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July Cup 2009

Home Forums Big Races – Discussion July Cup 2009

Viewing 17 posts - 52 through 68 (of 98 total)
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  • #238956
    Avatar photoIan
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    • Total Posts 1415

    Thick jockey syndrome again. Richard Hughes riding a horse that gets a mile holds it up last off a not blistering pace at six furlongs. The mind boggles. :roll:

    #238957
    Avatar photoshabby
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    • Total Posts 638

    What kind of ride was that from Jimmy Fortune?

    #238958
    RedRiot
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    • Total Posts 870

    Thick jockey syndrome again. Richard Hughes riding a horse that gets a mile holds it up last off a not blistering pace at six furlongs. The mind boggles. :roll:

    Jimmy Fortune you mean.

    #238959
    Avatar photoIan
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    • Total Posts 1415

    Thick jockey syndrome again. Richard Hughes riding a horse that gets a mile holds it up last off a not blistering pace at six furlongs. The mind boggles. :roll:

    Jimmy Fortune you mean.

    Of course, sorry its sort of automatic linking Hughes with Paco Boy.

    Seems Steve Mellish is of the same opinion. "Diabolical".

    #238962
    Onthesteal
    Member
    • Total Posts 1387

    I think Main Aim would have caught the winner given a clear path. I’ve looked at it again and MA was stopped just as it were finding top gear. Gald FS won but should be thrown out.

    #238963
    Blackheath
    Member
    • Total Posts 105

    Don’t agree. Fortune did the only sensible thing in the first half of the race.
    I have watched umpteen 7f horses niggled along early to go faster in 6f races and it does them no good at all. Paco’s chance was based on a strong pace and the field coming back to him, and that didn’t happen. To see Main Aim and King’s Apostle up with the pace was very strange indeed.

    Well the Aussies and their followers lose their money over 6f yet again. Shame !!

    #238966
    Avatar photoGoldikova
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    • Total Posts 1537

    I think Main Aim would have caught the winner given a clear path. I’ve looked at it again and MA was stopped just as it were finding top gear. Gald FS won but should be thrown out.

    I pretty much agree with regards to the interference costing the other horse more than a length and a half. Mellish and Lydia said it didn’t, but the horse knocked its opponent out of its bloody stride.

    #238969
    Avatar photoIan
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    • Total Posts 1415

    Don’t agree. Fortune did the only sensible thing in the first half of the race.
    I have watched umpteen 7f horses niggled along early to go faster in 6f races and it does them no good at all. Paco’s chance was based on a strong pace and the field coming back to him, and that didn’t happen. To see Main Aim and King’s Apostle up with the pace was very strange indeed.

    Well the Aussies and their followers lose their money over 6f yet again. Shame !!

    Paco Boy was ridden more prominantly at Ascot over a mile than he was over 6f today.

    As has been referenced often on RUK Ryan Moore rode a superb race on Main Aim and Fortune should’ve done something similar on his horse.

    Atrocious ride gave the horse no chance whatsoever.

    #238971
    Avatar photoshabby
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    I have watched umpteen 7f horses niggled along early to go faster in 6f races

    What faster pace? They crawled.

    Paco Boy has tons of speed and would have went faster in the Lennox, Foret and Queen Anne. Ryan Moore on Main Aim maximised his position by riding prominently when he saw the pace was slow.
    A poor ride from Fortune, plain and simple, lacking in flexibility in the circumstances.

    #238972
    davidbrady
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    • Total Posts 3901

    I don’t see how Fleeting Spirit should have kept that race. Her momentum was never halted (she still ran sideways at top speed) while Main Aim was snatched up and had to start from 2nd/3rd gear again. It’s an absolutely ridiculous decision. This rubbish about "the best horse won so what’s the problem" is quite frankly both antiquated and ignores the reality of the situation. No horse can win a 6f race after being brought to a virtual standstill with < 2f to go.

    #238974
    stilvi
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5228

    Another lovely result for the bookmakers – Scenic Blast bolts up at Ascot but wouldn’t have won at any distance here; Doctor Fremantle totally useless at Ascot gets home yesterday and add to those the favourite not getting out until too late in the Bunbury Cup.

