 voices, and was last updated 17 years, 2 months ago by
.
- Posts
Does anyone know where I can get odds on him to collapse from a reoccurence of his heart problem?
No Morals or Badblokes?
Just kidding obviously!
How the hell is betting on a horse to be pulled up immoral, sorry Ginger im normally with you on most posts but this is crazy. Should a horse be batterd towards the finish when it can hardly jump and run through sheer tiredness, I am sure the saftey of the horse comes first and not to leave any mental/physical scars so pulling it up is the wise option
Of course a horse should be pulled up if he has no chance of finishing in the money. The point is nobody would take 3/1 (it would be poor value) Denman being pulled up if there was not the possibility of the injury returning, being distressed. Therefore to win or earn money from that market is (imo) immoral.
But each to his own.
Mark
Value Is EverythingI don’t know whether it can be construed as immoral. Insensitive maybe, given Denman’s condtion. However, bookmakers do lay odds on whether a horse will complete the Grand National course – slightly different circumstance I know, but some of them do get pulled up.
I must admit that the thought of Denman ( should he run ) being pulled up – ala Istabraq, had crossed my mind. If he does run, let’s just hope he runs a good race and does himself justice on the day.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
You want some stats 8 seasons
Completed race 198761
Did not complete race 53154 (includes CO|R|BD|F|PU|UR|SU)PU on its own 38167
- Total Posts 17716
Layers are winning every day on horses being pulled up and non triers, could this not be deemed immoral?
Layers are winning every day on horses being pulled up and non triers, could this not be deemed immoral?
No, they are not betting on a horse being distressed.
If they were betting on every horse in the race I’d have no problem with it. But they’re not. If the horse had not had problems there would not be a market.
Mark
Value Is EverythingInstructions to jockey:
"Look, son, our other horse is going to romp home so be easy on this guy, just go through the motions with the whip and as soon as he brushes a fence take a good hard look at his hind legs, make sure the cameras catch that, then wave the reins and bounce up and down for effect and then pull him up and quickly dismount and don’t forget to look disconsolate. When the reporters interview you just tell them that you thought he’d gone lame or broken a blood vessel but you didn’t like the sound of his breathing. There’s a nice little earner in it for you.""Hello, is that Skybet? I’d like fifty grand on……………..
(A work of fiction and a vivid imagination. All horseracing is straight)
Instructions to jockey:
"Look, son, our other horse is going to romp home so be easy on this guy, just go through the motions with the whip and as soon as he brushes a fence take a good hard look at his hind legs, make sure the cameras catch that, then wave the reins and bounce up and down for effect and then pull him up and quickly dismount and don’t forget to look disconsolate. When the reporters interview you just tell them that you thought he’d gone lame or broken a blood vessel but you didn’t like the sound of his breathing. There’s a nice little earner in it for you.""Hello, is that Skybet? I’d like fifty grand on……………..
(A work of fiction and a vivid imagination. All horseracing is straight)
What is your point Ken?
Are you saying you think this might happen?
Because it has nothing to do with my arguement, whether it is moral or immoral.Mark
Value Is EverythingGingertipster, I wouldn’t know a moral if it hit me in the face, perhaps. Though, at a guess, and as you so pertinently ask, I suppose the point is, not whether the circumstances I describe might or might not apply, but that it is rather naieve of anyone who participates in gambling to expect or demand from others any semblance of a moral code. Your thread begged for a tongue in cheek response which I believe it got. It’s great that you possess a moral framework and I’m sure there are many forumites similarly inclined but it’s my belief that morals come from within and to impose sanctions on another party because, in your opinion, they are behaving immorally is a somewhat evangelical fundamentalist approach. Do unto others as you would have done unto yourself. Cast not the first stone. An immoral bird in the hand……..
Got to be a good thing that bet as soon as Kauto passes him thats it. I would say theres more chance of him pulling up than winning.
I dont think that it’s immoral, being pulled up is a possible outcome and skybet are giving that option to those who strongly believe that will be the outcome. I dont think that it is immoral, because denman looked a shadow of his former self last time and harry findlay himself (after being so vocal last year about "the tank" winning) has seemed very downhearted when talking about denman this season.
I disagree with the earlier statement that "if denman wasnt fully fit they wouldnt run him", of course they would run him, it’s the gold cup, are they going to keep him off and just wait for next years? Not likely IMO…
I personally wouldnt do this bet because I think that if any horse is likely to pull up I cant see it being denman, as even an under par denman would just keep galloping on so would probably want 10-1 to play.
- Total Posts 17716
There are any number of reasons why Denman, or indeed any other participant, could pull up, so I fail to see how offering it as a betting option is in any way immoral. All Skybet are doing are offering odds about every possible eventuality, which they would have to do to make the market fair.
Gingertipster, I wouldn’t know a moral if it hit me in the face, perhaps. Though, at a guess, and as you so pertinently ask, I suppose the point is, not whether the circumstances I describe might or might not apply, but that it is
rather naieve of anyone who participates in gambling to expect or demand from others any semblance of a moral code
. Your thread begged for a tongue in cheek response which I believe it got. It’s great that you possess a moral framework and I’m sure there are many forumites similarly inclined but it’s my belief that
morals come from within
and to
impose sanctions on another party because, in your opinion, they are behaving immorally is a somewhat evangelical fundamentalist approach. Do unto others as you would have done unto yourself. Cast not the first stone. An immoral bird in the hand…….
.
Why shoudn’t we all have a "moral code"? Whether it is as a gambler or not. We all must draw the line somewhere. May be my line is in a different place to most forumites.
You say "morals come from within", where else would they come from Ken?
There are surely markets a bookmaker should not make. Would it be wrong to object to a bookmaker giving odds for:
A particular horse that has had leg problems, breaking a leg in a certain race?
A horse with heart problems dropping down dead in a race?
How long Obama will last before he’s shot dead?
What day Jade Goody dies?Where would you draw the line Ken? Would the bookmakers be right to produce any market if people wanted to bet on the outcome? Or would it be an evangelical fundamentalist thing to make a stand or to try and stop it?
Just because I draw the line sooner than you, does not make me an evangelical fundamentalist. Or the athiest / humanist equivalent, as i am not religous. Though "do unto others" does seem a rather good way to go about life.
Mark
Value Is Everything
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.