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eddie, someone else in the same bookies might say "Horse ‘A’ is 20kg heavier than his last known winning weight" or "Horse ‘B’ has lost his last three times at around 522kg, but he weighs 545kg today, and that’s his last winning weight".
If bookies were to remove irrelevant flannel from their screens, we would spend most of our afternoons looking at little white dots. The information (horse weight) has an inherent value, in terms of determining fitness. Publish it, and be damned.
There’s plenty of punters out there who don’t understand the concept of penalty weights i.e. that which a horse is required to carry in a race, and how to apply that information – but we still publish it in racecards, because it is critical information to those that do know how it applies. It is the same with actual horse weights, imo.
As for number of runners at a meeting, it is simply a matter of managing the logistics, and there are a number of ways that the circle could be squared. Off the top of my head, courses could, for example, invoke a rule that requires runners to be present at the track at least 2 hours before they are scheduled to run, in order that they can be weighed in plenty of time. I’m sure there are plenty of other ways to cater for a weighing period of 1-minute-per-horse.
Here, in a single thread, you can see exactly what Racing For Change is up against.
Asked to come up with a single revolutionary idea, we end up with a debate about the merits of weighing horses, with the usual contributors taking up fixed positions for and against.
I wonder if the officers on the Titanic debated whether they should weigh all the passengers before they got into the lifeboats …….
AP
Grass, I can’t see bookmakers putting anything that may help the punter back a winner on their screens.
It has become almost impossible to get a glimpse of the runners before a race goes off ~ RUK getting almost as bad as ATR these days………….thanks to them being "powered" by one firm of bookmakers or the other.
Colin
Jockeys should be allowed to bet but have to do so via the Tote. The amount they’ve had on is revealed on the big screen five minutes before the race.
Hi everyone,
New to the forum and saw this thread, some great ideas.
But thought this one was the best for just pure excitement it was cause, and I suppose a bit of controversy.
Jon
I wonder if the officers on the Titanic debated whether they should weigh all the passengers before they got into the lifeboats …….
VG APR
Can we assume by this thata) you believe the on-course weighing of racehorses to be a waste of time, money and effort
b) rather like Milbear you think it may have some merit but as a means of sorting out racing’s ills it is of little use or consequence
c) it will be of no use whatsoever to the majority of punters
Personally I’m in favour of change by a series of well-executed insurgencies rather than full-blown revolution but if you want something revolutionary how about:
reducing the fixture list by half during BST and increasing the number of races at the remaining meetings to a regulation 10 with divisions added if necessary. Racing from circa 2 pm to 8 pm April to August, no evening meetings
Less clutter, more focus, less travelling for the ‘racing professionals’
I wonder if the officers on the Titanic debated whether they should weigh all the passengers before they got into the lifeboats …….
AP
As I recall Alan, the scramble for Titanic lifeboats, and the way in which they were ‘filled’ and released, was utterly shambolic. Perhaps the officers on deck were the forebears of the great and good now running the BHA?
To be fair, my "revolutionary" idea was a Tote Exchange – I’m merely commenting on the weighing proposal, because I think it would be welcome; both in terms of the usefulness of the information, and it’s integrity impact.
That said, I do cede to Colin’s point – I’m sure most bookmakers would rather display pictures of their naked mothers in the shops, than put out information which might help punters.
Drone,
b)
In that I can’t envisage it adding one person to the on course attendance, or one penny to the average betting turnover.
It’s a bit like a politician facing a £178bn annual deficit whose big idea is to reduce the number of MPs by 10%.
AP
greyhounds have been weighed for the past 50 years to my knowledge.
not many punters take any notice, and those that do admit it doesn’t help to pick winners.
To increase participation and engagement amongst the excluded majority, we could
abolish private racehorse ownership
and create a balloting system using a database attached to a nationalised racehorse pool.
Each weeks entries are posted online and matched from a database of poor, but fanatic, racing enthusiasts currently excluded from owning a thoroughbred racehorse.
One million people pay £x per month to be on this database, which covers training fees. Each person (like Premium Bonds), is guaranteed at least ONE chance of live ownership per year.
