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The reason I started this topic is because I just read that Michael Bell is planning to bring Wigmore Hall over to the Secretariat following tonights win – brilliant to see ambitious English trainers and best of luck to them.
He is not alone in this ambition, we often see UK/Irish trainers go over the pond and not just for the Breeders Cup. We often see us over for The Secretariat, The Arlington Million,The Shawell Turf Mile, The Canadian International, The American Oaks, look the list goes on.
But my question is why can we not attract the Americans over here for our big races, we have enough of them and the prize money is fantastic over here!!!!
In fairness to Ascot they seem to do fantastic work in attracting some runners over but thats where it ends.
Is there any real effort to attract American runners for our big races??
Do we want to??
Obviously cost is an issue for owners and season schedule but we go over so why do they not do the same here??
Is our racing so uninteresting to them?
The main problem is most of their superstars are dirt specialists, you can’t imagine the likes of Cigar at Southwell
What was the name of their wonderhorse that won
the final race at The Breeders Cup meeting last year
That performance was breathtaking, last to firstI’m going to go flat out here – I don’t want them here. We had Starfish Bay come and race poorly at Goodwood. The drug issues don’t go away (bute in California, lasix everywhere on race-day) and all horses in Britain should compete on a completely level playing field.
In times where this industry is struggling to fund itself in Britain, at least, why do we want to throw money at attracting those who can race and own horses here anyway? Nothing’s stopping them coming if THEY WANT to pay to come and race here. Noseda was right on travel expenses.
That ignores the fact hardly any of their Turf horses would ever be capable of winning a Group 1 race over 1m+ here. Proviso has won 3 Grade 1’s in America, plus she rightly lost the Spinster on a DQ, for example. The undulations, right handed tracks, the prize money not really being worth the risk – apart from the Arc in France – must all be factors.
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Well I think the main reason I would like them here is the excitement it brings to racing.
During Royal Ascot I find the addition of horses from all over the world really adds to the event and spectacle.
I must say I always think horses meeting from different parts of the world is good for racing.
American racing although largely dominated by DIRT performers still has its fair share of turf runners.
Even Richard Hannon who seemingly was 100% against going to the Breeders Cup with Paco Boy seems to be converting to the idea, he now says if the owners wants to go that its fine with him. The Breeders Cup Turf Mile could be one hell of a race this year with Paco Boy, Goldicova and I also think there is a chance Canford Cliffs might go over since the QEII gives him automatic entry/qualification should he win it.
I just think American horses coming over here as reguarly as we go over there would add to the spectacle of racing over here.
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I’m going to go flat out here – I don’t want them here. We had Starfish Bay come and race poorly at Goodwood. The drug issues don’t go away (bute in California, lasix everywhere on race-day) and all horses in Britain should compete on a completely level playing field.
In times where this industry is struggling to fund itself in Britain, at least, why do we want to throw money at attracting those who can race and own horses here anyway? Nothing’s stopping them coming if THEY WANT to pay to come and race here. Noseda was right on travel expenses.
That ignores the fact hardly any of their Turf horses would ever be capable of winning a Group 1 race over 1m+ here. Proviso has won 3 Grade 1’s in America, plus she rightly lost the Spinster on a DQ, for example. The undulations, right handed tracks, the prize money not really being worth the risk – apart from the Arc in France – must all be factors.
I would agreee with you regarding your comment on the quality of their turf runners to some extent but there are some turf performers over there who are good enough.
Take Kip Deville – He was a great horse, he 2nd to Goldikova in the BC mile in 2008 and prior to that had beaten Excellent Art (Royal Ascot winner) when they met at Monmouth. Now he travelledto Sha Tin and Dubai to race at the end of his career (when he was as good as he used to be). Its just a shame they Hong Kong and Dubai were able to attract him whilst we couldnt attract him over…
Once again I do generally agree with your comments on standard of turf performers but they do have several good performers all the same..
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The Irish Champion Stakes is left handed and has a first prize purse of £552,427 / $881,024
Gio Ponti (2nd to the brilliant Zenyatta in the classic last year) ran Belmont last month in a race worth £185,185.
Perhaps it is an issue of easier turf racing over there but I personally would love Gio Ponti coming over for the Juddmonte, left handed and flat track. He went to Meydan so dont think York track would be an issue.
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Surely the addition of American horses running over here would be of commercial appeal to the American networks such as ESPN and ABC in the States, and therefore may justify the spend in attracting their superstars over here???
If we can generate interest in our sport over there surely it opens up doors to sell our sport over there too???
Premiership games are shown in the States all the time, is their a market to sell media rights to our horse racing over there???
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Surely the addition of American horses running over here would be of commercial appeal to the American networks such as ESPN and ABC in the States, and therefore may justify the spend in attracting their superstars over here???
Interest in American Horse Racing over there from the major TV companies is negligible, apart from the Triple Crown. And the European horses cleaning up in the Breeders Cups over the last couple of years on "synthetic" has further diminished public interest in the Sport.
Unfortunately, horse racing in the States is at a low ebb, and a few of their Turf Rags coming over here would merely be seen as an aberration. USA folk are notoriously uninterested in sporting events beyond their own borders (except for Olympic Games) and the idea that they’d be switching on in droves to see Gio Ponti get whacked in the York International or Irish Champion is no more than a pious hope.
