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Foxhunting is a noble sport and, IMO, the best way to control the Fox population – and they do need to be controlled because of the carnage they cause. And that’s the last words on it from me.
Nobody on the Internet ever changes their opinion about anything and to keep toing and froing is a waste of time.
TTC,
I have great respect for Tonge and his view. He/she made an excellent post setting out the anti-hunting arguement. At least he/she knows there’s a need for control.Personally, I am against hounds ripping apart foxes… But I am also against foxes being shot and injured, limping away and dying a long and painful death. While still recognising there’s a need for control. So it’s a conundrum / not as simple as you make out, TTC.
At least with hounds there is an element of natural selection too. Fit fox gets away but an unfit or injured one gets killed quickly or fairly quickly… And vast majority of foxes that get ripped apart are dead before it gets to that stage… Don’t feel it. With shooting there’s no knowing whether it’s a fit or unfit fox and – as already said – those limping away will die a long and painful death.
Personally, I’d rather have a quick death, I’d rather be shot dead quickly by an accurate gun shot than killed quickly by hounds; but is death by shooting going to be quick? If not I’d rather death by hunting. So have difficulty deciding if one method of control is better than the other. I’d certainly be against gassing or dogs going down fox holes / dens.
So that’s my explanation, TTC. Hope you can see I am not for “barbarism” or for “animal cruelty”. Am not for fox hunting, but I don’t see that shooting is any less cruel… And yet I repeat (and this is vitally important) recognising there is a need for control. So with one no better than the other imo it’s questionable whether hunting should be banned.
My own personal preference for control would be using safe cage traps and then remove them to another area (if disease free). May be necessary to kill some while in the cage. But are safe cages for all problematic foxes practical?
May be if the anti-hunting brigade provided this service for free there’d be enough cages / space and we could ban both hunting and shooting? 
Value Is EverythingFor what it’s worth, I think ITV Racing isn’t that bad. Although, I thought a lot more of it when I didn’t have a Racing TV subscription, since then I only watch the big events on ITV.
The Social Stable has a lot of potential but I think Oli and Chris need some more chemistry, they’re a bit awkward at times with one another. Its okay though.
I am a MASSIVE fan of the Home Schooling segment. Whoever cooked up that idea needs a raise! Such a good way to preserve the sport’s image.
Also, its controversial but I don’t think “Chesca” is that bad. At least compared to all of the other presenters. They all look like its not something they’re really interested in, that is, horseracing.
I wish we had more ex-jockeys on sometimes, I think they would inject some interest.
-Jade
Time flies like a banana, flies are like arrows...fruit?.. wait, no....
To try to get back on topic, how about ITV Racing Team Member Hunting, instead of Fox Hunting?
They could even change the name of the Foxhunters to the ITVRacinghunters – would that work?
Just an idea!
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Remember the days when we had both BBC and ITV racing on together.
From memory BBC had the bigger meetings Royal Ascot, Grand National, Cheltenham, but did ITV have the Derby?There was obviously no internet to analyse and discuss everything then as we do nowadays, but I’m sure the programmes then were informative as they needed to be. There was a good mix of everything and there was nothing that people took too much umbridge about. The programmes worked on both sides, though the BBC had a bit better quality coverage, something it is sadly lacking in ALL programmes now.
It all ‘went wrong’ for me when ITV ended their coverage leaving Balding and Carson on BBC as a double act. Balding, who sought clinical perfection in interviewing and presenting skills, alongside little Willie Carson offering that high pitched something of a laugh. Something switched then from the emphasis of the racing to the presenters and this has carried on to the current day.
When BBC too ended it’s coverage, Balding moved to the new Channel 4 racing coverage, continued her same dominant presence and viewers continued to turn off. The chemistry was not there.
While the ‘chemistry’ is better on ITV than C4, I still think the coverage or programme is short to where it could and should be.
ITV racing could well do revisiting coverage from both BBC and ITV from thirty forty years ago. It was simple, uncomplicated but popular, and it worked. I can imagine the budgets were much smaller too.
God knows how much the payroll costs ITV for all those people presenting on their programme.
But throwing as many bodies as you can at something does not guarantee success.ITV had all the Classics, though the 200th running of The Derby in 1979 was on both channels.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"That’s true ID, from Donny and Newmarket as well. Quite an even split between the two TV company’s.
To my mind people are looking back with rose coloured specs. Before Balding and Carson it was Wilson, Pitman and / or Lindley. OK in their day but only because we knew no different. They’d be seen as amateurs now. If the internet was available then they’d have been crucified. Surprised anyone would call the fun boy three “Informative”.
