May 19, 2005 at 19:36 #91117
the most expencive place on earth (except Paris) to live.
I can’t agree.
Rents are high but, unless they’ve shot up massively in the last 5 years, nothing compared to London.
Plus there’s no council tax and pretty much everything else (apart from drinks) is the same or cheaper than in Scotland.
When I lived there (2000), it was about a fiver to go to the cinema.
I was told by a couple of different people that, at the same time, it was Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£8 in London.
London (like Paris) is one of those love it or hate it places and, if you love it then it’s worth paying the extra if you can afford it.
However, I’ve personally never understood the big deal about it.
SteveMay 20, 2005 at 15:18 #91118wilsonlParticipant
- Total Posts 862
London’s a sh*thole,
Worked there for neary two years and hated every minute of it.
It’s every man for himself and the prices are stupid.
Having lived in Birmingham my whole life you’d think I’d be sick of the place but recent developments have made it a lot more appealing.
Edingburgh’s a great place, especially during the fringe.
LeeMay 20, 2005 at 18:59 #91120
It’s the post below. :biggrin:
(Edited by lollys mate at 8:02 pm on May 20, 2005)May 20, 2005 at 19:00 #91122
London used to be the best capital in the world, thats why we have all the "pomp and ceremony" that the Yanks and the rest of Europe and Asia want to see.
Apart from the history (Which is still the best in the world), we have now the one of the worst places to live unless your a one legged black lesbian crackhead with a criminal record. If that’s you then your the city’s main priority, but if your trying to work hard and establish your buisness for the benefit of your future family, then Kon livingstone himself will shoot you down with as many taxes as he can make up!
<br> Its got that bad recently, that I, who was once so proud of my country, might be leaving these once sacred shores.
Its bad now! And its only going to get worse!!!
Marlow’s nice though!May 20, 2005 at 19:36 #91124KotkijetMember
- Total Posts 226
Quote: from lollys mate on 8:00 pm on May 20, 2005[br]a one legged black lesbian crackhead with a criminal record.<br>
I can understand the criminal record and crackhead bits to a degree – I say a degree because you didn’t specify what crime she commited and many tories use the term ‘crackhead’ when they mean user drugs of any nature. However, what does the womans physical ability, colour and sexual orientation have to do with anything?May 21, 2005 at 10:46 #91125cormack15Keymaster
- Total Posts 8979
Agree with the negative London comments. It’s all hype and no content.
I wouldn’t want to live anywhere other than where I live now and Scotland is a Group 1 performer against handicappers in this poll I’m afraid.May 21, 2005 at 12:05 #91128
There’s only a handful of truly great world cities – for me this would boil down to 5 – Rome, Paris, New York, Hong Kong, and London.
Cities the whole world wants to visit, stuffed with history and iconic images. Places you couldn’t hope to get to know fully in a lifetime.
And London’s got even better for the casual visitor over the last 5 years or so.
Stroll down the South Bank from Westminster to Tower Bridge – 2 miles of the most amazing buildings, views, history – old standards – the view of the Houses of Parliament, Tower Bridge, strolling past the Festival Hall, the Thames running sweetly – and new treats such as the Eye, the Tate Modern the Millennium bridge and the new view of St Pauls. Half a day spent doing this refreshes the soul, makes one aware of both mankind’s brilliance and individual insignificance down the passages of time.
Climb the Monument, or the Nat West Tower and take in a view every bit as exhilerating as Hong Kong or New York.
Take a Sunday walk in the Royal Parks – you can walk for 4 miles through the centre of London, and hardly see traffic (St James’s Park, Green Park, Hyde Park, Kennsington gardens) – each park with it’s own special feel – combined they put Central Park to shame.
Do the sights – where else have you got anything like Tower Bridge, St Pauls, Westminster Abbey, Parliament, Trafalgar Sqaure, Whitehall, 10 Downing Street, Piccadilly, Oxford St, Carnaby St, The Strand, Covent Garden, Leicester Square – already places familiar to anyone who’s ever watched TV, films or played monopoly. Everywhere you look is another photo opportunity. And that’s just in the Centre.
Walk round the City (especially on a Sunday) and marvel at the strange marriage between church and money-making.
Take a boat down the Thames, and get a sore neck from trying to look both sides at once. Get on an old routemaster bus (before they’re gone forever!), catch a black cab, get the tube – something so annoying to many but was always a highlight to me when I went ‘up town’ as a kid – and that’s the thing about London, it brings you closer to that child in you – who was impressed by all this before you became cynical about life.
