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Fascinating stuff Crepello. It would certainly make more sense that a regional paper would carry a photo of a horse with local connections. The Northern Echo, although it’s available in North Yorkshire is mainly seen in the North East: Middlesbrough and Darlington to Tyneside, so could it be worth looking up that way for a ‘big’ winner of a York race; there can’t have been many and it would be significant news
The Sykes baronets have a long history of involvement in the Turf and if memory serves the present incumbent Tatton Sykes was either a steward at York on on their board. Isinglass is your man for colours so hope he can come up with the Sykes’s and perhaps every colour that featured two crossbelts on a plain silk in 1948/49!
Think the French connection, Volterra and Doyasbere, is leading us up the garden path. Back to the drawing board
Think that’s a good call H.
Thanks, Ginge . There is a definite likeness to our elusive jockey.
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Harry Carr
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
You’re reading too much in to people’s motives again Steve. AP meant no harm.
No, there are ways of wording your replies. Harping on about not being convinced by the written word and being shown a video isn’t a nice way of telling someone they are wrong.
Royal Drake didn’t have any white on him so it’s not him as others have said. The date seemed to fit and sometimes thinking off the track leads to the solution. The newpaper and the pedigree were obviously wrong about the dates and that’s the trouble with these things, the good old human error, as we still see on ATR and other sites to this day.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
I am getting ‘horse blind’ and probably confused now. I know this horse has the wrong date but the pattern of the wonky blaze is almost identical (but s/he has no socks)
Phil Drake. Is this the same family or gene pool?
However, just to widen the search a bit. The sailor was moved to HMS Drake Plymouth in Sept ’48 and stayed there until Sept ’49 when he was assigned to HMS Jamaica and headed for Korea. I wondered if there is a possibility that he used an old hat during ’49? The later date would make him 18 in the picture.
It isn’t Phil Drake, he won the Derby in 1955 any way, so he’s well out of the time calculations.
I have just been through the Good and Betts books for 1947 and 1948 with no luck.
I agree that it is probably a horse with a Northern connection. One thing I did notice was that most of the big Newmarket and Southern stables ran their horses in nosebands but most of the prominent Northern trainers, Charles Elsey, the Peacocks and Rufus Beasley and Noel Murless (who moved to Beckhampton in 1948) didn’t use nosebands. This does suggest it is a Northern trained filly. However Good and Betts only have skeleton coverage of Northern stables in the 1947-8 editions. Has anyone got anyone got the 1947/8 Timeforms? A rich person or someone with racing ancestors obviously!Ladycross who won the 1947 Yorkshire Oaks was bred at Sledmere, I don’t know if she was raced by Sykes, but she is out of Eleanor Cross, one of broodmare band there. She is described as bay though and this one doesn’t have black points. Though Eleanor Cross was a chestnut and threw a chestnut in Three Weeks and Ladycross’s daughter Victoria Cross was chestnut so maybe she was recorded incorrectly on the records. I cant find her owner and trainer though.
She will almost certainly be in the Timeform (well Phil Bull’s best horses of 1947) can someone look her up?
The Northern connection is increased by the fact Ladycross is the name of a district near Whitby.Ladycross was trained by Cecil Boyd-Rochford who used nosebands…..so sadly I think we can leave her out…..
I think identifying the jockey is the key here, if we are sure of the years – 1947, 1948 and the Course – York. I have all the form books since the first world war, so can easily provide the winners (assuming this is a winning horse) at York for any particular jockey.
I know there is some dispute as to whether the jockey could be Gordon Richards.
Comparison with some online images suggest it is possible, so a couple of suggestions:
Golden Triumph 2-y-o Chestnut colt ridden by Gordon Richards to win the Malton Stakes at York over 5f on Wed 6th Oct 1948. Trained by Rufus Beasley, Owned by E Broadbelt.
Gainsborough Lady 2-y-o Bay filly ridden by Gordon Richards to win the Askham Maiden Stakes at York over 6f Thu 7th Oct 1948. Trained by Rufus Beasley, Owned by E Broadbelt.
Unable to trace the owner’s colours, which would obviously rule these in or out.
For what it’s worth, the colours in the photo aren’t that of the French owner if you compare them to the Pathe footage of Phil Drake’s win in the Grand Prix de Paris on youtube. The colour of the hoops appear much lighter in the footage.
....and you've got to look a long way back for anything else.
The jockey in the photo is most definitely not Gordon Richards.
You can take that much to the bank .
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
Hi all, I’ve decided I might go insane (as might yourselves) trying to solve this. So I’ve booked the newspaper from 47 to 49 and will get a peek on Thursday next at the British Library. IF the image is not in there (omg) I might take to drink
Does anyone know the colours of Irish shoe manufacturer Norman Wachman? The horse itself looks a lot like 1946 Nunthorpe (York) winner The Bug. Chestnut colt and the white flash is spot on. Even has a white foot. Picture of the horse is on wikipedia. Ridden by Charlie Smirke. Although jockey is not a perfect match, it still could be him. Not trained in Yorkshire, but the human interest is that he was thought of as the best sprinter for years, Press described the York performance as a “dazzling run”. Timeform rating 135.
Value Is EverythingIt’s definitely not The Bug , Ginge ; the white markings differ on our horse.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
It’s definitely not The Bug , Ginge ; the white markings differ on our horse.
How H? All the white in the page 1 pic is either there on The Bug or obscured from view and the face is spot on as far as I can see.
Value Is EverythingHow H? All the white in the page 1 pic is either there on The Bug or obscured from view and the face is spot on as far as I can see.
I don’t know if you’re studying the same pic , Ginge , but in the one I saw , The Bug
has a very distinctive white nose and his white markings ( hind legs )
are different.Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
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