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Mergewoa
"Cheltenham Gold Cup hero War Of Attrition will be campaigned in Ireland for the first half of the season.The Mouse Morris-trained seven-year-old will be aimed at Leopardstown’s Lexus Chase over Christmas and may not even be entered for the Stan James King George VI Chase at Kempton.
Morris told the Racing Post: "War Of Attrition will start off at Punchestown on October 19 in the two-mile-six-furlong Listed Chase he won last year.
"He could then go for the James Nicholson Chase at Down Royal, but his big target over the Christmas period is the Lexus Chase at Leopardstown.
"He’s done well over the summer, thickened up and virtually turned inside out, but he won’t even be entered for Kempton so the King George is not on the agenda."<br>"
EC – Looks like these Irish donkeys are running scared…..;)
- Total Posts 438
Quote: from cormack15 on 9:38 am on Sep. 15, 2006[br]Thing is – there’s no decent chasers over here to test them against!<br>
<br>In that case, why not come over to Haydock to try to get the Betfair Million?
Trabolgan will be back ;)
Seems odd to commit so far ahead given that Kempton is often nice racing ground at Xmas whereas leopardstown can be a bog. he can run on soft and heavy of course, but isnt he a little better on good?
Quote: from yquem21 on 9:56 am on Sep. 15, 2006[br]
Quote: from cormack15 on 9:38 am on Sep. 15, 2006[br]Thing is – there’s no decent chasers over here to test them against!<br>
<br>In that case, why not come over to Haydock to try to get the Betfair Million?<br>
yeah…his owner really needs it.
SHL
War of Attrition is just the appetiser before the main meal comes along in a couple of years ;)
- Total Posts 438
Quote: from SirHarryLewis on 11:25 am on Sep. 15, 2006[br]yeah…his owner really needs it.<br>
<br>It’s more about achieving a historical feat than the money.
looks to me like their ratings aren’t much different to RPR ratings that ignore how fast a race is run.
(Edited by EC at 5:37 pm on Sep. 15, 2006)<br>
And your surprised??
(Edited by SirHarryLewis at 9:35 pm on Sep. 15, 2006)
SHL
Kicking King will beat WoA comfortably in the Gold Cup – HOWEVER – i don’t think KK will win either.
Star De Mohaison looked absolutely brilliant at Cheltenham and Aintree. An early bloomer, he could be able to make the step up to genuine Grade 1 company this year, rather than take 2 years that most novices seem to take.
The Listener could also be something decent – Ashley Brook may even be able to stretch to 3m over a flat course like Kempton.
Quote: from EC on 10:34 pm on Sep. 15, 2006[br]well yes..seeing as the ratings are supposed to be ratings combining time and form..the time aspect of that race makes it a complete non contender to be top of ratings based on both factors
the clue is in the name so I am told :cheesy:
maybe they should now change their name..to FORM ;) <br>
YES BUT DO YOU BELIEVE IT WOULD BE AS USEFULL TO HAVE HEAVY TIME WEIGHTINGS ON 3 MILE CHASERS. I DONT ACTUALLY KNOW ALOT ABOUT THIS BUT I WONDER IF THERE ARE TIME EXPERTS OUT THERE MAKING THERE OWN RATINGS THE SAME WAY THEY DO ON THE FLAT??
SHL
Standard Timeform ratings are form ratings, not time ratings. The name of the firm reflects the fact that its founder was a time man but they’ve published separate timefigures for many years now on the flat.
Quote: from Grasshopper on 12:32 pm on Sep. 16, 2006[br]Do we really have to go through all this mince again, EC?
You don’t rate the Lexus form. Good for you.
I hope your stop-watch continues to serve you just as well in future small-field, soft-ground 3m chases.<br>
ah…but what im asking is if there are people out there successfully gambling on horses by giving them ratings based largely on time in the same way that is done for the 2 year old flat races and if not…why not??
<br>It seems to me that your obsessed with the idea that the best race horse is the one that gets from A to B fastest on good ground.
SHL
Quote: from EC on 2:53 pm on Sep. 16, 2006[br]lol..I was meaning Sir Harry Grassy :cheesy:
I do like races to be truly run though..it’s just how I am..can’t help it :o
I am NOT saying a race is poor if it is not soundly run..but I do prefer the pace to mean something..so don’t go getting the idea that I dismiss races completely if they aren’t a true test
<br>(Edited by EC at 2:55 pm on Sep. 16, 2006)<br>
Well i wouldnt consider myself a sarky type but some times communication does break down at tha level over the internet.<br>You gave the impression that you dont rate slower paced races and that other rating systems should weigh time heavily in handing out ratings and I just couldnt have that.
No offence intended.
SHL
Timeform do not produce timefigures for NH, only collateral Form Ratings a la RPR.
For the Flat they produce both Form Ratings and Time Ratings. They are independent of each other i.e. one does not influence the other. The timefigures can be seen as adding robustness (or not) to the form rating.
So when the RP announce that Timeform have awarded x a rating of y that is the form rating and does not take into account the time performance; these timefigures are available to those who subscribe to Perspective, Black Book etc.
Timeform’s Flat annual – Racehorses – has only the Form Ratings.
Neither Bull nor Whitford to the best of my knowledge had anything more than a cursory interest in NH and Timeform themselves didn’t really get involved in NH until the ’70s. The first C&H was released in ’76.
I see the Gold cup winner is back at Punchestown today but I expect Watson lake to be fitter, to better like the ground (i assume they got overnight rain??) and have the ability to take care of a GC winner who looks much better as a spring horse on good ground. I would have thought the others were a grade below but Srong Project at his best may run well.
SHL
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