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Can someone pleas explain to me how the weights work. As far as i understand someone gives the horses weights and the 40 highest get to run, but being the highest is a disadvantage. is this anywhere near right? cheers
Gav 1584, thats the jist of it.
Top weight after the weights have been allotted can always be withdrawn though before the race and the weights would shuffle down. You can be 20lbs out of the handicap in Feburary and in the handicap by April
Yep – the National is bit different to most handicaps in that the handicapper creates his own handicap, rather than the horses running off their official BHA marks. I guess the idea behind this is to ensure that horses with ‘Aintree form’ who would ordinarily be lower weighted in a normal chase, carry an appropriate burden for their previous Aintree exploits.
The handicapper has more recently tried to compress the handicap, so more horses are allotted over the minimum weight of ten stone, and thus come the day, more horses run off the mark orginally given to them, rather than be out of the handicap.
I guess the idea is to encourage better quality horses in – connections would be less likely to run if the better horses were giving lumps of weight away. It strikes me as being a bit unfair though – the lesser horses could easily be given too much to do at the weights.
One wonders why the National cannot be run off BHA official marks these days? I’m sure there is a reason, but I’m not au fait enough to know. Perhaps the practice of getting National runners to ‘naff aroud over hurdles’ as Phil Smith put it, would be exploited to the max.
Top 5 Weights Don’t Push It 11-10 Neptune Collonges 11-10 Tidal Bay 11-09 Midnight Chase 11-08 Deep Purple 11-07
i’ll do a more indeoth list with form, trainer, weights later
vf
Top 5 Weights Don’t Push It 11-10 Neptune Collonges 11-10 Tidal Bay 11-09 Midnight Chase 11-08 Deep Purple 11-07
Tranquil Sea 11-07 Synchronised 11-06 Vic Venturi 11-06 What A Friend 11-06 Majestic Concorde 11-05
vf
Very much so.Shame if he doesn’t get in.West End Rocker has a nice weight though (10-5)
Killyglen (29th, 10-10)
is my bet. Available at 66/1 and will love the good ground we can hopefully expect ( last 7/10 were ‘Good’)
updated 4th april 2011
THE 2011 JOHN SMITH’S GRAND NATIONAL[/color:3vpz2x3q][/size:3vpz2x3q]
1) P1-P000 DON’T PUSH IT (IRE) 11-11-10 J P McManus Jonjo O’Neill/Tony McCoy
2) 04-3226 TIDAL BAY (IRE) 10-11-09 Andrea & Graham Wylie Howard Johnson/Brian Hughes
3) 211-524 WHAT A FRIEND 8-11-06 Ged Mason & Sir Alex Ferguson Paul Nicholls/Daryl Jacob
4) 1B-0044 VIC VENTURI (IRE) 11-11-06 Seamus Dunne Dessie Hughes IRE/Andrew Lynch
5) U62/1-31 MAJESTIC CONCORDE (IRE) 8-11-05 Dr Ronan Lambe Dermot Weld IRE/Robbie McNamara
6) 42F14 OR NOIR DE SOMOZA (FR) 9-11-05 Filsal Stadeg Racing David Pipe/Tom Scudamore
7) 1F24-41 DOONEYS GATE (IRE) 10-11-04 Jackie Mullins Willie Mullins IRE/Mr Patrick Mullins
8. 14-2F44 BIG FELLA THANKS 9-11-01 Crossed Fingers Partnership Ferdy Murphy/Graham Lee
9) 205-244 THE TOTHER ONE (IRE) 10-11-00 Graham Roach Paul Nicholls/Mr Ryan Mahon
10) 111-112 BALLABRIGGS (IRE) 10-11-00 Trevor Hemmings Donald McCain/Jason Maguire
