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Black Caviar 18 from 18

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  • #20961
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    The wonder mare strolled into today in what was probably her easiest win of her career.She showed that she is probably better at a longer trip with todays race being 1400m and she won that easily that 9f looks well within her scope.Whilst as usual she frightened off a lot of horses, the ease of the win and showing she will run a mile on her ear and a very fast mile at that opens up the possibilities albeit a slim one of meeting Frankel. Though by that stage Frankel will most likely be at 10f.

    #390723
    AIC
    Member
    • Total Posts 116

    400-200 in 10.64 secs

    And had something up the sleeve…

    What a magnificent sprinter. Clearly Australia’s best racehorse and in my opinion she’s equal to any sprinter the world has ever seen. Not saying the best ever as there has been some damn good sprinters in their day but I’d not rate anything from any generation better than her.

    It’s a difficult ask to travel to the other side of the world and expect a career best performance but if she goes to ascot and is even 90% right she just wins. If she’s at her best you’ll see a 5-6 length demolition in a coast.

    #390724
    Presto
    Member
    • Total Posts 315

    Awesome win, albeit not against any stars (but much stronger than her other races this year)

    I wouldn’t want to see her run more than a mile and trainer would probably be hesitant re: a mile on a stiffer European track but a mile race against Frankel would be incredible. I couldn’t pick one.

    #390725
    AIC
    Member
    • Total Posts 116

    Awesome win, albeit not against any stars (but much stronger than her other races this year)

    I wouldn’t want to see her run more than a mile and trainer would probably be hesitant re: a mile on a stiffer European track but a mile race against Frankel would be incredible. I couldn’t pick one.

    A mile uphill is not really a mile. It’s more like a mile and a qtr. They don’t run Olympic events up hills do they? Black Caviar would give Frankel a touch up over 1000m at Flemington and I’m sure the opposite could be true over the Ascot mile. The middle ground would be 1400m on a flat track it’s a distance both horses can include in their peak range and it’ll never happen because they’ve got too much to lose by taking Frankel on foreign jaunts whereas Black Caviar being a mare doesn’t have anywhere near as much to lose. Two fantastic gallopers who are the best at their craft.

    #390726
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    I dont think she would have the least problem in getting the mile at Ascot. I think she is bomb proof,that good that she would handle any sort of course.Probably the only horse in the world who could settle first or last in the run in a Group 1 race in anywhere in the world and win.Also she is one of a select few who could race 6 lengths off her best yet still be able to win a very good quality Group 1 race.

    #390795
    Himself
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    • Total Posts 3777

    Incredible sprinter who beat a poor bunch over a longer trip. Taking Frankel on at a mile would stretch her stamina reserves to the limit. Frankel for me, everyday of the week.

    Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning

    #390803
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    Incredible sprinter who beat a poor bunch over a longer trip. Taking Frankel on at a mile would stretch her stamina reserves to the limit. Frankel for me, everyday of the week.

    You class Southern Speed as poor? Has won from 1050m to 2400m group 2 winner over 1400m,won brilliantly first up over 1400m,so she can sprint,also a Caulfield Cup winner,may have been short of her best,but i would like a ‘poor’ horse who has won about $2.2 million from 15 starts:) I think Black Caviar would handle the challenge pretty well, 9 out of 9 is very hard to do but 18 out of 18 is in another sphere. All the talk about poor fields,selective memory! You rarely here that Black Caviar beat 8 Group 1 winners against 10 opponents in the T J Smith stks, and destroyed them and they were class horses.

    #390815
    CarryOnKatie
    Participant
    • Total Posts 569

    Rivals this morning served it on a plate to Black Caviar. Crawled early (even though most of the field had better form over 1mile plus) and turned it into a sprint, so to my mind stamina over 7f plus still unproven.

    Why those rivals didn’t turn it into a true run race and try to stretch the mare I do not know.

    Hey ho, she’s still blummin’ good tho.

    #390826
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    Rivals this morning served it on a plate to Black Caviar. Crawled early (even though most of the field had better form over 1mile plus) and turned it into a sprint, so to my mind stamina over 7f plus still unproven.

    Why those rivals didn’t turn it into a true run race and try to stretch the mare I do not know.

    Hey ho, she’s still blummin’ good tho.

    Well i would say she probably could have won by 8 lengths or more,so i think that is as good as you will get for proving she has the stamina for 7f+. I think more the problem is finding one to get her out of first gear and see just how good she is,i doubt though that will ever happen.

    #390871
    AIC
    Member
    • Total Posts 116

    Incredible sprinter who beat a poor bunch over a longer trip. Taking Frankel on at a mile would stretch her stamina reserves to the limit. Frankel for me, everyday of the week.

