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The Rip Van Winkle 134….. Conduit 130 tells me RVW’s rating should be nearer 130
That horse in RVW’s rear view mirror at Sandown, it was Conduit y’know.
Again, for the third time on this forum. And this isn’t opinion this is the form:
Let’s look at the Eclipse and the King George. In the latter Conduit beats Alwaary (rpr 113) by four and a quarter lengths. In the former he beats Cima De Triomphe (rpr 116) by 5L. If anything it could be argued that the Eclipse was the better run by Conduit.
Zenyatta for me.
I really don’t know much about her, but her record and the fact she has won on pro-ride is good enough for me.
I would consider backing her E/W at 3/1 as it is a 1/4 the odds.
I think Rip will get stuffed, just not convinced this will be his bag…and we are starting to hear the dreaded "it’s been a long, hard season.." from his trainer.
The 6/1 offered earlier in the week by Brit bookies was surely way off the mark?
Zip
Im not even sure what the horse is doing here given how strongly they believe he doesnt stay 10furlongs anyway.
Ding Dong!
That’s as bullish as they’ve been since….well…since STS retired.
And when he dots up, it will be how great is STS?
The more cognisant might just ask where?
Where?
Ahh listen, he’s ‘where’ AOB would love RVW to be, given the choice, and not sluggimg it out in the last chance saloon over an inadequate trip….allegedly.
And when he dots up, it will be how great is STS?
The more cognisant might just ask where?Reet, he wins, its how good was Sea the Stars to STS fans and its so what to those who were thinking after the Guineas that he was nothing special. He loses and how not great was Sea the Stars, how terrible a long season has been, his bad feet, the bad journey, the hot weather, the surface the local food, swine flu or take your peak of how many other things do tend to go wrong. W
Another thing, Ive noticed that with your use of the rolling of the eyes avatar and your use of the word cognisant that you are clearly a highly cerebral chap who sits with some frustration having to read this ridiculous notions that other people here have. Sorry, I genuine believe I make the odd reasonably intelligent comment and that fact that I dont is really a matter of genetics. Im sure you have encounterd more like me on this board. Go easy on us, people might take it personally, its better for the forum all round
SHL
I’m picking Richard’s Kid to win at a price. BUUUUT I think he may not be of the top caliber of Zenyatta, Summer Bird or Rip Van Winkle. Still, I had to keep him in my prices. I just can’t bring myself to toss Zenyatta simply because she runs very well over this track and I think that gives her a huge advantage. It would be foolish for me to toss the Europeans and I’m having to choose RVW over the other entry. There are a bunch of horses that could win this race. Gio Ponti and Summer Bird come to mind. I would not be surprised if any of the top 6 choices on the board won. I think it may boil down to a rider’s race. Certainly there is talent in all of them.
- Total Posts 17716
Quote re RVW from AO’B in this morning’s Post:
"I have no doubt that we have never come here before with a horse of this calibre".
Fist – You have been warned!
Will have to be won’t he?
Anyway the man’s full of crap.. High Chaparral won 6 Group 1’s including 2 Breeders’Cups, The Racing Post Trophy, The Champion Stakes,The Irish Derby,The Epsom Derby and was placed in 2 Arcs.
Rip Van Winkle has won 2 major Group 1’s beating 7 furlong specialist Paco Boy and listed winner Zacinto.
His claim to fame is he finished 2nd in the Eclipse to Sea the Stars. A race in which he clearly showed he’s better at a mile than he is at 10f.
Propaganda at it’s best!
Right back at you mate………..and don’t say I never warned you
- Total Posts 17716
Another thing, Ive noticed that with your use of the rolling of the eyes avatar and your use of the word cognisant that you are clearly a highly cerebral chap who sits with some frustration having to read this ridiculous notions that other people here have. Sorry, I genuine believe I make the odd reasonably intelligent comment and that fact that I dont is really a matter of genetics. Im sure you have encounterd more like me on this board. Go easy on us, people might take it personally, its better for the forum all round
You’re right, of course.
There’s litle future in trying to discuss the finer points of form with those who can’t see the difference between Sandown and Santa Anita.
Perhaps I’d be better off on Betfair? Another thing, Ive noticed that with your use of the rolling of the eyes avatar and your use of the word cognisant that you are clearly a highly cerebral chap who sits with some frustration having to read this ridiculous notions that other people here have. Sorry, I genuine believe I make the odd reasonably intelligent comment and that fact that I dont is really a matter of genetics. Im sure you have encounterd more like me on this board. Go easy on us, people might take it personally, its better for the forum all round
You’re right, of course.
There’s litle future in trying to discuss the finer points of form with those who can’t see the difference between Sandown and Santa Anita.
Perhaps I’d be better off on Betfair? Perhaps indeed. But wear your learning lightly or youll just scare them.
SHL
What a race!!
Quality. Quantity. An unbeaten American mare. The most natural athlete Ballydoyle has ever had. Belmont winners. Man O’War winners. Arlington Million winners. Santa Anita Handicap winners. Top quality dirt and turf horses unknown on the surface and, to top it all off, a race that could make history.
The Breeders’ Cup Classic 2009 has it all.
