- This topic has 29 replies, 15 voices, and was last updated 14 years, 5 months ago by
.
- Posts
I was thinking the other day after I had backed a horse at 6/1 just before the off only to see it returned at 5/1, that I have seen this happen plenty of times rarely the other way though. So I now call this the bookmakers fiddle. Also I remember before all races were televised how many horses were thrown out after a stewards inquiry a lot more than are disqualified today I called this the stewards fiddle. Then there’s the horse slow out the stalls normally well fancied I call this the jockeys fiddle Don’t get me wrong and say if I think there are so many fiddles why do I bother to back horses. I love my racing and as I said in the title where there’s money there’s always going to be someone fiddling so I’ve just got used to it now, but it is annoying when some fiddler cost me money so I say hang them.
Don’t get me wrong and say if I think there are so many fiddles why do I bother to back horses.
Could it be that you want in on these so call fiddles.
The might be fiddles, which has to be proven, but not everywhere!
- Total Posts 17716
I agree,
Horses should be running on their merits, they can’t exactly have their say in the tactics and riding arangements so anyone laying their horses for money should be charged under animal cruelty, attempting to decieve the betting customers and fraud then sent down for at least 5+ years.
I was thinking the other day after I had backed a horse at 6/1 just before the off only to see it returned at 5/1, that I have seen this happen plenty of times rarely the other way though. So I now call this the bookmakers fiddle. Also I remember before all races were televised how many horses were thrown out after a stewards inquiry a lot more than are disqualified today I called this the stewards fiddle. Then there’s the horse slow out the stalls normally well fancied I call this the jockeys fiddle Don’t get me wrong and say if I think there are so many fiddles why do I bother to back horses. I love my racing and as I said in the title where there’s money there’s always going to be someone fiddling so I’ve just got used to it now, but it is annoying when some fiddler cost me money so I say hang them.
On course bookies shortening up just before the off is a problem these days. Although to call them bookmakers is being generous; they’re more like traders these days. Taking bets with a large over-round and then backing them back on betfair.
It does put you off going racing. I used to be a regular at Ascot, Fontwell, Wincanton, Newbury, Goodwood and Salisbury. Now only at the latter three. You just don’t get the value bets on course nowadays. Even when I go there, 90% of my bets are at Early morning prices or Betfair before I go. The 10% on course are usually either saver or top up bets with an occasional good bet in a maiden. Must say, there’s never been better value to be had betting with off course bookmakers at Early Prices. That’s if you’re not refused or limited with stakes. With the added hits of petrol prices and Racecourse entrance / membership fees; it’s far superior value to stop at home with computer in lap, watching RUK/ATR.
As for your other "fiddles", rubbish!
Value Is Everythingit is annoying when some fiddler cost me money so I say hang them.
Are you sure you are not just blaming others for backing the wrong horses Tony?
What about examples?
Value Is EverythingI’ve always said that I’m pretty sure there are fiddles aplenty but I don’t think it’s really reduced my chances of winning by much.
Champion tipster I aint.
As far as the ‘shortening up before the off’ is concerned, I think the problem is that many high street bookmakers offer ‘Best Odds’ to encourage people to take a price. It kind of stiffs people who prefer to bet at SP.
I’me not talking about shortening prices before the off but after the off. Heres an example I cannot remember the year but it was the lincoln h;cap easy to check I studied the form long and hard and selected hunters of brora which won at about 14/1 I think hot favourite 2nd stewards disqualified hunters of brora so the horse they had got there money on won, stewards fiddle .I watched the race and I have never seen a horse thrown out for such a trifling offence. Anyway guess who was awarded the race on appeal. There are lots of other examples I can give but it would take a lot of pages. I did say I loved racing so its no good quoting me and leaving something out as one reply did.
Hunters of Brora ceased trading several years ago, but happily their splendid tweeds are now woven by Johnstons of Elgin
Tony
I think you see bogeymen coming from all directions when they don’t exist. Prices shortening up before the off are just the market in sction. The market percentages are the ultimate measure and, taking yesterday’s markets as an example, I can’t see any races where the overround per runner is more than about 1.5 in anything bar small fields. Indeed the advent of the exchanges has probably helped SP punters to a small degree in keeping the overround fairly tight.
Regarding disqualifications, we could argue until the cows come home about some, and that has happened a few times on here. Ultimately though the stewards call it as they see it. If they don’t see it the same way as others, well that’s just though. They are charged with making a judgement and in the vast majority of cases they get it pretty much on the button.
Rob
True , where there is betting there is roguery , reminds me of a little stroke I pulled about 40 yrs ago …Max will love this one
We had a small flapping greyhound meeting, the market and betting was bloomin marvelous .. traps in a middle of a field , straight run up behind a lure being dragged by a honda 50 …first past the line got paid
I brought my bitch and her sapling s , all coursing bred about 12 months old , they were all in the same race with another plodder
The saplings were never in traps before and the bitch won by a distance ….the bookies cried foul , and grudgingly paid out what was then a tidy sum
Happy days , the stuff nowadays is the same , although fiddled in a different manner
Ricky
must agree with tony007 here about horses prices shortening up just before or after off ive seen this happen before one example was hawkeyethenoo when he won a couple of weeks ago just before the off he was 8/1 sp 15/2 i know horses prices can shorten just before off but it does seem to happen more and more i never remember seeing many odds lengten just before or after the off
This has definitely got worse since the method of determining the starting prices was changed 4 or 5 years ago. All part of the plan to rip punters off as much as possible I’m afraid.
I've stumbled on the side of twelve misty mountains
I've walked and I crawled on six crooked highwaysThis has definitely got worse since the method of determining the starting prices was changed 4 or 5 years ago. All part of the plan to rip punters off as much as possible I’m afraid.
It’s a rip off that’s fairly easy to avoid though isn’t it?
And everyone loves the idea of a Tote monopoly but were there to be one it would happen in every race without question.
must agree with tony007 here about horses prices shortening up just before or after off ive seen this happen before one example was hawkeyethenoo when he won a couple of weeks ago just before the off he was 8/1 sp 15/2 i know horses prices can shorten just before off but it does seem to happen more and more i never remember seeing many odds lengten just before or after the off
tj
If you consider that true, given that book percentages are reasonable at the moment, then wouldn’t it make sense to bet two minutes before the off at board prices. If you are right about shorteners then surely you would have a significant advantage, certainly over SP backers?
Rob
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.