The home of intelligent horse racing discussion
The home of intelligent horse racing discussion

A Great Derby NOW!!!

Home Forums Horse Racing A Great Derby NOW!!!

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 27 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #4907
    MikkyMo73
    Member
    • Total Posts 1789

    After today’s racing, it’s hard not to say that at last it appears we have had a great Derby with a great winner.

    So far, from The Derby, we have had the runner up (Eagle Mountain) finish 2nd in a Grp 1, before easily winning a Grp 2. The 3rd horse (Aqaleem) has only had 1 outing since, that was at Goodwood in the Gordon Stakes where he finished a highly creditable 2nd to Yellowstone, who incidentally finished 8th in The Derby. Yelowstone has not only won that Gordon Stakes, but today he finished a decent 2nd in a Grp 2 race (Great Voltigeur) behind Lucarno – who finished 4th in The Derby. Lucarno finished 1 place ahead of Soldier Of Fortune in The Derby, and as we know, Soldier Of Fortune has since won The Irish Derby doing handstands.

    What more can you want? Even horses like Mahler, who finished way down The Derby field have gone on to win a race at Royal Ascot, while horses like Kid Mambo put up highly creditable efforts in hot handicaps.

    Oh, and I nearly forgot about The Derby winner itself. What can you say about Authorized? He was a scintillating winner of the Blue Ribband, he then went on to run a solid race in The Eclipse when taking on his elders for the first time. And today, he has won arguably the race of the season in the style of a high class colt indeed. Today we had The Derby winner, The Eclipse winner, The King George winner, plus a top South African horse – and Authorized won very well indeed.

    So what’s your opinions of The Derby form now? Surely it’s one of the hottest Derby’s for a long time, with one of the best winners in the last 20 years.

    I look forward to your thoughts.

    Mike

    #111974
    Flash
    Member
    • Total Posts 1144

    I said at the time the Derby winner was very good and the knocking of the race was unfair.

    I’m just delighted to see Authorized prove himself today and its absolutely brilliant to see the three year olds doing so well when in many recent seasons the older horses have excelled.

    This season its been more evenly split because this years three year olds are a decent bunch.

    #111978
    clivex
    Member
    • Total Posts 3420

    Couldnt agree more and although its been said before, the PCH comeback is a wonderful story.

    Aqaleem backers (like myself of course) must be feeling pretty confident now too

    #111988
    Grasshopper
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2316

    Don’t you lot normally wait until after the Arc to start doling out the superlatives??

    #111991
    MikkyMo73
    Member
    • Total Posts 1789

    Don’t you lot normally wait until after the Arc to start doling out the superlatives??

    :lol:

    This is my first season here Grasshopper, and you will soon realise that I dish out the Superlatives every time I back a winner :lol:

    It doesn’t matter whether it’s a Derby winner or a Selling Hurdle winner, if it wins with my cash riding on it – then it’s a great horse :lol:

    Seriously, you can’t dispute the class of Authorized after today, and you can’t knock the Derby form in any way, shape or form.

    Mike

    #111994
    sberry
    Member
    • Total Posts 1801

    bloody hell – i was expecting another ‘he’s a plater and beat nothing that was anything or wasn’t out of sorts’ thread to appear

    i’ll go and have a sit down now :shock:

    #111997
    Grasshopper
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2316

    Seriously, you can’t dispute the class of Authorized after today, and you can’t knock the Derby form in any way, shape or form.
    Mike

    You could be right, Mikky – I wouldn’t know or care.

    The question I have is this:

    If Authorised hacks-up in the Arc, does it mean that he’s a superstar, and that this season’s 3yo form is thoroughly validated (in a historical sense)?

    Or does it mean that last season’s 3yo’s were as pi*sh as everyone thought, and that any 3yo with a modicum of talent this season should hack-up in the race?

    Regardless of the answer…..who actually gives a toss one way or the other??

    #111998
    MikkyMo73
    Member
    • Total Posts 1789

    Lol Grasshopper.

    If he hacks up in The Arc, I think it will stamp him as a top class colt of recent years.