    #238977
    Avatar photoBosranic
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    • Total Posts 1982

    An unusual race.

    I was very surprised by the quite sedate early pace and Fleeting Spirit, who has shown her best form over the minimum distance, benefitted more than anything else.

    The first three all reversed Royal Ascot form with their respective conquerors:

    Fleeting Spirit / Scenic Blast
    Main Aim / Paco Boy
    J J The Jet Plane / Art Connossieur

    There’s little doubt that Tom Queally rode a very astute race, kicked early and perhaps stole the race.

    I haven’t had the opportunity to view the race again so I can’t comment on the ride Jimmy Fortune gave Paco Boy, but he ended up in a central position from his perch in stall 1 and I always felt that the draw could beat him.

    Paco Boy was arguably the best horse in the race and J J stayed on well far side. I’d take those two out of the race if connections look at the Sprint Cup.

    Looking at the head on, I think you can put a line through the run of Art Connossieur. He ended up stands side from a low draw and never looked happy.

    Well done to anyone who backed Fleeting Spirit.

    #238978
    Lingfield
    Member
    • Total Posts 919

    Not sure what Paco Boy was doing in this race.
    Trainer was previously referring to French races over 7f and a mile on going likely to have a bit more give as targets.
    Pretty obvious he didn’t want to start the season in Dubai either.
    Pressure from the owners?

    #238979
    Avatar photoaaronizneez
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1751

    I don’t see how Fleeting Spirit should have kept that race. Her momentum was never halted (she still ran sideways at top speed) while Main Aim was snatched up and had to start from 2nd/3rd gear again. It’s an absolutely ridiculous decision. This rubbish about "the best horse won so what’s the problem" is quite frankly both antiquated and ignores the reality of the situation. No horse can win a 6f race after being brought to a virtual standstill with < 2f to go.

    Pocket talking of the highest order from me here but I agree completely with the above. As David has written Main Aim was just getting in to top gear when being broadsided.Backers of Kings Apostle EW must also be pretty annoyed as well. The winner should have been thrown out and placed behind KA. I thought after yesterdays disqualification of the Godolphin runner that the authorities were finally seeing some sense but it seems not.

    #238980
    Avatar photoGingertipster
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    • Total Posts 34704

    There is no way Main Aim would have beaten Fleeting Spirit with a clear run. Just did not have the pace of Noseda’s fast lady. Where as yesterday, Alwaary would have beaen Schiaparelli without the inteference.

    Stewards got it right in both cases.

    I backed both Art Connoirsseur and Paco Boy and was wishing I had not done so after a couple of furlongs. Paco Boy out the back despite coming back in trip, and Art Connoirsseur not only last, but a couple of lengths behind the others in a slowly run race. Suppose that’s what is to be expected with Frank Spencer on board. If only Ms Turner was on board.

    Suppose only have myself to blame, as could see there was not much pace in the race. However, the winner is usually held up out the back too, so hardly foreseeable beforehand.

    Value Is Everything
    #238983
    Blackheath
    Member
    • Total Posts 105

    I have watched umpteen 7f horses niggled along early to go faster in 6f races

    What faster pace? They crawled.

    Paco Boy has tons of speed and would have went faster in the Lennox, Foret and Queen Anne. Ryan Moore on Main Aim maximised his position by riding prominently when he saw the pace was slow.
    A poor ride from Fortune, plain and simple, lacking in flexibility in the circumstances.

    Well you can argue that Fortune should have pushed Paco Boy from the stalls to be prominent (eg Murtagh’s US Ranger ride last year), but not being psychic and knowing that would be highly unlikely to work he probably settled for the usual hold up ride. What the video shows is Paco Boy close to flat out after the first furlong. It is the same old story. Sprinters go a stride faster than 7f/8f horses and that is enough to make the difference.

    #238985
    davidbrady
    Member
    • Total Posts 3901

    There is no way Main Aim would have beaten Fleeting Spirit with a clear run.

    It is not possible for anybody to determine who

    would

    have won the race if XYZ. What happened happened. But the benefit of the doubt should be given to the horse who has been affected and not the horse who caused the interference.

    As I asked on here before, when was the last Group 1 in England winner to be thrown on in the stewards room

    on the day

    ?

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