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Quote: from Maxilon 5 on 11:18 am on Nov. 18, 2006[br]Richard – Venusian
Can I just ask what would make you happy?  Less racing? Better quality racing? No A-W? A Tote monopoly? Racing concluding at 3.30? A change in the handicap system?<br>
All of the above, with the proviso that on-course bookmakers are allowed to continue.
At the top level, Greyhound Racing is still top notch, reet hard. I’ve had many a great evening watching top quality dogs recently and tend to ignore BAGS racing, which serves a purpose.
Again, its the laws of supply and demand.
A successful film will generate demand for a sequel. Chances are, anyone who enjoyed the sequel will go and see it again. So the film makers respond to demand by creating further sequels until the inevitable point where supply exceeds demand.
Great Britain is a world centre for gambling; there appears to be a positive appetite for it here and it appears that the BHB wish to maintain their market share against competition, particularly poker. The competition will only become more fierce in the era of the super casino.
Casinos are free though. Which is my point. If the BHB wish to saturate the market to maintain marginal and absolute market share, then they cannot expect the average consumer to pay a premium price for the privelege of attending meetings.
I am still giggling at Alans post about the traffic , I wish I was enjoying it at the time , as i was trying to get to walsall to play in a poker turnament and gave up !!!<br>on a semi serious note , racing now at wolverhampton and kempton are just bookie continuity fillers <br> <br>Its a turn off for punter, but to be honest no one cares as the product is being delivered to the shops , bookies rub hands and racing authority babbles on about levy yield
Sadly the game is run for the bookies , we punters are incidental , and even more so the owners who pay to keep the show on the road , what a mess ,it will get worse before it gets better
<br>Ricky
Fair points Reet but I think Maxilon hit the nail on the head as far as my opinion on the matter is concerned:
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Quote: from Maxilon 5 on 6:28 pm on Nov. 18, 2006[br]I’ve had many a great evening watching top quality dogs recently and tend to ignore BAGS racing, which serves a purpose.
I see horseracing today in the same way, the AW/banded fayre serves a purpose and allows me to enjoy the top quality stuff.<br>
Quote: from reet hard on 12:40 pm on Nov. 18, 2006[br]<br> I note from this morning’s Post that the BHB are advertising for "the development of new racecourses, or new racetracks within existing courses" knowing full well that the extra runners can only feasibly come from the bottom end of the spectrum, which inevitably means more dross and dilution of the sport as a whole.<br>
<br>Fan though I am of the lower-grade stuff over the top-class, even I’d have grave reservations about the number of courses increasing to any great extent now, and that’s because the prolonged period of relative economic stability the UK has enjoyed may give a false impression as to how many more of them the racing industry could sustain in the longer term.
I’m not sure I really want us to have got to the stage in, say, ten years’ time, wherein – just by way of example – Great Leighs, Ffos-Las, Musselburgh AWT and Newbury AWT have all come to fruition, but at the heavy cost of 25 or so other hitherto extant tracks having been sacrificed along the way as a deep recession bites and / or increasingly ugly bidding for fixtures ensues.
I know the cause and effect would be nowhere near as simplistic as I’ve probably made it out to sound, before you all write in, but notwithstanding that, consolidation of our manyfold, singularly diverse current tracks and their core of fixtures seems a more sensible option to me.
Jeremy<br>(graysonscolumn)<br>
Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.
Sorry, Venusian. I posted at the same time. I’ll agree to disagree with you on most of those points.
I started betting in 1983. Bookies shut at four in winter. They opened late too. Cold snaps meant whole weeks with BAGS and Sterebeek where, if I remember correctly, all the chariots began with a B or Q.
Nah, I’d rather have today, (if I ignore the Extel nostalgia.;) ). ÂÂÂ
Is it Macau where they race at midnight?:cool:
Edited for thread irrelevance.
(Edited by Maxilon 5 at 9:52 pm on Nov. 18, 2006)
Quote: from Aragorn on 2:09 pm on Nov. 17, 2006[br]<br>Towcester was free last year and is still free this year (even after completing the main stand). The summer meetings are absolutely packed and even the midweek or weekend winter meetings are really well attended. We went to watch Taj run at Lingfield on saturday and the crowd was sparse at best.
