The home of intelligent horse racing discussion
The home of intelligent horse racing discussion

Thyestes 2017

Home Forums Big Races – Discussion Thyestes 2017

Viewing 17 posts - 1 through 17 (of 38 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #1282684
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16034

    Love this race, but has been a bit of a nightmare for me over the years, and the rot was only stopped last year by My Murphy, who did me proud on the day at decent odds. He looks like taking his chance again, though life will be more difficult with the rise in the weights, though in his favour is the fact that this is probably his season goal.

    List of entries………..

    http://www.racingpost.com/horses2/cards/card.sd?race_id=667483&r_date=2017-01-26&big_race=Y&raceTabs=#raceTabs=lc_

    It looks a very difficult race to take a strong view on, even a week away, with the usual mix of JP & Gigginstown contenders in there, but I’ll have a look at some that stick out. A lot of the odds on offer do look on the skinny side though, so not a race to go mad on at this stage.

    Roi Des Francs – Set to shoulder top weight, and though I’m not convinced he’s the best horse in the race, he did look very good earlier last year, and holds a Gold Cup entry. He’ll win a decent pot sooner rather than later I reckon, but I’m not sure it’ll be here off of top weight. 25’s

    Champagne West – There’s no doubting this horse has always had the ability, but his achilles heel has always been his jumping. After a pleasing comeback in last seasons Caspian Caviar, the old errors resurfaced, and his season fizzled out. Cue a switch to Henry De Bromhead, a trainer with a fine reputation for getting them jumping, and he got Champagne his first win for a while, with a much smoother round last time at Tramore. That was a decent enough race, and very much a step in the right direction. I’m not entirely convinced he’ll end up here, but if he does indeed retain all his previous ability, then his mark is very workable. 14’s

    Wounded Warrior – Another horse who has lost his way a bit, and his comeback run last time was poor. He looked destined for the top a couple of years back, but has just a few questions to answer now, and I think he’s had his fair share of problems. He does have a Gold Cup entry though, and considering the ammunition Giggs have at their disposal, that may be telling. Very risky, but that’s reflected in his price. 25’s

    Pleasant Company – A horse I followed closely last year, and his win at The Punchestown Festival last year, not only finished my season off on a high, but also suggested a lot more to come, it was an impressive win. I have very high hopes for him this year, and I’m convinced there’s a big race in him. He’s close to my #1 for this, and but for him being taken out of a few races already this season, then I’d probably be getting stuck in. 14’s

    Gallant Oscar – Very solid horse, but I’ll take the chance that Aintree is the long term aim. He could though, land this very easily, and the books aren’t taking any chances. 14’s

    Measureofmydreams – Looked a very nice prospect last year, but his season went off the rails a bit towards the back end of the season. Chance if he can recapture his earlier form from last season, and he did finish 3rd in The 4 Miler at The Festival, but others from Giggs do look more appealing. 12’s

    A Toi Phil – Thought he looked a real live RSA Candidate earlier in the season, but his last couple of runs have shed some doubt on that. It may just be though, certainly off his current mark, that handicaps are the way forward for him, and no surprise to see connections considering this route. Possibilities for sure, and one of the more overpriced runners. 16’s

    Ucello Conti – Ran well in this last year, and but for having taken the “scenic route”, he might have fared even better. His season is surely based around Aintree, but with him very close to not getting in there, then this is a big enough pot in it’s own right. It would be easy to overlook him here, but he looks very well handicapped, and off the same mark as last year, I can easily see him placing, which would surely be enough to get him in The National line up. Strong each way fancy. 16’s

    Rogue Angel – Very much like Ucello Conti, connections have stated that Aintree is the aim this year, though he’s even lower than the Elliot runner, and they’ve got their work cut out for this Irish National winner. Ran a decent enough race in The Paddy Power, and a sudden return to form here, would see him land a nice pot, and qualify for Aintree on a nice mark at the same time. A real dark horse, and a very nice price. 33’s

    Thunder and Roses – Another former Irish National winner, but this trip looks short enough for him these days. Can still throw in the occasional big run, but he’s had many disappointments since his moment of glory at Fairyhouse 2 years ago. Not the most obvious, but worth a second look if Katie Walsh gets the ride. 25’s

    Jetstream Jack – He’s been a bit of a “talking horse” in the past, and though he’s become dependable enough, he’s never really delivered that big prize he promised. Another one of those novices who’s form has been patchy, but as a consequence, does come here on a lenient looking mark, and I think he’s got some room to manoeuvre. Just the type I reckon to pop up in this, and though I was hoping for a better price, he’s definitely considered. 14’s

    Prince of Scars – One of the first names to jump off the page, and with good reason. He had a great time of it in the staying hurdle division last year, and has had a decent start over fences, running well behind strong opposition, on ground nowhere near soft enough for him. He really does appear to prefer it soft, and should the rains come, then he’s chucked in off his current chase mark. The weather forecast doesn’t look too encouraging for him, so very much one to look at on the day. 12’s

    Bonny Kate – Admirable mare who’s only been hit with a 3 lb rise for her excellent run in The Troytown. The 14’s with Sportsbook surely won’t last.