    But like you, I don’t really care and I am more bothered about finding the next Selling Hurdle winner to be honest – that excites me more sometimes. A 2/1 winner in a Selling Hurdle returns you just as much as a 2/1 winner of The Arc :lol:

    Mike

    #111999
    Himself
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3772

    If Authorized does win the Arc (remember, Epsom Derby winners have a poor record in the race) then I think he deserves all the plaudits and praise that would inevitably come his way. Supertar status? Well, that’s another matter… unless of course he "Sea – Bird’s" the field. :wink:

    Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning

    #112000
    Meshaheer
    Member
    • Total Posts 486

    Comparing Group Ones to selling hurdles is a little fanciful for me :shock: :shock: :shock:

    But we all know Grasshopper won’t be truly happy until Authorized is running in novice chases :wink:

    The Derby is looking as good as it can do right now. Let’s hope the form holds up through the autumn.

    #112001
    Bosranic
    Member
    • Total Posts 1982

    If Authorized does win the Arc (remember, Epsom Derby winners have a poor record in the race) then I think he deserves all the plaudits and praise that would inevitably come his way. Supertar status? Well, that’s another matter… unless of course he "Sea – Bird’s" the field. :wink:

    3YOs have a poor record in the Juddmonte but that didn’t stop Authorized today. :D

    The form of the Derby and the winning margin of 5L proves that, not only is Authorized a very good horse, but he beat a decent field.

    #112004
    Flash
    Member
    • Total Posts 1144

    Seriously, you can’t dispute the class of Authorized after today, and you can’t knock the Derby form in any way, shape or form.
    Mike

    You could be right, Mikky – I wouldn’t know or care.

    The question I have is this:

    If Authorised hacks-up in the Arc, does it mean that he’s a superstar, and that this season’s 3yo form is thoroughly validated (in a historical sense)?

    Or does it mean that last season’s 3yo’s were as pi*sh as everyone thought, and that any 3yo with a modicum of talent this season should hack-up in the race?

    Regardless of the answer…..who actually gives a toss one way or the other??

    I think thats where your ratings can come in handy. Last seasons top middle distance races were generally won at around the 126 mark (on my ratings) and this season its a fraction higher to date. Manduro ran to 129 at Ascot, Dylan Thomas to 127 behind Manduro and in the King George. Authorized I have running to 127 today a pound higher than in the Derby (he’s probably still improving). On the minus side Notnowcato ran to 120 to win the Eclipse.

    The Arc last year was won by a horse running to 129 the highest mark I gave a horse all season.

    #112007
    Himself
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3772

    If Authorized does win the Arc (remember, Epsom Derby winners have a poor record in the race) then I think he deserves all the plaudits and praise that would inevitably come his way. Supertar status? Well, that’s another matter… unless of course he "Sea – Bird’s" the field. :wink:

    3YOs have a poor record in the Juddmonte but that didn’t stop Authorized today. :D

    The form of the Derby and the winning margin of 5L proves that, not only is Authorized a very good horse, but he beat a decent field.

    I wholeheartedly, 100% agree. Afterall, I did tip the horse for York glory today (see Juddmonte thread for details :wink: ) and i had a nice little bet on him for good measure.

    Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning

    #112008
    Bosranic
    Member
    • Total Posts 1982

    If Authorized does win the Arc (remember, Epsom Derby winners have a poor record in the race) then I think he deserves all the plaudits and praise that would inevitably come his way. Supertar status? Well, that’s another matter… unless of course he "Sea – Bird’s" the field. :wink:

    3YOs have a poor record in the Juddmonte but that didn’t stop Authorized today. :D

    The form of the Derby and the winning margin of 5L proves that, not only is Authorized a very good horse, but he beat a decent field.

    I wholeheartedly, 100% agree. Afterall, I did tip the horse for York glory today (see Juddmonte thread for details :wink: ) and i had a nice little bet on him for good measure.

    same here :wink:

    #112011
    Grasshopper
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2316

    I can hardly believe so many are prepared to play. :mrgreen:

    Bosranic, I refer you to my earlier question regarding the merits of this years 4yo’s. Perhaps this years Juddmonte was easier to win than usual, because last years 3yo’s were universally sh*ite?

    Flash, as far as ratings are concerned, it’s a crap-shoot, imo. FWIW, I’m of the opinion that races are often rated on the value/perceived merit/historical significance of the race, rather than on the form actually displayed. This happens in NH racing too, to wit Timeform giving Kicking King 182 (or something) for his first King George.

    No matter.

    Authorised may well be one of the best Flat horses of the last 25 years. My point is that he can’t be bracketed as such (surely?) until he has won the Arc. And even then, victory in that race should be viewed in the context of what he beat, and not the prestigiousness of the race.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 27 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.