- This topic has 403 replies, 28 voices, and was last updated 4 years, 7 months ago by
.
- Posts
Corky you make some good points but the easy answer WAS to enforce border controls last January ( according to the. Imperial College Scientist who broke lockdown rules and visited his girlfriend)
The only way Test Track Trace and Isolate can feasibly be worked are if virus numbers are kept low – evidence the Far East.I am incandescent with rage over Care Homes – old people; the shufflers, some in there voluntarily but a lot locked up for their own good.
The shuffler deaths in these respectable £900 a week Hess prisons W/E 5th Jan this year was 1300. Twenty three times more than Covid deaths elsewhere.
I could write all night in this Tank free zone except for the fact I have a meeting with four or five sardines, tortured with heat, some greenies and a pint of sparkly mineral water with my apple cider mother to add a touch of taste.
Maybe closing the borders would have helped but they were not. We cannot turn back the clock.
Sorry if it upsets anyone but I rather fear this virus is now endemic and here to stay. No amount of social distancing or masks is going to change that.
And with the virus mutating, the effect of the vaccine is likely to be limited. I had to see my doctor today about a non-covid matter and he admitted they do not know how the vaccine situation will play out.
It may be harsh but in my view we are going to have to learn to live with this virus eventually. We cannot go on as we are, otherwise the cure will do more harm than the disease.
And in our own little parish, how much longer can racing realistically continue without crowds and with betting shops closed? With Glastonbury being cancelled, it looks clear to me that we are going to have a second summer of festivals behind closed doors.
And Cheltenham with no crowd and with betting shops possibly closed is going to really hit racing’s finances. Racecourse closures and job losses look inevitable.
Where is the evidence that lockdowns work? They are an almost unprecedented experiment and the burden of proof is on their advocates
I would contend that the evidence so far is that lockdowns do work inasmuch as they quite rapidly reduce rates of infection; but they’re only useful as a stopgap measure to prevent the NHS being acutely overwhelmed or, as is hopefully now the case, as a method of containment of the virus until the vaccination programme takes effect
Whether the positive impacts that lockdowns have on the health of the population from one particular easily identified pathogen outweigh the negative impacts they have on the rather more difficult to quantify effects on health caused by isolation, lost education, loss of income and a plethora of other stress-inducers caused by economic hardship remains to be seen
My view is that this should most certainly be the last lockdown but lifting it should be resisted until the vaccine has – as we all sincerely hope – reduced infection to minimal levels and hard data on efficacy has been studied. To lift this one too early (again) would in all likelihood mean another one would be required, and that would be disastrous
Longer term pain for long term gain, not short term pain for shorter term gain
Opinion: all is opinion
In horsey🐎 terms
Some idiot left the stable door open !!
They send out virus kits for those that need them – the nurse I talked about got two sets for herself.
Yeah but it got me thinking about how they might be chaotically organising holidays next year. They’ll make you send out your kit first – all ironed and spread out in unfolded class and you’ll follow a week later – all crumpled up in a case.
“My view is that this should most certainly be the last lockdown but lifting it should be resisted until the vaccine has – as we all sincerely hope – reduced infection to minimal levels and hard data on efficacy has been studied.”
Agree. In practical terms the lockdown could not really be lifted straightaway. Many people are still too frightened to use public transport or mingle in crowded places, so any lifting would be in name only. People’s confidence has to be restored and if a vaccine does that then so be it.
And a proper, far reaching inquiry into the effects of lockdown is essential. Viruses are not going to go away in future and this cannot become a default policy.
And I agree we should all recognise we are in uncharted territory here. Neither side of the debate have all the answers. The more strident sceptics and lockdown supporters should recognise that.
Yes, we will have to “learn to live with the virus” CAS. Live with at least some restrictions in possibly many years to come. Just like people in the past did with other diseases until the vaccine eventually wipes it out. Vaccines work but even with them may take years to get rid of it entirely. We have the vaccines now and need to follow through.
Everyone knows there are serious disadvantages with lockdowns. Nobody is denying that. But hospitals are at breaking point NOW – even with all the restrictions. What would they have been like without social distancing, masks etc?
Or may be in order for some people to keep their jobs and / or keep their mental strength / sanity…. we should just run the severe risk (if not certainty) of millions more dying?
Value Is EverythingI rather fear this virus is now endemic
It isn’t yet endemic in an epidemiological sense (wikipedia has a decent explanation of the term). In that it hasn’t reached a steady state in the population- there are still far too many immunologically naïve hosts (everyone who hasn’t had it or been vaccinated). Once the vaccine conveyer belt is running at maximum revs the only other way to give the hurry up to achieving this steady state is to lift restrictions and let it blitz through the young and healthy population quickly- the “herd immunity” the Boris was counting on last summer.
Reasons for not doing this:
– ascertaining that an individual is definitely healthy enough to withstand infection isn’t possible; so allowing millions of apparently healthy to be exposed in a short timeframe will inevitably result in at least tens of thousands of these ending up in hospital in this short timeframe.– this “healthy” population cannot be completely isolated from the vulnerable population, so despite using PPE in their interactions, having millions of actively infected, asymptomatic or presymptomatic viral shedders having contact with the vulnerable in a short timeframe will result in probably hundreds of thousands of the vulnerable getting infected in that short time frame and ending up in hospital at the same time as the healthy-who-weren’t
– in the same short timeframe as above. millions, possibly tens of millions of the working or caring population will be out of action for a period of a couple of days to several weeks or months due to simply feeling too ill with Covid to go to work…just when we need them the most.
So basically the choice is-
1. some variation of the current restrictions and the NHS more or less hanging on, ish, till spring when the winter flu population have disappeared and freed up hospital capacity and vaccine levels are getting close(r) to herd immunity or2. Letting the virus rip, a few weeks of the army bulldozing bodies into pits or at least piling them up in aircraft hangars, shortages in the supermarkets and all fields of health and social care and everywhere else as the supply chains and service industry workers get swamped pulling double to cover for their covid afflicted colleagues, then hopefully a more rapid return to normal and a steady state, endemic, no more societal impact than the flu type situation.
Welcome to the party Green and some reassurance we might find a rabbit hole out of this Triffid nightmare.
Might I just add another reason for not letting it rip is the increased danger of a bigger breeding ground for the worryingly new variants.
Richard, do not equate people who think it is a hoax with lockdown sceptics.
I didn’t.
Maybe we are witnessing the enactment of the self regulating synergistic planet earth remodeling system – the Gaia theory, or aw shuks ‘n’ shiver me timbers – worse than that – the animal kingdom is playing one sided russian roulette payback.
PINK DOIGS
We don’t need no circus stations
We don’t need no cage control
No dark zoos or chains to hold us
HUMANS leave us beasts aloneI fear the truth may be somewhat more prosaic: it’s a virus.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Green is the new black – you heard this fashion statement here first.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.