    Rogue Trader – Kept the best of company last year, and wasn’t completely disgraced either, but it’s his 5th in The Troytown that really brings him into this. Was the subject of sustained support in the lead up to that race, and gave supporters a run for their money. Firms are taking no chances this time, and he’s second favourite this time around. 10’s

    The Crafty Butcher – Ahead of Rogue Trader in the betting, and also ahead of him in The Troytown, where he only found Empire of Dirt too good, and no shame in that. One of the lesser known lights from the Willie Mullins yard, but he could easily be a lot higher profile after this, and difficult to argue with his status as clear favourite here. He’s in form, top yard, perfect trip, and on a nice mark, he looks likely to take a hand. 13-2

    Very very difficult to take a strong view on this then, even at this stage, with the race just a week away. I’m normally comfortable enough to oppose the Ante-Post fav’s in these kind of races, but that’s not the case with The Crafty Butcher, who looks solid. Prince of Scars & Pleasant Company were the first 2 to jump off the page, but with Prince of Scars being very ground dependant, and Pleasant Company failing to take up a few options lately, then they make no appeal Ante-Post. I’ll address them should they make it on the day.

    A Toi Phil & Champagne West tick a lot of boxes, but I just have the feeling that they’ll take in other races, while as much as Ucello Conti appeals greatly, I just worry that he’s becoming a “bridesmaid horse”.

    It would make sense to wait as late as possible with this race, considering the potential strength of the favourite, and the added puzzle of the many “lurkers” in there who haven’t been mentioned, but I do like a try in this race, despite my questionable record, and I may take a chance on these two…….

    Jetstream Jack 14’s win
    Rogue Angel 33’s ew

    I just think Jetstream has more to offer than he’s shown so far, and I’d be particularly happy to see Davie Russell up. Rogue Angel is surely due, having ran well last time, and though he needs to step up on that again to book his ticket for Aintree, it’s certainly not beyond him, and he’s one of the few who looks way overpriced.

    As said, I should sit and wait, but will probably give these 2 a go in the next 24 hours.

    GL

    #1282716
    Avatar photoCharlesOlney
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2031

    Thanks for a great write up.

    Always interesting in regards to the Nationals in the Spring. Hedgehunter and Numbersixvalverde both claimed this back before their National triumphs.

    I see Rebecca Curtis has given Bob Ford an entry. I don’t know if he’ll get in but I would love to see connections give it a go for some decent prize money. And if it comes up sufficiently soft then he could have squeak off what could be a feather weight. 33/1 at the moment, but I wouldn’t even imagine having a bet until the final decs are out.

    #1282732
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16034

    Thanks Charles :good:

    Yeah Bob Ford is interesting, and if the heavens opened he’s no 33-1 chance. There’s just the concern of the weather forecast as it is, and also Curtis habitually entering them in these big Irish Handicaps, but them very rarely making the trip.

    I think you’re making a smart move by holding off.

    #1283397
    Avatar photojoliff
    Participant
    • Total Posts 350

    Can’t see CW staying this trip. It good luck if he runs. I’ve backed Prince of Scars, Elliott is simply unstoppable at the moment and this one looks as if his turn is nigh after running some respectable races in top company.

    #1283417
    Avatar photoBigG
    Participant
    • Total Posts 14514

    Rogue Trader at 10/1 for me Bobby, and thanks for another great write up :good:
    I think his last but one race at Punchestown was an eye catching run. He looked all over the
    winner, and when he he was challenged at the last, he simply pulled out more. He was raised 8lbs
    for that, which I think was fair enough considering he won so cosily. I thought last time out,
    in the Paddy Power Chase at Leopardstown last month that he ran another very good looking race,
    and but for a couple of late mistakes would have finished a good bit closer than the running
    on 5th. I think that could be a bit of a godsend, as he gets in here on the same mark of 137.
    He could still be ahead of the handicapper, and will be carrying a featherweight 10-4, or
    thereabouts, depending on who all stand their ground. Good luck with your 2 Bob, I know you were
    hoping for more than the 14s on Jetstream Jack, but I see he’s been getting nibbled at that price
    too this morning. Just as well you held off Charles, Bob Ford won’t be taking his chance. Plenty
    more decent ones to pick from :good: <

    #1283581
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16034

    I think Champagne would be ok at the trip Joliff, though haven’t parted with my cash on him. I have though added Prince of Scars, and happy to have nabbed some of the 12’s, as he’s as low as 7’s now. Still have my concerns about the grounds, but as you say, he’s mopping these up, and after A Toi Phil mugged me at the weekend, I don’t want a repeat :wacko:

    #1283770
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16034

    What a line up, and most of the big guns stand their ground. Easily one of the most competitive line ups of the season so far.