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Maybe so but the official figures show that the Breeders Cup is shown in over 123 countries.
How many countries is Royal Ascot shown in or the Epsom Derby?
If we could create a big mid summer race of appeal to American runners we could perhaps also show the race in these 123 countries and help sell our sport abroad..
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Maybe so but the official figures show that the Breeders Cup is shown in over 123 countries.
How many countries is Royal Ascot shown in or the Epsom Derby?
Which "official figures" are those? I expect similar stats could certainly be cooked up to prove that The Derby
[sic.!]
and Royal Ascot have similar global exposure. The Grand National too, of course.
None of which alters the fact that American turf horses appearing in England would not remotely interest the Americans.
Isn’t it also that a lot of American horses take drugs, there’s bute (?) which helps horses not to bleed which is banned everywhere outside of the states, so I doubt trainers will let their horses run elsewhere.
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Isn’t it also that a lot of American horses take drugs, there’s bute (?) which helps horses not to bleed which is banned everywhere outside of the states, so I doubt trainers will let their horses run elsewhere.
That’s Lasix. Bute masks pain and reduces inflammation of joints, amongst other things. But your point is absolutely sound. The East Coast trainers wouldn’t run them without the stuff, and the American Horse Racing public (such as it is) would not be interested.
There’s a quick summary here:
http://www.thinkythings.org/horseracing/lasixinfo.htmlWhoa, whoa, whoa.
The biggest reason why most American horses stay at home is the purse money. How many $1 million (or the equivalent in pounds) races do you have? Also, remember that the USA is HUGE with many tracks and many races to aim for. Several of your major races happen to conflict with our major races, and for most trainers a race like the Santa Anita Handicap or Arlington Million or any race at Saratoga, with their own history and prestige, are much more attractive than whatever is going on the UK.
I don’t deny that our turf horses are lacking compared to European horses, but remember that turf racing in the United States didn’t become popular until the 1960s, and it’s still uncommon to find breeders who breed specifically for the turf. However, there’s a reason we’re unstoppable in the Golden Shaheen and other big sprints. Many major American trainers come from the Quarter Horse racing world, so they tend to train their stock to excell at shorter distances.
One thing I do want to see is more American steeplechasers going abroad. As a general rule, the average British hurdler is much better than the average American hurdler (who is typically a flat-racing reject), but the best of the best American hurdlers are competitive with their British counterparts. And of course the mighty American timber horse has done very well overseas. I’d love to see Bubble Economy at Cheltenham next year.
So how to attract our (flat) horses? Short of towing the British Isles several thousand miles west, just increasing purse money goes a long way. The Japan Cup and Japan Cup Dirt tends to attract a few Americans each year, even though we don’t win them often and they’re even farther away than the UK.
Isn’t it also that a lot of American horses take drugs, there’s bute (?) which helps horses not to bleed which is banned everywhere outside of the states, so I doubt trainers will let their horses run elsewhere.
That’s Lasix. Bute masks pain and reduces inflammation of joints, amongst other things. But your point is absolutely sound. The East Coast trainers wouldn’t run them without the stuff, and the American Horse Racing public (such as it is) would not be interested.
There’s a quick summary here:
http://www.thinkythings.org/horseracing/lasixinfo.htmlMost horse racing fans I know often complain about raceday medications such as Lasix. However, the horses aren’t "drugged" and there are strict rules about the amount of bute and other medications allowed, along with steroid bans in most jurisdictions. Still, there are some trainers (Jonathan Sheppard is an example) who often run horses sans Lasix, and in fact the 2009 Eclipse Champion Steeplechaser Mixed Up ran without it. Don’t forget that American horses must run without Lasix in Dubai, and there seem to be no complaints about that policy.
Maybe so but the official figures show that the Breeders Cup is shown in over 123 countries.
How many countries is Royal Ascot shown in or the Epsom Derby?
Which "official figures" are those? I expect similar stats could certainly be cooked up to prove that The Derby
[sic.!]
and Royal Ascot have similar global exposure. The Grand National too, of course.
None of which alters the fact that American turf horses appearing in England would not remotely interest the Americans.
First of all, neither the Epsom Derby nor the Grand National are shown on American broadcast television. Only on the horse-racing digital cable channels TVG and HRTV, which few people receive.
Second, there was enormous interest in Kinsale King and Noble’s Promise at Ascot, at least on the US horseracing forums.
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First of all, neither the Epsom Derby nor the Grand National are shown on American broadcast television. Only on the horse-racing digital cable channels TVG and HRTV, which few people receive
You’ve said it. There’s very little interest in world-class sporting events taking place outside their own backyard. This is the reverse of the case in Europe, Asia and Australia.
The Derby
[sic.] [=no "Epsom" please!!]
and Grand National are of at least as much interest to non-Americans as the Breeders Cups, and I’m quite sure that stats could be produced for them to match this out-of-hat figure of 123 countries for the latter.
Second, there was enormous interest in Kinsale King and Noble’s Promise at Ascot, at least on the US horseracing forums.
I’m pleased to hear it: but as you’ve implied yourself, a specialist horseracing forum is hardly a fair barometer of the attraction to major broadcasting channels, which is zilch. After all, the interest in American horse racing on TRF is not a litmus test for the entire British population, or even the Racing population!
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