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I greatly prefer the Jumps to Flat racing for the following reasons:
1) Including obstacles adds an extra dimension of skill
2) Including obstacles adds considerably to the excitement. There is very little to excite in a flat race, decreasing as the races get shorter. Watching a 5f sprint in which horses just bomb along a straight track and some go quicker than others leaves me quite cold.
3) The jumps races last longer so you get more action to enjoy and more chance for a "story" to develop. I well remember the day, for example, when Bonanza Boy won a race I saw (live) after being miles behind with a circuit to go. Flat racing is much less likely to produce such "stories" within the races.
4) Jumps horses careers are usually longer so that the public get to know them really well and even to love & cherish them.
I do love the big Saturday chases, The Festival and Aintree however overall it has to be the Flat.
More high quality horses and therefore class performances to enthuse over.
More competition amongst the training fraternity.
More international.
More quality racing spread out more evenly over the week and over the season.
Pounds per length collateral form means more.
Less fatalities.The Derby would be much more of a spectacle with obstacles. Perhaps they could introduce fences made from Epsom Chav.
National Hunt is real racing, followed by real race fans, who brave the most severe elements to follow their sport. NH has more passion, the people within NH are more approachable and the horses truly are equine Gods.
That’s like telling me people who cannot drive vehicles in manual are pussies, those who know and drive in manual are real men etc etc
It’s a pathetic argument.
I love racing, I love equine.
You sir, with all due respect, are a pretentious w*nker.
To be fair MD, while no doubt a sweeping generalisation, the point KC was making was that NH racing takes place predominantly during the winter months and as a result tends to attract hardcore racing fans as opposed to the stag do brigade.
It could also be viewed as a more accessible, cheaper way of investing in the sport with the owners, trainers & jockeys (with a few obvious exceptions) being seen as more ‘working class’ – largely due to the lesser prize money and cost of ownership et al.
Lee
I like both codes. Although because jumpers tend to be around year on year it does help me gain an affinity for them. The single greatest race meeting flat or jump anywhere in the world is the Cheltenham Festival.
I think to have flat without jump or jump without flat would become boring. We have it good in this country I think.
Both really. But I don’t get all this falling in love with horses. If I see a horse next year it just means I know its form, but if it retires fine, there’ll be another one that will win races. A bit heartless but they are just animals and I am not attatched to most of them.
I’ve a marginal preference for jump racing, but happily watch flat racing as well. Since moving to Scotland I tend to watch a bit more jumping, but then the fact Perth is one of my locals means I’ve got sumemr jump meetings on my doorstep. Mind you I work a 1/4 mile from the six furlong start at Hamilton, so I’ve easy access to the flat as well.
I used to live in Oxfordshire, so had a right mix of courses within easy driving distance, and Ascot was only three stops on the train. It meant I ticked off a pretty even mix of flat and jumps. I also did a few All-weather meetings and, though it would heresy to some, quite enjoyed those as well.
My betting is definitely more jumps oriented, if only because I’ve identified more of an edge in jump racing. I’m happy looking at a 0-90 handicap chase, but struggle with a 0-60 flat handicap.
Rob
I’ve been following both codes for years with equal interest, but any casual viewer who happened to see the 1.55 Beginner’s Chase at Thurles today could be forgiven for being put off NH for life, as the mare Mullicagh Lass took what to me was one of the most horrifyingly fatal falls I’ve seen in many a year, and she was still visible on the ground without screens on the 2nd circuit.
In fact the whole meeting seemed to take a heavy toll.With so much televised racing today this is an almost common occurrence and is not for the more sensitive viewer, and I couldn’t blame anyone for thinking just who would want to be involved in such a sport as this.
The RP’s post race analysis only managed:-
"Mullicagh Lass suffered a fatal fall at the third fence"well my oh my, thanks for telling us. Brush it under the carpet, hope no one notices.
It was actually worse than that UM – I was at Thurles yesterday so I saw all that happened. The fall was horriffic and it was not until after the race was over that they turned up with the screens. Then whne the screens were up – and this is something I shall never forget – the filly actually leapt right up in the air, flew out from behind the screens before collapsing again.
I never did find out what actually happened, although I have a suspicion which I would prefer not to think about, but it was not a pretty sight.