Go a bit further afield to Parliament Hill, Hilly Fields, Hampstead, Highgate Cemetery, Richmond Park, Wimbledon Common and the village, Barnes, Putney, Fulham, Chelsea, Mayfair – see how the other half live.
Do the markets – Camden, Greenwich, Petticoat Lane – or find a thousand other great shopping places to spend your money.
Go to some of the best museums and art galleries in the world – mainly for free. Go to the best theatres in the world.
Eat in a different restauarant every night of the year, and eat amazingly well – indeed better than in Paris, Rome and Hong Kong where the food may be brilliant but is all the same and leaves you desparate for a curry after a fortnight.
Get a guide book to the hidden gems of London – hardly known places – some of my favourites – Postman Park, St Stephen Wallbrook, the meadow at Richmond, John Soames’ House, The Horniman’s Museum in Forest Hill, Dulwich gallery and park, the view from Ally Pally and Crystal Palace, the underground rivers, the squares around Kennington, the Canadian War Memorial in Green Park, the Japanese garden at the Imperial War Museum, and the 2nd World War statue in Hyde Park Corner; the Price Waterhouse building at London Bridge, Smithfields market in the morning and Borough Market on a Friday lunchtime; St Saviours Dock, and the Hays Galleria, St Katherine’s Dock, Canizaro Park.
<br>The Anchor Bankside, The Angel, The Dickens, The Market Porter, The George pubs as old as the city itself.
I could go on and on and on and on and on.
For sure, living here has its frustrations, traffic in particular. Plus we have our share of idiots and racists as you’ve already read.
But Manchester? Don’t make me laugh.May 21, 2005 at 12:38 #91130
Excellent post, Tooting.
A very eloquent defence of your town.
While I’ve never enjoyed London myself, I know where your coming from as I’ve said similar things about Paris.
I’m curious, did you grow up in London or move there later?
SteveMay 21, 2005 at 13:20 #91131
Thanks Steve, felt someone had to stick up for it!
I was born in Clapham, (my Dad grew up about 2 streets away from where I live now) – but moved to near Gatwick Airport when I was 7. Came back after university for a few years (Brockley/Nunhead), then lived in Bristol for 7 years (also a lovely city) and moved back to Tooting 12 years ago.
Away from London one area I’m surprised hasn’t been mentioned yet is Northumberland.May 21, 2005 at 15:35 #91132
Your story back up a generalisation I tend to believe.
That is, it’s the people who move to (or move back to) a place that tend to appreciate it the most.
Those who have lived there all their lives tend to take it for granted.
The last time I was in London, the only happy people I saw were either tourists or the Chinese in Chinatown who had some sort of celebration going on.
The rest of the people looked feckin miserable and too busy going from train station to work to the shops to buy a sandwich to work again to the train station….
However, this may simply be a reflection of what I saw and experienced for myself, rather than "the way things are".
I’d be interested to know what London’s meant to have that, say, Edinburgh doesn’t.
I’ll start off with: a decent live music scene.
SteveMay 22, 2005 at 08:11 #91133
Nice post Tooting.
By the way, where did you buy those rose tinted glasses?
London as I said before does have the best history in the world, and with that comes some of the greatest sights in the world. But when its on your doorstep, how often do you go and visit them.
Very rarely, due to the fact that the transport system doesn’t work as I explained in a previous post and also your a a greater risk of being mugged in London than in central park.
Off to Marlow today for lunch and a family walk along the river where the strangers will talk to you.May 22, 2005 at 10:48 #91134
despite the apparent lack of transport I have left the confines of South London!
Much as I like, even love, Venice and Sydney they just aren’t on the same scale as my big 5. I’ve also lived briefly in Chicago and Seattle, the latter one of the most beautiful places on earth, but still not a qualifier on scale.
Rio would be a possible, but I’ve never been there. Shanghai – maybe, Beijing more likely? And Mexico City maybe.
