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Frankie to sign up with Ballydoyle……

Home Forums Horse Racing Frankie to sign up with Ballydoyle……

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  • #21411
    wordfromthewise
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    • Total Posts 467

    Just a wild (ish) theory.

    With the rise of Barzalona and other jockey machinations taking place maybe Frankie could do with a fresh challenge of his own.

    Ballydoyle could do with a jockey……Joe looks ‘unconvincing’ and will be too heavy within a season.

    The only stumbling block from what could be a very exciting and interesting development is the very admirable loyalty that has characterised the relationship between Sheikh Mohammed and Frankie and also the fact that Frankie is very Newmarket based.

    One to watch maybe……….or just a thought.

    #398935
    sberry
    Member
    • Total Posts 1801

    I don’t know why but keep thinking he’ll be retiring soon.

    He’s middle age now, big family, likes his food business and will have no end of TV offers when he stops, nothing left to prove, no records I can think of unfulfilled – why keep wasting yourself down and travelling the world – it’s not as if he can even enjoy a full cooked English breakfast in all the posh hotels anyway, like we might look on as small bonuses to a travelling job.

    He’ll not need to go on any waiting lists at the Emirates either.

    #399064
    andyod
    Member
    • Total Posts 4012

    Thanks Wordfromthewise for raising the issue.Your reference to the Ballydoyle No.1 jockey is both timely and appropriate.However as long as Aidan decides the issue Ballydoyle will be in trouble. He does not seem able to get along with really good jockeys,whether he feels threatened by them or what I don’t know. I do know that he could not get along with Christy Roach, Mick Kinane,Kieren Fallon, Jamie Spencer nor Johanny Murtagh.Also he seems to have difficulty stating what he wants.He got Ryan Moore but insists on putting him up on the second string even while he says he will use him when available which he does but not on his first string.The whole situation is a shame at Ballydoyle.Aidan is great around horses but a great trainer needs to be able to do what is best for the horses and not just what is best for his sons.They must learn to take care of themselves like we all had to do.He has filled Joseph’s head with the notion he is a wonderful jockey without Joseph having to prove it.Bad approach.Now the yard has no world class jockey while Godolfin has three!

    #399065
    thehorsesmouth
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5551

    I’d argue that the Ballydoyle jockeys are as good as Godolphins. As good as Detorri and De Souza are, Ballydoyle have two to match in Seamie Heffernan and Colm O’Donoghue imo. What makes Barzalona so much better than the egotistical young O’Brien? :roll:

    #399066
    andyod
    Member
    • Total Posts 4012

    The Derby and the World Cup I suppose also he does not have a famous daddy to get him the best rides.

    #399067
    Gingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 28423

    You’re joking THM. Seamus and Colm are fair, but they’re not as good as Frankie and Sylvestre. Don’t personally rank Mikael, but he’s got time on his side.

    Value Is Everything
    #399068
    andyod
    Member
    • Total Posts 4012

    The two mentioned above are certainly better than Joseph, pity their daddy is not running the yard.How did Joseph end up riding SYT? Heffernan won on him.Seems like Aidan is willing to do anything to establish his opinion about jockeys in the yard.As I said earlier the better the jockey the less chance he has of getting the best rides.Or so it seems.

    #399069
    Gingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 28423

    The two mentioned above are certainly better than Joseph, pity their daddy is not running the yard.How did Joseph end up riding SYT? Heffernan won on him.Seems like Aidan is willing to do anything to establish his opinion about jockeys in the yard.As I said earlier the better the jockey the less chance he has of getting the best rides.Or so it seems.

    I don’t see much between the three Ballydoyle jockeys myself. Although Joseph might not be as good as Seamus or Colm yet, he’s young and could be better in the long run. If (big IF) weight doesn’t become too big a problem.

    I wonder whether they’ve tried to enlist a top jockey, but nobody wants the job when Joseph is in the background.

    Value Is Everything
    #399074
    thehorsesmouth
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5551

    "Gingertipster" wrote: You’re joking THM. Seamus and Colm are fair, but they’re not as good as Frankie and Sylvestre. Don’t personally rank Mikael, but he’s got time on his side.