Rip Van Winkle is the best horse in the race on paper. No doubt about it. Pure speed, but enough stamina to finish runner-up in an Eclipse and fourth in an Epsom Derby. No shame in defeat behind the greatest horse many of us have seen.
Not the easiest to train and seemingly fragile. Beleaguered by a foot problem since his arrival. The fast pace and fast surface will not help his cause and he will need to be at his best here.
What can you say about Zenyatta? Equalled Personal Ensign’s record of thirteen unbeaten starts last time out. Will tackle the colts for the first time in her illustrious career after beating up on her own sex. She will also face her biggest field since her maiden win (12) after scaring away the competition most of her career. Is she good enough to overcome these problems against such talented oppostion?
Belmont Stakes winner Summer Bird is a dirt specialist and will be encountering this surface for the first time against a top class field. Reportedly worked well on it, but you can not be sure until he competes.
Mine That Bird has disappointed twice on this surface. Last in the Breeders’ Cup Juvenile last year and behind Colonel John (2nd) Richard’s Kid (3rd) when sixth in the Goodwood Stakes.
Richard’s Kid beat Santa Anita Handicap winner Einstein (2nd) and Colonel John (5th) in the Pacific Classic at Del Mar before his Goodwood effort.
Gio Ponti is an incredibly talented turf horse and claimed two of America’s most established prizes this year – the Man O’War Stakes and Arlington Million (Einstein 5th).
Failed to see out twelve furlongs on his latest start and a big player if taking to the synthetic surface.
The Godolphin pair, Girolamo and Regal Ransom, will need to improve and the same can be said of Awesome Gem, but Twice Over is an interesting candidate and his mile speed, coupled with his ability to see out this trip very well, could translate well to an American run race.
This is a fascinating race and, perhaps, heart over head, I’m sticking with Zenyatta.
In a race where just about every leading player has something to prove, she has the least to answer and is the most reliable option. Her questions aren’t ‘physical’. It just depends on your individual opinion if she can make the step up to this elite company and I think she can.
Rip Van Winkle has many more questions to answer…
Will he go on the synthetic surface?
Is he as effective over ten furlongs?
Can he win a race without dominating?
Can he win a race passing other horses at the business end?
Is he 100%?If the answer to ALL of these is ‘Yes’, he wins. No doubt about it. He’s the best horse in the race on paper. I’m just not convinced he will be suited to the conditions of the race (as I’ve explained before). I got it wrong with Henrythenavigator, but I got it right about the late George Washington, who simply wasn’t robust enough.
The Goodwood Stakes form which ties in Richard’s Kid, Colonel John (6th last year) and Einstein leaves them with a bit to find on a line through Gitano Hernando. The former is still open to improvement and I take him to come out best of this trio.
Mine That Bird can’t win based on his previous two efforts on the surface, but Summer Bird could be a huge danger if converting his dirt form to the Pro-Ride. The problem is he stays almost too well and his best efforts over the distance have come on sloppy conditions. This track rides very fast and he could be found wanting for speed. Holds Quality Road on their previous two encounters.
Gio Ponti is the potential fly in the ointment. A real talent on turf, he won the Man O’War under fast conditions and looking at how well our horses have adapted to the surface, you would think he has a better chance than the dirt challengers.
Stays this trip very well, he also holds a victory over the talented Ventura over eight furlongs.
If Gio Ponti tranfers his turf form to the Pro-Ride, he’s in with a massive chance.
Like Fleeting Spirit, Twice Over’s best form has come on a straight course and he has questions to answer about the track and surface. His tactical speed will be a big asset and he carries a fair bit of confidence.
Zenyatta adores this track and surface. The race should be run to suit and it’s just a question of Mike Smith finding a smooth passage through because this is the biggest field she would have encountered since her debut.
A few horses, including Richard’s Kid, like to sling-shot round the final bend and she could find herself going wider than ever before. She can’t afford to give up too much ground against this level of competition and much will left in the lap of the Gods.
She has worked harder than ever at home and connections are adamant they are yet to get to the bottom of her. Her mannerisms give this statement much credence and if she has made the necessary improvement, then we could see something very special tonight.
Rip Van Winkle will either win or bomb, but Gio Ponti is massive value, in my opinion.
I like MTB aswell. I wonder, just wonder, if he can close more ground than Zenyatta. The duel of the closers is a nice one to watch out for. I feel sorry for any horse racing fan who dosen’t like the Breeders Cup as a whole. It’s bloody brilliant !
Really looking forward to this.
Can’t wait to see Zenyatta in the paddock, doing her little dance. Watch her strut in the parade, too. Just beautiful – like a dressage horse.
Such a close race to call. So many ‘ifs’ and ‘buts’. Anything can happen!
I see I’ve got a small ew on Colonel John. Can’t remember why I’ve backed him, but there must have been a good reason at the time.
Really looking forward to this.
Can’t wait to see Zenyatta in the paddock, doing her little dance. Watch her strut in the parade, too. Just beautiful – like a dressage horse.
Such a close race to call. So many ‘ifs’ and ‘buts’. Anything can happen!
Firs time Ive seen her. She looks big!
Because I love racing, I hope she wins.
SHL
WOW WOW WOW
A million times WOW!!!!!!!!
I had absolutely no idea she was that good
Buzzing
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