    Bel Esprit’s limit was about 1400-1600 at a stretch so I’m not as bullish about her stamina as jolly is. But I’ll agree with him that Southern Speed is no slouch, and on his day over 1400 Playing God is a pretty decent galloper too. The others are more like listed level horses.

    No it was not a supreme test of stamina, but who gives a stuff? Why does everything need to be run uphill at a clip in order for it to be a valid test? That is such a eurotoss thing to say. I could just as easily say the best English stayers have been proven just as often as they have not to be slow plodders at flemington compared to their Aussie staying counterparts. It does not make it a more valid test to run a race uphill, it just makes it a different type of test. Septimus and Yeats may have had far bigger reserves of stamina but they didn’t have the acceleration or speed to cope with Aussie distance racing, no harm done they were great at what they were great at, right?

    My personal opinion is she’d win over 1600 here which means she’d get up the hill at newmarket. So if she’s near her best she’ll win the GJ and JC.

    Rain Alert is a pretty decent horse over here too you know. If she didn’t come he’d be a good chance to smash ascot to bits too!

    #390873
    marbine
    Participant
    • Total Posts 77

    Good ol’ jollyp, you wear your heart on your sleeve. There will always be those that get their back up mate, especially when you mention a horse beating "the F word" on this forum. My advise, just enjoy her mate. She will win no matter what the race, where the race or how long the race. It’s a pity the experts at many rating providers can’t see it yet, but, when it’s all said & done the story will be different. 2012 will be a year to remember.

    #390899
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    Marbine,no its not a case of wearing my heart on my sleeve 18/18 speaks for itself,this mare settles so well you can put her anywhere and she is a freak of nature.She has beaten world class horses in her career in a canter with lengths up her sleeve.First run at 7f and for mine the easiest win of her career.I think anyone that saw the the race would agree she had lengths up her sleeve,from what i saw she would be just as dominant over a mile.People who get their backs up regarding Frankel is natural,as the same applies to Black Caviar,after all at this stage 18/18 is a big step up compared with 9/9. As for me saying she probably wont be tested,i think that is true.She could lead or settle last in a Group 1 from 5f to a mile and win,and as she has shown in her dominance,she could be probably 6 lengths off her best and still win a good Group 1.

    #390900
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    It looks like BC will go around next Saturday in the 1000m lightning,then the following week in the 1400m Futurity.As she did it so easily yesterday and her next gallop scheduled for the next Saturday,they think they may as well go around for the big prizemoney.I would rather see her stick to the 1400m + but i can see their point.Watch the knockers come out if she does even if she is 20/20 after that.Hay Lists owners must be thinking sh*t not her again,and how much for 2nd!

    #390916
    marbine
    Participant
    • Total Posts 77

    Hope they don’t go too crazy with over racing. She has a big year ahead… Dubai, UK & Japan & HK hopefully..

    Yes, jollyp, it was her easiest win but the only race that she didn’t run time in. It was a trial, nothing more. The best horse I’ve seen.

    #390925
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    Yes,with the slow pace and sting out of the ground they didnt run any time,though mind you she came home the last 400m in a blistering 21.7 seconds. I think if she did go around the next 2 Saturdays they would freshen her up,i think Dubai is near the end of March,with 2 wins not out of first gear i think she still goes into next week in pretty good order but they would be giving Hay List his best chance,backing up in 7 days and coming back 2f in distance. I would rather see her start in 7f+ at this stage,but when you consider the race is worth $750 000, she is a mare who you would think maximum 12 months racing left after Royal Ascot,most would do the same as she looks to have the race at her mercy.It is hard to knock back an almost certain $450-500k first prize! Maybe if she does back up they may shelve the Dubai plans which gives her plenty more time for Ascot.

    #390967
    CarryOnKatie
    Participant
    • Total Posts 569

    My comments yesterday re lack of pace in the early furlongs (hundreds of metres) was not meant to detract from BC, more just an observation of how the rival jocks admitted defeat before the stalls opened and while she won easily I’d want more evidence she would stay a stronger run 7f/1400m.

    As others have said, even if they had blasted from flagfall she probably would still have won by many lengths.

    While I admit it a match with Frankel would never happen, while everyone is talking about Royal Ascot (because both would go there), I would prefer this to be at somewhere less demanding like Goodwood (I’m thinking Sussex stakes as it’s a much easier mile). We can dream…

    #390971
    Jollyp
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 540

    I think the reason for the lack of pace was the fact that the connections of the other horses were doing their best to pick up 2nd prizemoney,thinking it was an impossible task to beat her. Though Black Caviar did it so easily up the straight she ran her last 2f in 21.7 seconds,that is staggering when she was just cruising.Yes the 2 horses will never meet, Atlantic Jewel would be the one to take Frankel on at 10f,though he will be retired before she heads over there as she is only a 3yo here. She has been every bit as dominant and won as easily as Black Caviar in all of her runs.

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