There were a very large number of falls at Thurles yesterday, more than I have seen at a single meeting in many a long time.
In that same race I thought the front two in the betting both falling, independently, at the last when fighting for the lead, was unbelievable. When watching the replay after it was almost a synchronised fall.
It wasn’t only the horses who had a bad day – "Slippers" Madden took a heavy fall and looked to have done his collar bone, althought I thought the medics dragging him off the course rather than dolling off the flight was a tad harsh.
I do love the jumps but if I had to choose it’d definitely be the flat – not all weather though.
I like both codes but certainly prefer the jumps.
I like the fact the runners are around for longer in the jumps scene and you get more equine characters. Horses like Lough Derg are perfect examples – not a winning machine but you know the animal has heart and will invariably give maximum effort.
I like the fact you get more racing for your buck – at a typical six race jumps meeting you will get around half an hour’s actual racing. Whilst at a six race flat meeting you will be lucky to get 10 mins actual racing.
From a race reading perspective I prefer the slower pace of jump racing – then again it could be tha as I am older now my brain isn’t quite as fast as it used to be and it finds a 5f sprint a bit hard to cope with. (Then again with the 17 runner events at Thurles yesterday, where I don’t know any of the runners, it was just as tricky).
Flat racing is, of course, a totally different sport to the jumps, as Grassy pointed out you are not comparing apples with apples. It is especially good to see the top races where there really is a battle to find the "top" horse of the division.
I even enjoy all weather racing, in moderation and when it avoids the "banded" fare. A listed race on the artificial surface is just as valid as a turf listed race.
I like the fact the runners are around for longer in the jumps scene and you get more equine characters. Horses like Lough Derg are perfect examples – not a winning machine but you know the animal has heart and will invariably give maximum effort.
What about Quito on the flat has run over 100 races, over 9 years, with 20 wins, god knows how many places, and was beaten 1/4 of a length in a group1? Most horses short of top class dont get retired at the end of the season on the flat, much like lough derg et al on the jumps.
I used to hate flat but over the years my distaste has mellowed. Much prefer the jumps (live for Cheltenham) but enjoy the flat during the summer.
As has been said previously, i enjoy the fact that you can follow a NH through the ranks as opposed to the flat where your favourite horse will only run for two years.
1 apple doesn’t make a pie Bul.
The heroes of the jumps will always attract true race lovers that bit more than the flat. I have no argument with that but when you have horses like Sea Bird II, Grundy and Bustino, Pebbles, Zarkava, Mill Reef, Brigadier Gerard etc showing us their phenominal talents it may not be a long love affair but it’s a damn sexy one while it lasts.
Actually going to the races the jumps are far more entertaining IMO Everything happens to fast on the flat and you miss so much
1 apple doesn’t make a pie Bul.
Well Ok then, what about horses like Maraahel, Warsaan, Les Arcs, Reverence, Doyen, Yeats, Papal Bull, Youmzain, Shirocco, Manduro, Getaway, Nayef, Falbrav, Ouija Board, Persian Punch, Balthazaars Gift, Sergeant Cecil, etc etc etc (not forgetting of course good old bulwark). Then you have all the handicappers who come back out almost every season, and are mostly campaigned until they can take no more.
Then theres our top class flat horses who are actually retired at 3 like (taking 3 good examples) Montjeu, Giants Causeway, Galileo and then go on to knock up stars 4 years down the line, such Motivator, Hurricane Run, Scorpion, Montmartre, Papal Bull, Teofilo, New Approach, Sixties Icon, Purple Moon, Red Rocks, Shamardal, Heatseeker, Footstepsinthesand, Maids Causeway, Frost Giant, Red Giant, Intense Focus.
And over the jumps those 3 have knocked up Celestial Halo, Won In The Dark, Blue Bajan, Jack The Giant, along with a load of others who fill out the fields with the offspring of other ex flat stars.
Personally, when it comes to betting on either code, I will generally try to find a horse who is most open to improvement ata reasonable price, and so the older established horses that most of the betting public tend to fawn over actually do very little for me, ie I backed Yeats when he won his first gold cup at 8s and Master Minded when he done his first Champ Chase, but its unlikely that I will ever back either ever again.
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