    All bets are off for me, as this is stronger than I expected, and maybe too hot for my Rogue Angel bet. Still mad keen on Prince of Scars & Jetstream Jack, but there are some strong rivals in there.

    I’d gladly sacrifice those bets for a Champagne West or Wounded Warrior victory, with a view to other markets, but I’ll have eyes everywhere tomorrow, especially with Pleasant Company finally standing his ground.

    Really looking forward to this one.

    #1283780
    Racingorchid
    Participant
    • Total Posts 205

    BONNY KATE 12/1 ew

    #1283803
    Avatar photocharlie87
    Participant
    • Total Posts 890

    Measureofmydreams 12/1.

    Ticks a lot of boxes for me. Ground will suit (the softer the better), I was impressed with the run at Navan this time last year (Noble Endeavor and Sub Lieutenant have franked the form well). I thought his run in the National Hunt Chase at Cheltenham was very good, jumping the last in front but finding 3m 7f a little too far – back down to 3m1f is ideal.

    If you can excuse the uncharacteristic fall at Ayr and a below par run at Sandown then he has to go close. He goes well fresh which takes away first run concerns and his figures are 21213180113F0.

    #1283805
    thewexfordman
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1200

    Bonny Kate for me, had a nice prep the last day. Meade is in good form, she was favourite for the Irish Grand National in 2016 and it looks as though she has a big handicap in her. Good E/W bet I believe.
    Of the outsiders perhaps bless the wings will go well unless he is being lined up for another crack at the Irish grand national, jockey bookings would suggest tomorrow Won’t be his day but work keeping an eye on.

    #1283810
    Avatar photothehorsesmouth
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5577

    Ground will suit (the softer the better)

    Unless there’s plenty of rain tomorrow I doubt the ground will be that soft. Bonny Kate for me too.

    #1283818
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16034

    Thanks for that update Tommy, that was always the worry with me for Prince of Scars.

    #1283821
    Avatar photoFran the man
    Participant
    • Total Posts 404

    I’ve bet Jetstream Jack for this, has had a bit of a reputation since being talked up by Elliott in his bumper days but hasn’t delivered yet despite hinting at ability on a few occasions over hurdles last season.

    This season however he started off lovely, winning his beginners chase in good style, he was then tested in grade 2 company where he couldn’t match the toe of A Toi Phil from the 2nd last after a mistake, after that i assumed either this or the Irish Grand National would be the aim with him getting a run in in the grade 1 Novice over xmas for a bit more experience and a mark, Russell noticeably had him amongst horses throughout presumably to get him experience of jumping amongst others and he was very neat until the second last and he didn’t look to get hammered when a chance of finishing amongst the money was gone. I can see him sitting in 5th or 6th all the way and taking it up 3 or 4 out and galloping all the way to the line for the win and a ticket to the 4 miler before the Irish National.

    If the ground does end up looking genuinely soft i’ll be backing Prince of Scars too and maybe a forecast also because he’s really well handicapped when there is enough juice :yes:

    #1283825
    Avatar photobotchy1
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6561

    Wounded Warrior to win @ 30.0 on BF.

    #1283832
    Avatar photoZarkava
    Participant
    • Total Posts 4691

    Having had a quick flick-through, Prince of Scars wins this, Shirley? That Grade 1 hurdling form is streets better than anything else on show.

    #1283834
    Avatar photoSteeplechasing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6337

    Topspeed has Ucello Conti more than 30 lbs clear of the field here. I don’t think I’ve ever seen that in a competitive handicap – they’re normally pretty tightly bunched. He doesn’t win often these days but was prolific in his early career and is 6lbs lower than he was in April.

    I’ll be having a bet at the 9s available with Sportingbet.

    #1283837
    Avatar photoZarkava
    Participant
    • Total Posts 4691

    No doubt Ucello Conti’s very well in. I’m just rather hoping that they keep his mark intact for the Grand National…

Viewing 17 posts - 1 through 17 (of 38 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.