11) 3133-21 THE MIDNIGHT CLUB (IRE) 10-10-13 Susannah Ricci Willie Mullins IRE/Ruby Walsh
12) 20P-F50 NICHE MARKET (IRE) 10-10-13 Graham Regan Paul Nicholls/Harry Skelton
13) 121-001 SILVER BY NATURE 9-10-12 Geoff Brown Lucinda Russell/Peter Buchanan
14) 0BP-500 BACKSTAGE (FR) 9-10-12 MPR & Capranny Syndicate Gordon Elliott IRE/Paul Carberry
15) 11-053F CHIEF DAN GEORGE (IRE) 11-10-12 Maurice Chapman Jimmy Moffatt/Paddy Aspell
16) 4-56242 CALGARY BAY (IRE) 8-10-10 Camilla Radford Henrietta Knight/Hadden Frost
17) 2P-2536 KILLYGLEN (IRE) 9-10-10 David McCammon Stuart Crawford IRE/Robert Power
18) 152-263 OSCAR TIME (IRE) 10-10-09 Robert Waley-Cohen/Sir Martin & S Broughton Martin Lynch IRE/ Mr Sam Waley-Cohen
19) 10-1131 QUINZ (FR) 7-10-08 Andrew Cohen Philip Hobbs/Richard Johnson
20) 500423 NORTHERN ALLIANCE (IRE) 10-10-08 Irish Rover Syndicate Tony Martin IRE/Barry Geraghty
21) 2212-42 BECAUSEICOULDNTSEE (IRE) 8-10-08 Noel Glynn Noel Glynn IRE/Davy Russell
22) 000-06P COMPLY OR DIE (IRE) 12-10-08 David Johnson David Pipe/Timmy Murphy
23) F-FF25P QUOLIBET (FR) 7-10-08 J P McManus Jonjo O’Neill/Mark Walsh
24) 1FP10P GRAND SLAM HERO (IRE) 10-10-07 Walters Plant Hire Ltd Nigel Twiston-Davies/Aidan Coleman
25) 6/454-P6 ROLL ALONG (IRE) 11-10-07 Bryan & Philippa Burrough Nigel Twiston-Davies/???? 50/50 to run lame at weekened[/color:3vpz2x3q]
26) 0/144/P3- STATE OF PLAY 11-10-06 William & Angela Rucker Evan Williams/Paul Moloney
27) 11-11P5 KING FONTAINE (IRE) 8-10-06 Trevor Hemmings Malcolm Jefferson/Denis O’Regan
28) U-3431U IN COMPLIANCE (IRE) 11-10-05 Westerly Breeze Syndicate Dessie Hughes IRE/Leighton Aspell
29) 005P-1P HELLO BUD (IRE) 13-10-05 Seamus Murphy Nigel Twiston-Davies/Sam Twiston-Davies
30) P/00-11P WEST END ROCKER (IRE) 9-10-05 Barry Winfield & Tim Leadbeater Alan King/Robert Thornton
31) 200010 SANTA’S SON (IRE) 11-10-05 Douglas Pryde & Jim Beaumont Howard Johnson/Jamie Moore
32) C21-046 BLUESEA CRACKER (IRE) 9-10-04 J P McManus James Motherway IRE/Andrew McNamara
33) 01050 THAT’S RHYTHM (FR) 11-10-04 Don’t Tell Henry Martin Todhunter/James Reveley
34) P2/111/-0 SURFACE TO AIR 10-10-04 Tim Urry Chris Bealby/Tom Messenger
35) P-234PP PIRAYA (FR) 8-10-04 Terry Neill David Pipe/Johnny Farrelly
36) 6F-0P5P CAN’T BUY TIME (IRE) 9-10-04 J P McManus Jonjo O’Neill/Richie McLernon
37) 0-30563 CHARACTER BUILDING (IRE) 11-10-04 Patricia Thompson John Quinn/Miss Nina Carberry
38) 15/1P/-52 ORNAIS (FR) 9-10-04 The Stewart Family Paul Nicholls/Nick Scholfield
39) U2U-0P2 ARBOR SUPREME (IRE) 9-10-03 J P McManus Willie Mullins IRE/David Casey
40) P5U-42P ROYAL ROSA (FR) 12-10-03 Andrea & Graham Wylie Howard Johnson/Paul Gallagher
41)
42) 313-011 SKIPPERS BRIG (IRE) 10-10-02 Ashleybank Investments Limited Nicky Richards/Dominic Elsworth43) 210010 GOLDEN KITE (IRE) 9-10-02 Dr Anthony Calnan Adrian Maguire IRE/Shane Hassett[/color:3vpz2x3q]
44) 006004 ALWAYS WAINING (IRE) 10-10-02 Mr & Mrs Peter James Douglas Peter Bowen/???
45) 321112 PUTNEY BRIDGE 9-10-01 Louise Goldsworthy Keith Goldsworthy/???
46) 4/22-1PP BELON GALE (IRE) 8-10-01 Andrea & Graham Wylie Howard Johnson/???
47) 402P-02 FAASEL (IRE) 10-10-01 Jim Ennis David Pipe/???
