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…my word what a mild rebuke for such a ride…and yeah I do think it was quite a bit different to anything KF did there, frankly amazed that you don’t?
I see this in these dirt races in the States, and I have been to 1 or 2, but it’s not for me really. I remember Edgar Prado a few years ago just about put me off it for life, always thought he was one of the worst offenders.EW, I’ve come to the conclusion you’re a man with no heart, an inveterate gambler who will bet on anything that moves. Did you play with Escalado when young? my brother did and he’s much the same..
you take care now, and no offence intended with the last para, entirely
tongue in cheek
UM
What should i say?
Though i think Prado should be took to task, It was a battle of two fine animals who produced the best finish of the whole meeting imo
A great sight and the close up pics were brilliant
What should i say?
Though i think Prado should be took to task, It was a battle of two fine animals who produced the best finish of the whole meeting imo
A great sight and the close up pics were brilliant
…ok, sorry I can’t quite share your enthusiasm here.
If I recall I think the Prado effort that started me on a downward spiral, amongst many others, was on Harlan’s Holiday in the K. Derby [?]. At least we agree on something
No need for the apology UM
You are just giving your opinion like me and imo it would be very boring if we all saw things the same way
What it all boils down to is that I had an opinion that the horses couldn’t win – simple as that.
You never presented it as an opinion, you presented it as a fact. You said:
"The horse simply couldn’t win"
Not, "I believe the the horse couldn’t win".
It’s comments like this:
I knew in my opinion the horse had no chance (24 hours prior to the race), then why couldn’t the trainer see it
that give the message "I knew it, I’m so much smarter than the trainer".
Hope this helps,
Steve
Well apologies if you took it the wrong way Steve, or rather, sorry if you think I put it across the wrong way.
I would never put up a fact as a basis for debate, simply because I know you can’t debate facts. You can argue opinions, but you can’t argue facts is something I know far too well.
Anyway, no hard feeling on my part, yesterday was a different day, and tomorrow will be another different one
Mike
With such a strangle hold on world racing, Coolmore can do what they bloody want, if one fails there will always be another one coming along that will succeed.
I’d go as far as to say the occasional head-lock on european racing!
If every horse ran true to form EVERY time, i would be a very rich man.
Im sure that in hindsight, all trainers wouldn’t have run a horse that put in a stinker or got fatally injured.
Only time tells tales.
"If every horse ran true to form EVERY time, i would be a very rich man"
I doubt it, you wouldn’t be able to get a bet on!
Colin.
Luckily I did lay Dylan Thomas on Saturday afternoon after I saw the state of the turf on Friday night. I thought he wouldn’t win; but I didn’t dare lay him for anymore than my usual amount because he was still the best horse in the race by far.
The reason why it wasn’t wrong to run Dylan Thomas is because if the ground had been firmer – he could have outclassed the lot of them; as it was, the ground was soft and he didn’t run upto his best. Has this diminished his repuation in anyway? No.. which proves that they may as well have ran him as there wasn’t anything to lose. The worst possible outcome has happened (defeat) and it hasn’t made a jot of difference.
As for George: that matter is too complicated… in a nutshell, I think soft ground was inconvienient for Dylan Thomas (but not particularly dangerous) whereas sloppy mud was dangerous for George Washington because its so different to what he’s used to (and that’s how I felt before he ran).
Is sloppy ground considered dangerous for horses?? I dont know, Im just asking? Would it be more dangerous than the bad ground he experienced in the 2000 guineas on the curragh?
SHL
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Is sloppy ground considered dangerous for horses?? I dont know, Im just asking? Would it be more dangerous than the bad ground he experienced in the 2000 guineas on the curragh?
Good question SHL.
While there would have been only more heavy ground under the surface at the Curragh it was apparent, even from TV pictures, that the 4" ‘cushion’ at Monmouth had turned into a fluid and useless swamp which appeared to do nothing at all to protect a horses legs on impact with the harder surface underneath.
While the kickback from this slop may have been a factor in GW’s poor run, it is a pound to a pinch of salt that the track, as it raced, was a direct contributor to the horse’s sad demise.
I have seen the Southwell surface many times after prolonged periods of heavy rain, but I have never seen it look anywhere near as dangerous as MP did on Saturday.What does the time of the race have anything to do with how dangerous the ground is? Obviously the track rode fairly fast, because the horses hooves were going straight through onto the hard surface beneath.
TC, you may think it ‘strange’ that there were no other casualties on Saturday, but do you not also think it is rather strange that the ONE horse who was fatally injured was also the one horse who was totally not used to the stresses and strains a sloppy dirt track puts on a horse’s legs?? (And dont say that it was the same situation for the other horses – at least they have experience of racing on dirt tracks on a number of occasions).
That’s not strictly true; there were a few horses in the Juvenile races who had raced exclusively on artificial or turf tracks before Saturday.
GW had probably not faced conditions that firm before, he’d probably not faced fractions that fast before either and these two factors would probably have put more pressure on his limbs than ever before
The pace was hot and GW couldn’t handle it, nor could Lawyer Ron, nor could Tiago or Any Given Saturday etc
Would the connections have known this prior to running , probably not, because you can only estimate the track condition, and you can only estimate what the pace will be
One broke down under the stress this caused, the rest came home safe
That, i’m afraid is horse racing, and as i stated earlier, it surprises me more fatalities don’t occur
Hopefully the introduction of synthetic surfaces will cut down the risk of fatalities, but as we saw at Wolves it’s no guarantee
The track, while certainly not vissually appealing, was perfectly raceable IMO..
That said, I do think Beeswing has a point when he states that George Washington probably was at a disadvantage in that he was unfamiliar with the surface (only one run before)..
GW had probably not faced conditions that firm before, he’d probably not faced fractions that fast before either and these two factors would probably have put more pressure on his limbs than ever before
The pace was hot and GW couldn’t handle it, nor could Lawyer Ron, nor could Tiago or Any Given Saturday etc
Would the connections have known this prior to running , probably not, because you can only estimate the track condition, and you can only estimate what the pace will be
One broke down under the stress this caused, the rest came home safe
That, i’m afraid is horse racing, and as i stated earlier, it surprises me more fatalities don’t occur
Hopefully the introduction of synthetic surfaces will cut down the risk of fatalities, but as we saw at Wolves it’s no guarantee
EW,
Monmouth did a good job in getting any racing going in those conditions.
The problem with a sloppy track is that there can be false ground where the dirt below gets washed out in patches. One ankle twisting in false ground with 2 tonnes force on it and it snaps. As is well known, the unacceptable rate of fatalities on dirt is behind the push to polytrack racing in USA. The top USA horses on dirt are the battle hardened survivors of such often repeated all-out stresses. GW had no chance at all against them – BCup all out pace, footing, track shape and stamina. The connections must have known that from Belmont 2006 at time of entry let alone race time or were just blinded by hoping to off load GW for slightly possible future breeding.
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