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Wasn’t impressed. Had him in a winning 5-fold but wasn’t impressed at all. Campanologist by our standards is a Group 3 horse. At best. Over 1m 4f. I was considering not backing Planteur in the Prince of Wales’ but now I most definitely will be.
Plantuer beat Ley Hunter and Silver Pond by 2.5l and 2.75l on both starts this year. Are they Group 3 or Listed horses? I can’t quite decide. Obviously that has no impact on the Prince Of Wales’s Stakes and that applies here, imo.
SYT cruised round, lengthened when asked and put up a margin that was convincing. Would you have been more impressed if Moore sat there, laughed at Campanologist and won by 1/2l?
So You Think beat Campanologist by 4 1/2L over 10 1/2f. He was beaten further than that in the G1 Premio Repubblica over 10f in Italy this time last season. He beat Bankable by 1/2L over 10f in the G3 Winter Hill in August 2009. He was beaten 1 1/4L by Jukebox Jury a fortnight before. The best form he’s ever produced over 10f was 4th in the 2008 Eclipse behind Mount Nelson, finishing 1 1/2L behind.
Famous Name doesn’t get beaten very often, but it usually happens in Group 1 company. He was beaten 7 1/2L today – he was beaten 7L by Cape Blanco in September.
The form isn’t wildly impressive and I’d still take a shot at him with Planteur. He’s been winning his races in France comfortably and boasts great form with Behkabad, horribly unlucky in the Arc.
I can’t understand why some people are crabbing So You Think.
He’s a genuine world class horse.
Off the top of my head, I can only think of two horses currently racing who’ve won more Group 1s than he has (6) – Goldikova and Sacred Kingdom.
Yes well Sacred Kingdom lost today. Horse racing is about which is the better horse, not which horse has won the most Group 1s. We have absolutely no idea as to the quality of Australian horses over middle-distances.
Well not really since Europe keeps sending completely the wrong horses over. If you want to base the form around Americain though, he was beaten 12L by Vision D’Etat. Which makes So You Think 15L worse than Vision D’Etat. No.
Yes well Sacred Kingdom lost today. Horse racing is about which is the better horse, not which horse has won the most Group 1s. We have absolutely no idea as to the quality of Australian horses over middle-distances.
Sacred Kingdom is also 7 years old and has been on the downward spiral for some time, So You Think in the prime of his career.
You mentioned the form comparison with Cape Blanco, but So You Think beat Famous Name on the bridle in a slowly run race although there are questions in both races whether he ran to form. I can add in the pace and ground aspects which would also flatter Cape Blanco.Australian middle distance horses are surely not as good as the top Europeans, but they’re obviously better than the Italians and Germans (if they held Melbourne/Caulfield Cups the locals would never win). And the strength of their sprinters and the size of the racing jurisdiction suggest that their middle distance horses couldn’t possibly be too terrible.
Add in that SYT is the best Australian middle distance horse of the past 30 years and possibly more, and that Bart Cummings (trainer of 50+ years, over twice as many Melbourne Cups as any other trainer with 12) calls him the best horse he’s ever trained. He even exhibited some Frankel-like freakishness in winning the Cox Plate before he was in actuality 3 (despite being listed as being 3).
On pure European form the horse is not yet an absolutely unquestionable superstar but his credentials can’t be questioned.
The Planteur clash is very interesting though. I’ve always thought SYT would be better over 12f and Planteur will give him a huge test at the shorter trip.
I’m shocked that he’s already favorite ahead of Workforce in the Arc however. I’ve always thought that he’d beat WF over 12f and that he deserved more respect before he even raced in Europe, but that’s a huge reaction from the bookmakers to these two wins.
SYT has the advantage of being a big, long striding tank whilst also being a very well balanced horse. He covers more ground per stride than other horses in the race. Everything else has to take 5 strides for every four he takes to cover the same distance of ground. He’s a bit of a machine methinks.