48) 02043P LE BEAU BAI (FR) 8-10-01 Glass Half Full Richard Lee/???
49) D61-0F0 MERIGO (FR) 10-10-01 Raymond & Anita Anderson Green Andrew Parker/???
50) 6-02162 ASKTHEMASTER (IRE) 11-10-00 Carrolle Wall Robert Tyner IRE/???
51) 11P61/0/- STARZAAN (IRE) 12-10-00 Ben Arbib Hughie Morrison/???
52) 123-P22 GILES CROSS (IRE) 9-10-00 KCMS Partnership Victor Dartnall/???
53) 1U0-660 SADDLERS STORM (IRE) 9-10-00 Billy Moffett/R T & J McLoughlin Tony Martin IRE/???
54) 1-PP11P SAGALYRIQUE (FR) 7-9-13 Sir Robert Ogden Donald McCain/???
55) U0-6042 AMBOBO (USA) 11-9-13 Deirdre Brassil Martin Brassil IRE/???
56) 241P64 DUERS (IRE) 9-9-13 Kate Kelly/Kate Ronan Paul Magnier IRE/???
57) 11120-P TOBY JUG 10-9-13 Paul & Caron Chapman & Sarah Humphrey Sarah Humphrey/???
58) 131-321 JUNIOR 8-9-12 Middleham Park Racing LI David Pipe/???
59) 064260 THE SAWYER (BEL) 11-9-12 David Fear Bob Buckler/???
60) 2613-PP GALANT NUIT (FR) 7-9-12 David Parry Ferdy Murphy/???
61) 044522 BALLYFITZ 11-9-09 Fred & Wayne Mills Nigel Twiston-Davies/???
62) F4-5365 POMME TIEPY (FR) 8-9-09 Susannah Ricci Willie Mullins IRE/???
63) 24U344 I’MONCLOUDNINE (IRE) 8-9-09 Fred Matthews Neil Mulholland/???
64) 116PP-P TREACLE (IRE) 10-9-04 Bjorn Nielsen Tom Taaffe IRE/???
65) P23221 REGAL HEIGHTS (IRE) 10-9-02 Janet Heler Tom George/???[/color:3vpz2x3q]
Backstage was in the process of running a huge race before his unlucky exit last year off 11st.
Best-priced 33/1 looks generous.
Not entirely convinced this is the right race for Calgary Bay, but he’s a strong traveller and a sound jumper. He could go very well off 10-10.
I don’t think the 33/1 will last.
- Total Posts 17716
I said Calgary Bay should race here back in October to many jeers and am sticking with him. I’ll have a little bet on Tatenen and Ballabriggs too.
I very much like the weights of Notre Pere and From Dawn To Dusk…
Heavens to betsy i’m wondering if State of Play will even manage to get in this year. Imagine what a waste of season that would be?
I think i can safely say however when i look over some of these weights that Phil Smith…. is an idiot. Does he actually know what he’s doing or does he just draw numbers from a bingo machine? Some of the weights he’s given out are just pure stupidity.
I’m not being cute, i do legitimately believe there is something wrong with him.
Isn’t it about time there were conditions put in to the entries?
e.g.
NO horse is allowed to run if they have not won a chase at 3 miles or more!What is I’msingingtheblues doing in the Grand National? He barely gets 2 1/2 miles, let alone 4 1/2.
Value Is Everything- Total Posts 17716
Isn’t it about time there were conditions put in to the entries?
e.g.
NO horse is allowed to run if they have not won a chase at 3 miles or more!What is I’msingingtheblues doing in the Grand National? He barely gets 2 1/2 miles, let alone 4 1/2.
Is this cause you genuinely think he has no chance or cause you want a specific horse on a low weight (who has no chance of getting in) to run. I think any horse should be allowed to run. If the owners pay the fees etc they shouldn’t be denied a day out just so horses like Merigo can get in the race.
The reason I make the comment cause these exacts remarks were made by many of the forum members last year when they realised horses they’d fancied weren’t going to get in cause of the weights.
It’s a shame that it looks like I’moncloudnine won’t get in. Maybe next year.
As it stands, my four against the field are Oscar Time, State Of Play and two from Notre Pere, Calgary Bay, Synchronised, Comply Or Die, West End Rocker, Ballytrim, Bluesea Cracker and Can’t Buy Time.
I reserve the right to contradict myself.
FLD
Twitter=@PGHenn
So don't run, just like the others always do
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