I wasn’t keen on Little Willie, but he was more for those that didn’t take the game as seriously as me – so that was fine. Great improvement on what came before. Liked Balding, she brought a new professionalism yet still entertaining.
Channel 4’s coverage far superior though. Better analysis too mainly due to Timeform Jim. Especially enjoyed week days with the four best races. However, RUK has imo taken Racing to a new higher level, at least for the proper Racing enthusiast.
ie We should remember that ITV Racing isn’t (and shouldn’t) be designed purely for us Puritans.
Value Is EverythingNot sure how you found Balding ‘entertaining’ Gingertipster. Can you explain?
For me “The Balding Effect” drove audiences down wherever she plied her trade.
They weren’t perfect back in the day, but I was watching the BBC coverage of the 1985 Lingfield Derby Trial on YouTube last month and I thought the gravitas of Peter O’Sullevan commentating and Julian Wilson reviewing the replay made everyone today look like utter light weights.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"If that were the case GSP, I don’t think Balding would’ve been on so many programmes. If TV audiences for Racing went down after the Wilson years it was only because there was a hell of a lot more competition from other sports. OK, Balding’s knowledge wasn’t of a form expert but that was not her role. She could still ask awkward questions, the questions that needed to be asked. I found her both funny and professional… an excellent presenter. Which was why she was in so such demand.
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BBC used to cover every meeting at Ascot, going back quite a while.
I agree with you about Clare Balding Gingertipster. When she started out, I thought she was a real breath of fresh air for horseracing coverage, and very knowledgeable about the game too. She was certainly quite different in style from Julian Wilson, but not inferior. Sadly as her profile rose she seemed to lose her affinity with racing to some extent though.
Julian Wilson was competent and did bring a certain gravitas to his role, though he was clearly of a bygone era, and was already part of a dying breed in his own day let alone now.
Of the other old BBC pundits, I always quite liked Richard Pitman who was enthusiastic and a good communicator. However, I thought Willie Carson was very unsuited to the role, and his inarticulacy in front of the camera usually managed to hinder whoever he was presenting with too.
I loved the Wilson O’Sullivan days. Great commentary and Julian not offering an opinion like we seem to get from every pundit on tv just now. Royal ascot was covered superbly and they focussed on the horses much more which I think is most folks bugbear just now. Imho tv racing should replicate going to the races. Maybe it’s just the adverts but the royal meeting was superb when chief singer won the Coventry followed by the st James palace the following year. Only racing debate on sky and nick luck is close to bygone years.
Agree mickeyip, there’s just too much analysing now. They do it to death.
Gingertipster, yes Balding was on a lot of programmes, just like the BBC do from time to time flood one person on everything thinking she is a winning combo. Alex Scott is the latest ‘star’ that ticks all the diversity boxes in this case, but doesn’t offer anymore.
Just my opinion but people became fed up to the back teeth with her, she became too dominant too important for the programme and it put people off.And I think ITV racing have not reached the heights they could because they have followed the Clare Balding template of interview perfections and made it more about them.
That’s why I suggested ITV racing going back thirty forty years to see how it was done, see the presenters just blended in and create the right chemistry for the programme.No mention of Graham Rock: for me comfortably the best pundit on the beeb
Another time, another place of course but what I liked about racing coverage and sports coverage in general back then was its no-frills rather perfunctory minimalism
A boring old windbreaker admittedly, but I find much of the ancillary technological whizz-bing-bang-billio rather annoying. Cricket is the worst offender with its ‘snickometers’, screenshots of where balls have pitched and all sorts of data flashing up in the corners of the screen
Oh for ‘It’s 11.25 and we now join Peter West at Trent Bridge for coverage of the morning’s play in the test match’
Cue two hours of Jim Laker, Richie Benaud and plenty of silence
zzzzzzzzzzz…
Balding is a very competent broadcaster and a good interviewer.
I think her problem with many racing fans was she came across as another posh racing female and she could be a bit schoolmarmish at times.
Thinking back to the so called “good old days” when O’Sullevan was off we had to endure John “ever so boring” Hamner and even Julian Wilson – who thought he was a good commentator?
I have to confess I couldn’t abide Wilson, he had something of the night about him, who seemed so far up his own backside he could self colonic irrigate – but that’s just a personal opinion.
May be if the anti-hunting brigade provided this service for free there’d be enough cages / space and we could ban both hunting and shooting? 
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