Theoretically, the 2.15 at Southwell tomorrow:
0000000 Morpheus (Maxilon 5) P Midgely S Sanders
1540190 Sandy Toes (Betting Boy) R Bastiman C Catlin
021910 A Crab (Marb) R Bastiman P Pickard
0000100 Bikini Lass(Never Nearer)H Cecil N Callanetc, etc
The "owner" gets a day out, tea and nibbles, a posh lunch, has a natter with the trainer, is inteviewed by Sir Bob, and gets to swank about in the paddock while wearing a big coat.
The new Wednesday Derby, the National and the Gold Cup are all possible ownership opportunities.
Nationalisation increases commitment and engagement. The brilliant thing? Prize money is aggregated and distributed as an annual dividend (a guaranteed 5% yield on investment), to the original horse purchasers to encourage continued purchase and breeding.
As someone brought the issue of weighing horses up thought it was worthy of comment, it’s that popular a subject apracing, nearly every post since you pointed out it’s triviality concerns it
Of course the "Tote Exchange" is the best idea, it’s quite ludicrous expecting owners to pay 4 or 500 pounds a week to run in races worth less than 2 grand to the winner.
I’ll try to sum up the ideas we have so far later this evening – good stuff, keep them coming.
Going along the lines of television at the moment I would have thought a reality show following 12 apprentice jockeys voted by the public each week with the winner getting a ride on a PN mount in the Grand national would kindle interest amongst the public. PN, Clare Balding Frankie D on the panel with Ruby and AP as mentors, who also ride in the great race.
A tongue in cheek suggestion of course but it would really heighten the profile of racings stars.
I agree that really the only thing that matters is sorting out an alternative to the Levy and somehow making the Tote work more efficiently for the good of racing (maybe get the BHA to buy it at a knock down price from cash strapped Labour Government and then get Betfair to run it for commission).
On a more trivial note I’d like people who go racing – particularly families – to be able to interact much more with the horses.
I’d firstly re-vitalise that old institution of The Racegoers Club which was advertised profusely when I was a lad. Their discounts to racecourses would be helpful but I’d focus on two other aspects which I was involved in when I first got interested in racing. a) Syndicate ownership – promoted as being bona-fide and good value with management fees staying in the industry b) stable visits linked to nearby race meetings. You only have to see the success of Lambourn/Epsom Open Day to realise these are hugely popular and would give the host trainers an opportunity to sell themselves to potential new owners (I bought my first horse after one of these stable visits).
Secondly when you go racing – particularly on a Saturday/Sunday – there should be a chance for kids to see/pat an ex-racehorse up close. Santa Anita has "Sea Biscuit" parked up in a pen behind the grandstand all the time (they change the horses…) for people to see and fuss over. The BHA are already doing great things with school childen and courses like Ascot have the successful Colts and Fillies clubs. These sort of things should be extended to all kids on all weekends.
People love to join official clubs/societies where they think they are well run and they will get financial benefits.
P.S. I like the idea of a jockey’s reality TV show like the one that has been so successful in the States..
when you go racing – particularly on a Saturday/Sunday – there should be a chance for kids to see/pat an ex-racehorse up close. Santa Anita has "Sea Biscuit" parked up in a pen behind the grandstand all the time (they change the horses…) for people to see and fuss over. The BHA are already doing great things with school childen and courses like Ascot have the successful Colts and Fillies clubs. These sort of things should be extended to all kids on all weekends.
Superb idea. The more thin-lipped execs might want to dodge that idea for fear of what litigation could be wrought if the horse in question bites or kicks a child. Surely, though, it simply behoves the course involved to source an ex-racehorse that is temperamentally sound enough to be able to tolerate (as far as such assurances can ever be given 100%) the pats and prods of a succession of youngsters.
I can’t believe, for example, that there would be no such animal at Greatwood that wouldn’t fit the bill. Given that centre’s location, I’m sure that courses in Berkshire, Sussex, Wiltshire, etc., could make a regular star turn out of the horse in question.
gc
Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.
Stop delaying things and bring in the hands and heels races for professional jockeys.
Yes. Yes yes yes yes. Another excellent call – I’d love to see those.
gc
Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.
Can we assume by this that
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