I imagine Towcester must easily make back the lost admission money on the drinks and betting. The betting ring is always full of bookies and the bars are always busy as well. I think some of the other courses should take note because in spite of the fact that the meets aren’t always of the greatest quality they are always really well attended. Admission fees are often prohibitive.. At the very least tracks like wolver should drop their admission to a fiver, which would encourage people to go. The cost also doesn’t encourage younger people in the 18-25 bracket who normally don’t have the money to afford a day at the races. <br>
<br>Towcester charges on Boxing Day and one of its Easter meetings, if I’ve read their literature correctly, but otherwise remains totally free to get in. It has been rammed on both the weekday meetings I’ve attended so far this autumn, and chances are it’ll be all the more so tomorrow afternoon. Good.
Jeremy<br>(graysonscolumn)<br>
Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.
Maxilon, the spectacle of tenth rate horses running in meaningless races, sponsored by dodgy online gambling companies, in front of virtually deserted stands, does nothng for racing’s image, and is an embarrassment the sport can well do without.
Btw, re Sterrebeek (does that track still exist?), the word is "sulky" rather than "chariot"! Seriously, they could transmit races during the winter months from Vincennes, at least there’d be some quality racing on offer.
<br>Personally I object rather strongly to having my horse Salute described as ‘tenth rate’.
As for twilight meetings damaging the ‘image’ of racing, how is that possible? Or do you live in some fantasy land where the sport is seen as wholesome, clean and incorruptible and isn’t involved in any current court cases.
AP
I have always stood up for the Polytrack Tracks, they serve a purpose. I can get a fix if i want one during the winter or wet spells during the summer. Yup, it may be low quality, but not more bent than any other race whether it be on turf or muddy field. You get very volatile markets agreed and some mysterious gambles that go astray which still amaze me. It may give the perception that it crooked. It is still entertainment if you have an interest and why should the knockers have the right to take away that enjoyment. I would love to see a top notch straight mile polytrack course for the polytrack championships each season and a fall back for top races that are lost/should be lost to atrocious going.
It not for the pro punters or at least i would’nt trust it, mind you i don’t trust anyone and that includes ME! :biggrin:
From what i’ve read on here, it seems the AW tracks are a mare to get to and from, with traffic jams adding to the problem by the sound of it
Could this not be the main reason for poor attendances and not the entrance fee?
<br>My local track Ponte mainly holds run of the mill racing, but gets crowds from 6-10k – reason imhaho, pretty easy to get to and from for the locals and travellers alike
Quote: from empty wallet on 11:06 am on Nov. 19, 2006[br]From what i’ve read on here, it seems the AW tracks are a mare to get to and from, with traffic jams adding to the problem by the sound of it
EW
……but so are many turf tracks, so I can’t see that this adds anything to the ‘anti-AW’ argument
Rob
rob
Most go to the races for a day/evening out, few bevvies and a bet
I cannot see the racing surface making much difference tbh, being sat in taffic jams for hours, not being able get to and from the track with ease via local bus, train or walking – i can
(Edited by empty wallet at 11:22 am on Nov. 19, 2006)
Quote: from robnorth on 11:15 am on Nov. 19, 2006[br]
Quote: from empty wallet on 11:06 am on Nov. 19, 2006[br]From what i’ve read on here, it seems the AW tracks are a mare to get to and from, with traffic jams adding to the problem by the sound of it
EW
……but so are many turf tracks, so I can’t see that this adds anything to the ‘anti-AW’ argument
Rob<br>
<br>Aye, for as long as the likes of, say, Cartmel continue to exist, there’s not much to be gained by pursuing this line of argument. I guess we’ll all have our own perceptions of whether the means justifies the ends in getting to certain tracks – I’ve driven past York racecourse several hundred times in my life, but the product there doesn’t inspire me to go there for real on a raceday.
gc<br>
Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.
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Quote: from empty wallet on 11:06 am on Nov. 19, 2006[br]From what i’ve read on here, it seems the AW tracks are a mare to get to and from, with traffic jams adding to the problem by the sound of it
Could this not be the main reason for poor attendances and not the entrance fee?
In a word;No!<br> Southwell NH fixtures are invariably more well-attended than AW fixtures.<br>
Apracing, you appear to have misunderstood the point I was trying to make.
The reason I think these fixtures damage racing’s image is that the sport taking place in front of empty grandstands puts across a picture of a pastime on its last legs.
Believe it or not, I am aware that "plotting" goes on and that sometimes the odd horse does not appear to be allowed to run on its merits. Shock horror.
<br>But nobody is watching this ‘picture’ !!
One thing I certainly haven’t misunderstood is your use of the tern ‘tenth rate’ for the horses. What a pity you couldn’t find the common decency to apologise for that. Whatever you think of the motivation for twilight meetings, why criticise the horses?
AP
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