stevedvg – yes totally agree with you about taking places for granted. Most Bristolians moan about their city Lolly-style – I remember winning a quiz one night when the beer-break round was questions on Bristol (history, sights etc) and our table of outsiders swept majestically through the field bast Answerless of Ashton, Befuddled of Bedminster, and Clueless of Clifton.May 23, 2005 at 01:14 #91135SkyMember
- Total Posts 44
Stevedvg and Grasshopper , <br>Well travelled —Tooting , stop it im p**s<br>ing myself , he mentions Rome, Paris,New York,Hong Kong, and London <br>Sounds like a womens make up company<br> Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â <br> Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â <br>Have you either actually been to Tooting or indeed Clapham or Gatwick .Brokley ..Nunhead …. complete crapholes the lot . You have to agree with that Tooting.<br> Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â They are all part of Greater London<br> Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â At least the man Razeen actually lived in Bromley<br>You talk of strolling down the South bank to Westminster, dirty, lined with begger stalls , dirty polluted river, transportation that unable to move of the weight of traffic … the Thames running sweetly …thats a laugh..the old English definition of the word Thames means Muddy Waters due to the fact of the silt it collects as it flows in , running sweetly…it is a polluted dirty river that collected every piece of Victorian feaces it could handel..do not make it out to be a sweet stream.<br>Lets move on to the cartwheel that tooting loves so .. the Eye , bet hes never been on it .. so what big ugly thing that goes against the whole feel of the area , ugly , should be torn down.<br>London refreshes the soul .. no it makes you glad you do not live in that dirty city<br>Climb the momument , its no great shakes , just a lot of steps , believe me the veiw is nothing more than any high point in any place , when was the last time you were allowed to go in the Natwest tower *i dont even think its called that anymore<br>The Royal Parks , they are parks surrounded by hazes of pollution from the cars around , no pleasure about your picnic tasting of gasoline<br>Picadilly , Tralfalgar Square , Covent garden and such , places where the visitors flock to and get ripped off left right and centre for food drink parking everything , to leave without been offered drugs or mugged or ion the minumum felling intimidated ….youve had a good night<br>The boat ride down the filty Thames is a tenner <br>Walk around the city ..as tooting says ..especially on a Sunday …there is nobody there , every is closed, marvel at what tooting …the empty streets<br>Good idea grab a routemaster bus , and old desial pumping tank , oh ok thats fun lets jump of and get into a London Taxi , it will only cost us 30 pounds to go 3 miles and have to listen to messiahs for the hour journey –what joy<br>Richmond park is nice but why on earth would you want to walk around Putney, Barnes , Wimbledon common , cmon tooting that is just stupid –do you do that on your day off<br>The markets are directed towards visitors who no no better , if you choose to pay over the odds for crap,its your choice , ask any londerner if they shop there –dont think so<br>The restaurants are over priced and apart from a few poor service is the norm and the quality of food is worse<br>But tooting has googleed all this, he clearly dosnt visit his city….you know the saying , you can take the boy out of tooting , but you cant take tooting out of the boy.<br>Manchester you say tooting —dont make you laugh…<br>youve never even been there, the train fare is too expensive
(Edited by Sky at 2:22 am on May 23, 2005)May 23, 2005 at 10:25 #91136cormack15Keymaster
- Total Posts 8979
Edinburgh crumpet can be very good Grass – you need to stay away from the Cavendish!May 23, 2005 at 13:23 #91137
Nice one Sky.
A true South Londoner speaks – rather proving Steve’s notion in the process.
You sound just like my grandad (RIP), who moaned about London all his life and ended up retiring to Benidorm.
The only difference is that he went so he could sit around and moan about London whilst waiting to die, as opposed to you sitting around moaning about London whilst selling time-share.
Each to their own.<br>May 23, 2005 at 14:34 #91138
Earlier in the thread I said
"London (like Paris) is one of those love it or hate it places and, if you love it then it’s worth paying the extra if you can afford it."
Having read the various things the Londoners have said, I think that there’s a flipside to this.
That is, "if you don’t like London, unless you have a very good reason (like a huge paying job), why would you live there?"
I know a lot of French people (usually from the south) who complain that Paris is noisy, crowded, expensive, congested and polluted.
And, compared to where they’re from, it’s all these things.
And, if that’s what you focused on, then you’d hate the place.
But for people, these things are a small price to pay for all the great things the city has to offer.
For some of us, there’s a buzz on the street, that sense of being in the best place in the world (entirely subjective, of course), a sense of adventure, a sense that, any time you step outside, anything can happen.
And, most of all, a sense of appreciation for the fact that you get to be a part of the whole show.
So, while I don’t share Tooting’s feelings about London, I can understand where he’s coming from when he talks about his city.
I can understand how, despite all its drawbacks (similar to Paris’), he loves living there.
What I can’t understand is why some of the others that live there – the ones that are moaning about it – don’t move to somewhere they’d enjoy better.
SteveMay 23, 2005 at 19:47 #91139dave jayMember
- Total Posts 3386
I met a bloke recently from Hackney who moved out of London because he said his girl was the only white kid in her class and more than half of the class couldn’t speak English. Wether this is true or a problem I wouldn’t know because I’ve haven’t been there for years and don’t feel that I’m missing anything.
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