The home of intelligent horse racing discussion
The home of intelligent horse racing discussion

Vintage Stakes 2016

Home Forums Big Races – Discussion Vintage Stakes 2016

Viewing 11 posts - 18 through 28 (of 28 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #1257611
    goreisking
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 192

    Air Force Blue probably the main one

    #1257623
    Avatar photoGingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34704

    Steve would say War Command.
    Actually, he did “train on”. It’s just he didn’t progress and other horses improved past him at three.

    On average, Group 1 two year olds need to improve around 7 lbs to win a three year old Group 1. Therefore, it’s easy to believe they don’t train on. Sometimes it’s just some rivals improve more. Therefore a Group 1 winning two year old can show exactly the same level of performance, but is now only capable of a 3rd or 4th in a 3yo/open aged Group 1.

    Also, horses get injured/problems which are nothing to do with physique/maturity, including trouble with breathing etc. I wouldn’t class that as “not training on” either.

    Air Force Blue needed no appendages to put up the best two year old performance seen all year… So – if everything was A1 with him in May – why change? Why wear a tongue tie in the Guineas? :unsure: You’d think he must have had some sort of breathing problem.

    Value Is Everything
    #1257645
    mickeyjp
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1976

    War decree improved from his last run and skipped over the ground. His running style looks very similar to gleneagles and hopefully he will get decent ground for his next couple of runs. I’d take 14s for the guineas as he still looks like he has a lot of improvement in him. The lads have a few good 2yos to place so we will have to wait and see where war decree goes next. Boynton was disappointing and Godolphin still cant get their 2yos to progress past their first couple of runs. He had a much harder race than war decree in the superlative and that showed today

    #1257667
    Avatar photoSteeplechasing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6337

    He had a much harder race than war decree in the superlative and that showed today

    That’s a cogent point, Mickey. Moore was noticeably kinder on WD last time. He’s a man for looking after a prospect. At the time I was impressed with Boynton’s fighting spirit, but there’s always the risk when they are so young of scaring them a bit.

    Even today, Moore was happy to coach WD through the initial pickup when he was asked to go and win his race. Moore was patient and keen to get him balanced and using his action properly. Once on a proper even keel momentum built quickly and he was away. I was impressed.

    I’ll need to be careful or I’ll be getting back into this Flat lark after decades away from it!

    #1257668
    Avatar photostevecaution
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 8241

    Churchill would hammer him very easily

    For the moment War Decree is at least 7lbs better than Churchill. That is why he is running in Group 2 races and Churchill is at group 3 level for now. Churchill made heavy enough weather last time out and his Chesham win was over inferior opposition.

    I wouldn’t back War Decree for the Guineas, we have seen enough War Fronts fail to repeat the form at 3yo.

    If them two meet now Churchill would hammer him!!

    Churchill has never hammered any horse, so don’t talk fanny.

    Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

    #1257671
    goreisking
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 192

    Winning margins are nothing my friend. If Churchill isn’t an absolute champion next year then I don’t know racing. One thing is for sure…if he turns up at the guineas along with war decree I guarantee there is only one emphatic winner!

    #1257672
    Avatar photoGingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34704

    Boynton didn’t settle today, got in a barging match early on and didn’t have a clear run through at a critical stage. Second best horse in the race.

    Considering all of the above, Boynton didn’t run that badly imo.

    Value Is Everything
    #1257676
    Avatar photoGingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34704

    Winning margins are nothing my friend. If Churchill isn’t an absolute champion next year then I don’t know racing. One thing is for sure…if he turns up at the guineas along with war decree I guarantee there is only one emphatic winner!

    Problem with backing any Ballydoyle horse ante-post for the Guineas is they have so many top class horses. Not sure to get a run. Churchill may or may not be Coolmore’s best three year old (Caravaggio is their best 2yo so far) but only the horse/s in spot on condition at the time will run. They currently have 5 of the first 7 in the 2000 Guineas market.

    Value Is Everything
    #1257698
    Avatar photoGingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34704

    I certainly wouldn’t be backing War Decree for the Guineas, as he’s likely to stay at least 10f at three.

    Value Is Everything
    #1257779
    Avatar photothejudge1
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2251

    Boynton was a bit disappointing for me, thought he’d make up into a group one horse, but not at that level, at least not yet.

    #1257800
    Avatar photostevecaution
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 8241

    Boynton was a bit disappointing for me, thought he’d make up into a group one horse, but not at that level, at least not yet.

    The Racing Post gave Boynton as running 6 lbs below his previous run in yesterday’s race.

    They left War Decree on 112. Maybe I’m generous but I though War Decree improved from his last start and I’ve got him on 115 myself.

    I believe Carravaggio is a 120 horse and he’s the one to beat this year, if not necessarily next year.

    Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

Viewing 11 posts - 18 through 28 (of 28 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.