    No joke Ginger :lol:

    They’ve proven time and time again that they’re capable of producing the goods on the big day, usually riding a second or third string. Both under rated imo. They may not have achieved the glittering heights Detorri has in his career I admit. De Souza is an exciting talent but has of yet achieved little. I do admit he looks a great prospect. The way I look at it, there isn’t much between either camps jockeys.

    How about a Guineas or a Breeders Cup Turf Andy?

    #399076
    Eclipse First
    Member
    • Total Posts 1569

    I do not understand your dislike of Mikael Barzalona Ginger. He has Group one class already, SDS has yet to prove he has. I must admit his arrogance does seem annoying, but when you are as good as he is at that age….

    Whether he will convert that natural talent into a long and glittering career is another matter entirely.

    #399080
    andyod
    Member
    • Total Posts 4012

    Horsesmouth.Other Ballydoyle stable lads have won the Derby twice so winning the Guineas hardly propells one to the top.As for the BC. Well it worked once so he tries it again in Maydan. Not the response of a world class jockey.How about the King George? Sorry, I remain unconvinced.All apprentices have to work their way forward after losing their claime before getting Group One rides. He was never given the opportunity to mature.Being good is not good enough for the biggest barn in Europe.To follow the footsteps of Kinane,Fallon, Spencer and Murtagh requires talent of the very highest order.Being the son of the trainer does not of itself qualify one for the job.

    #399083
    thehorsesmouth
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5551

    ndy, I asked you the question on another thread so I’ll ask it again:

    What would you do if you were in charge of Ballydoyle?

    I have my own ideas on what I’d do but you seem obsessed with the issue so you surely must have an opinion yourself?

    #399086
    thehorsesmouth
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5551

    Have just seen your reply, sorry about that.

    Murtagh first and Fallon second you say. It seems as though Murtagh is a happier man away from Ballydoyle.

    #399111
    andyod
    Member
    • Total Posts 4012

    Is that not the nub of the problem?If I recall Jamie said he wanted to be able to sleep at night.So there you have it.

    #399141
    Aragorn
    Member
    • Total Posts 2208

    Dettori will never ride for Ballydoyle. He doesn’t need to….. He’s earned his money already.

    #399151
    Gingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 28423

    I do not understand your dislike of Mikael Barzalona Ginger. He has Group one class already, SDS has yet to prove he has. I must admit his arrogance does seem annoying, but when you are as good as he is at that age….

    Whether he will convert that natural talent into a long and glittering career is another matter entirely.

    I don’t have a "dislike" of Barzalona EF. Just don’t rate him as highly as I do both Dettori and DeSousa. Main reason is his over confidence and seemingly one dimentional riding. Great coming from the back in a true/strongly run race, getting all the plaudits when swooping late. But I’ve noticed when the pace is slow he’s slow to react. Instead of getting closer to the pace before the pace quickens, he’s seemingly content to stay out the back, often having too much ground to make up. It wouldn’t stop me backing one of his.

    I don’t like his arrogance, and one day he’ll lose by celebrating too early; but that’s a seperate issue. Mikael is young and is undoubtedly promising, could become a top jockey in future.

    Value Is Everything
    #399153
    Gingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 28423

    No joke Ginger :lol:

    They’ve proven time and time again that they’re capable of producing the goods on the big day, usually riding a second or third string. Both under rated imo. They may not have achieved the glittering heights Detorri has in his career I admit. De Souza is an exciting talent but has of yet achieved little. I do admit he looks a great prospect. The way I look at it, there isn’t much between either camps jockeys.

    How about a Guineas or a Breeders Cup Turf Andy?

    Don’t know about "proven time and time again" THM. Colm and Seamus are often on the best horse. As said "not as good" but you might be right, "under rated". When Murtagh or Fallon were still there I often backed the value, under rated second string with Seamus or Colm on board.

    Silvestre hasn’t had the opportunities on top class horses Colm and Seamus have. You don’t have to judge a jockey by Group 1 races; he’s proven time and time again in the lower grade to be one of the best riders around. Usually in the right place and superb judge of pace. Just as Fallon was a top jockey before leaving the Ramsdens.

    Value Is Everything
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