It will take a good one to beat him, something that can comfortably sit on the pace and accelerate with him. Give SYT a 3 or 4 lengths and it is race over.Can’t knock him for the win, barely got wound up. So for all you people (presumably not aussie’s) quoting these different lengths which other horse beat his competitors by, you’re wasting your time.
And for all the people (presumably aussie’s) saying he’s gonna wipe the floor, ease up a bit.
I think he’ll win the prince of wales stakes and i’ll be backing him again in that with some hefty money, just like I did today and in the mooresbridge.
But once it’s out to 12 furlongs I think i’ll be much more reserved in my betting, although I will still take him.
Can’t knock him for the win, barely got wound up. So for all you people (presumably not aussie’s) quoting these different lengths which other horse beat his competitors by, you’re wasting your time.
And for all the people (presumably aussie’s) saying he’s gonna wipe the floor, ease up a bit.
I think he’ll win the prince of wales stakes and i’ll be backing him again in that with some hefty money, just like I did today and in the mooresbridge.
But once it’s out to 12 furlongs I think i’ll be much more reserved in my betting, although I will still take him.
Great. A pushy, arrogant, after-timing loudmouth. Precisely what every forum needs.
That’s right, apparently giving your opinion is now pushy and arrogant.
As for the after-timing stuff, well sorry mate. Next time I plan to back a horse from my own country at 1.16 (thats what I got on aussie site) i’ll make a thread on here specifically to let you know. Then again I won’t need to, since I already said in the last post i’m gonna back him in the pow and kg / arc.
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That attitude is entirely uncalled for Zarkava. Other people’s opinions are just that and not a personal attack on yourself. Please debate the issue and ignore the pissing contest.
We have absolutely no idea as to the quality of Australian horses over middle-distances.
Shouldn’t you really have said – "I have absolutely no idea …… etc". Who is this "we"?
It’s obvious that yourself and Mr Wilson are far from convinced about the quality of So You Think. Some of your form references and margin comparisons are futile at best though. Different days, years, tracks, going ….. we can all drive ourselves mad when not comparing like with like.
Why does Europe need a Gr1 Prix D’Ispahan and a Tattersalls on the same weekend just one week after the Lockinge? Stop protecting the breeders and get a fair dinkum schedule. Downgrade some of these duds to the status they deserve. Also, was the Irish 2000 the worst Guineas race you’ve ever seen? Maybe it’s the quality of European form and grading that needs another look?
It looks to me that trainers are again doing their best to protect the image of future horses at stud. Cotton wool heroes don’t make mistakes. They also prove little. It’s no wonder that the horse who has actually played a hand in 2011 is favourite for big races later in the year.
We have only seen a few likely suspects on the turf so far this season. Two things are obvious from the overall form. So You Think is very special. Planteur is not. Do you really want to back the latter in a two horse race?
You can’t help but be impressed by So You Think. I think he isn’t fully wound up yet and that there is further improvement to come. He must have a major chance of winning The KG & QE at Ascot in July – although he is by no means a certainty to win, as some may think.
What I like about So You Think is that he can quicken off a fast gallop and can maintain it all the way to the line, and I think Ascot will suit his running style well.
Remember also that Workforce ( his main rival ) was terribly disappointing in the King George last year when routed by stablemate, Harbinger; although I am convinced that there must have been mitigating factors for that poor show.
Consider also that one or two top class three year old middle distance horses may be thrown into the King George mix, so everything isn’t clear cut as far as one of the older horses celebrating another victory is concerned.
A fascinating renewal awaits.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
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Remember also that Workforce ( his main rival ) was terribly disappointing in the King George last year when routed by stablemate, Harbinger; although I am convinced that there must have been mitigating factors for that poor show.
Are you a little alarmed that "mitigating factors" was the excuse used on two of four starts last year? There also has to be a concern as time drags on and we haven’t seen Workforce on a racecourse in 2011.
Can some british people help me out here btw, when they say he’ll go to prince of wales next then hopefully king george then arc (pretty sure I read that).
Do they mean he will literally go from king george to the arc? Becos from what I can gather the gap is from july to october, not really sure how preperations work here, so would he run other smaller races between july and october?
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