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On the point of Thomond, the thirties horse was Thomond II. The no-hoper in the 1976 Grand National named Thomond is the one we risk being eclipsed or besmirched by the 21st century version
I’d forgive them that one Ruby…….just. When I did those systems I stuck up, the name had to be identical. We had another similar one today at Newton Abbot, Poyntzpass, but the 80’s National Runner, who then went on to be owned by Brod Munro Wilson, was Poyntz Pass.
On the point of Thomond, the thirties horse was Thomond II. The no-hoper in the 1976 Grand National named Thomond is the one we risk being eclipsed or besmirched by the 21st century version
You are technically correct Pilgarlic. I think its a can of worms though. I’m currently doing research and drafting text for what I hope will be the ultimate Grand National history website. I’ve decided to dispense with all suffixes (Roman numerals, country of origin, etc) on the basis that, over time, there is inconsistency of their usage, especially spoken usage, when referring to a horse and they could be confusing to the layperson browser. Therefore, I’ve chosen to do thus: Thomond(1), Thomond(2). This system helps considerably when two horses of the same name ran in the same National (Pioneer, Bedford).
In the cases of horses with same sounding names but different spelling or spacing (Mathew/Matthew, Rory O’More/Rory O’Moore, etc) I’ve taken the view that the core name (i.e. name without any suffix) can clearly be seen to be different.
Naming of horses has come a long way towards clarity through the years. In much earlier times there are numerous examples of untitled horses running as ‘brother to…’, daughter of…’, ‘…gelding’. The use of Roman numerals has largely died out as has allowing a horse’s name to be changed. However, as recently as the 1960s Gay Navarree was heinously allowed to become Pontin-Go and, whilst some duplication is inevitable, the posts in this thread show the practice of allowing well known monikers to resurface is not as uncommon as I had believed. Spanish Steps for goodness sake!
Good luck with the website GM 34. Roman numeral suffixes seem to have died out after seeming commonplace when I became interested
Pilgarlic, your old rival Eyecatcher is back out tomorrow at Wolverhampton.
I feel a new system coming on lol
Thanks Pilgarlic. A long shot but does anyone have access to any of the Racing Calendar Steeple Chases Past annuals or Sporting Life newspapers for the period 1919-1940? (The Life is not yet in the online British Newspaper Archive beyond 1910). All I am after is where these publications think each non-finisher exited the Grand National in those years to check against what I have been able to deduce. Cheers, Chris.
Well spotted Bobby, came ‘turd’ as well,how appropriate. Hope Mrs Doreen Tabor can get by on the £577 prize money, about a tenth of what the old mare picked up which I find strangely comforting.
lol Pilgarlic, Yeah, third was fitting, but he did show a bit at the end, and I hold out hope that he can add to that £577. Looks a winner once he gets his act together.
Rostropovich…. the 1997 and the 2015 versions both Magnier and Tabor owned.
Surely their favorite cellist and conductor.
Today’s Futurity Stakes winner Rostropovich follows on quite quickly from Rostropovich I, who also carried the Tabor colours in the early part of his career.
I remember the original version as an also-ran in Millenary’s St Leger and the brilliant Hors La Loi III’s Champion Hurdle.
His attitude became a problem and his final win came in a memorable ‘battle of the dodgepots’ against Deano’s Beeno at Sandown in 2003, both doing their best to say ‘after you’.
Once again the Racing Post website has spewed forth a timely and informative article, perhaps the RP is taking its cue from threads started on TRF!:
https://www.racingpost.com/news/in-depth/the-art-rules-and-rudeness-of-naming-racehorses/298063
I see Roman Warrior makes his debut today, got to be on a par with Spanish Steps. Congrats Messrs Macauliffe & Don.
Mrs Good’s Adjutant made his debut at Haydock yesterday, 20 years after Mrs Good’s & her late husbands Adjutant (Holding Court & Tomba’s half brother) made his debut at Haydock.
One noticeable one from recent years was Masked Marvel. There was an original with Henry Cecil in the late 1970’s who was also quite useful. He was part of that Wildenstein intake that included Hello Georgeous, Buckskin, Vacarme and Many Moons.
As for Ballydoyle and repeat names; MV O’Brien had a Brahms in the mid 1970’s who was quite decent and not far, ability wise, behind the later version with AP O’Brien. The 1970’s Ballydoyle team also had a Yeats.
They have also had a Road to Mandalay (the original, a decent staying hurdler), Zoffany ( the the original once a promising Guy Harwood trained horse) and the ill-fated Gypsy Dancey ( the original a Niarchos owned Peter Walwyn trained animal).
I notice The Land Agent is back on the scene 15-20 years after being Seamus Mullins’ stable star. The original won the John Bull Chase at Wincanton and ran well a couple of times in the Racing Post Chase (2nd to Dr Leunt and 4th to Gloria Victis).
The new version (admittedly Irish-bred, original was GB) doesn’t look like living up to the name. Beaten almost 300 lengths between his first four starts for Dai Williams and pulled-up behind Western Miller at Statford last week.
I see Colonel Frank is back in action at Epsom tomorrow.
I remember Colonel Frank I – a progressive staying chaser for Brendan Powell, who won three in a row before being sent off 4/1f for Farmer Jack’s Racing Post Chase. Controversially he ran (and fell heavily) just a week after being a NR due to a vet’s certificate. Injuries then kept him off the course for two years and he was never the same again.
Unfulfilled potential perhaps.
One noticeable one from recent years was Masked Marvel. There was an original with Henry Cecil in the late 1970’s who was also quite useful.
Another for the Cecil fans today: in the opener at Tipperary, we have a runner called Clare Island. The original was a useful juvenile filly for Henry back in 1981, finishing runner-up to Height of Fashion in the May Hill Stakes, and was then awarded the Princess Elizabeth Stakes on her 3yo debut, on the disqualification of Mary Mitsu.
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