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Corm , get a grip , I know you need to get threads going , but not at the expense of your credibility and indeed this much reduced outpost
No Horse will ever exceed Arkle , they built the rules around him , he was truly invincible , and will always remain so
imo
Ricky
Come on Cormack, the devil has enough advocates without you joining his legal staff.
Sprinter is special, but the other " Himself " was extra special.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
It is tenpting to overlaud new stars. It’s also tempting to temper one’s enthusiasm with caution.
But, after Frankel proved himself the greatest ever flat horse over the last three seasons, are we witnessing the career of the best-ever jumper unfolding before our eyes?
Bollox to the whingers Corm you laud away!
What a horse. Not seen anything like it. A machine. The winning margin was 14 lengths but god only knows what it could have been if he had been even the slightest bit extended.
As you say Frankel PROVED himself beyond question. This one has a way to go but he has done everything right so far.
PS Mad Moose irrelevant as, like Knockara Beau he stole 10 lengths and was greatly flattered.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
"Sacre – not best ‘since’ Arkle but best INCLUDING Arkle".
Which puts Mad Moose roughly on a par with Kauto Star?
MikeThis bit of ‘fun’ is akin to asking if Arkle was better than Golden Miller after the former’s Broadway (Sun Alliance) Chase win
A very easy and visually impressive win from Sprinter Sacre today and who knows how much more he could have given if given any sort of race at all by the field
Mad Moose may well have been revitalised by a trio of runs over hurdles but doubt very much he has improved much on his mid-130s chase form, at which he looks exposed; and in any case he’s gone very well on deep ground in the past so probably acted on it today better than his rivals
Somersby’s a good sort whose gone well fresh but doesn’t particularly like Cheltenham and given he’s proven up to 24f really should have stayed on better, so reckon he was below form on his first try on heavy going
Sanctuaire obviously resented being led out of his box on such a cold morning and sulked
So let’s be rather too generous and say the placed horses ran to 150 and let’s pluck 20lb from thin air to quantify Sprinter Sacre’s authority: 170+…
…very good, very promising, hope he’s an ‘all-time great’ but just an ever so teensy-weensy bit rash to rate him 212+ on the basis of today’s cakewalk
IMVVHO
Basically: ask again in three years time after SS has won three Gold Cups – or in his case three Champion Chases, I guess
Apologies if these words seem too serious and dangerously analytical
Ricky – I suspect you put it there just to wind me up (you knowing how passionate I am about TRF and all and me knowing what a mischievious fellow you are), but I just HAVE to respond to your un-generous comment that TRF is a ‘much reduced outpost’.
If we look at the most recently completed month and the corresponding month 5 years ago (my figures don’t go back further) TRF’s traffic has INCREASED BY 25.22% over that 5 year period. (i.e. 25.22% more traffic in Dec 2012 than in Dec 2007)
That’s been acheived at a time when the competition for people’s internet time from social media has been fierce.
Those figs are reflected across other months also.
We also have over 3,500 followers on our twitter account and over 1,000 on facebook (on both of which we don’t really do as much as we might).
So we’re doing OK, thank you, for an outpost.
"Sacre – not best ‘since’ Arkle but best INCLUDING Arkle".
Which puts Mad Moose roughly on a par with Kauto Star?
MikeThis bit of ‘fun’ is akin to asking if Arkle was better than Golden Miller after the former’s Broadway (Sun Alliance) Chase win
Look, a pound is a length is a pound is a length. Gottit?
Mike
Next week: why Zoffany is the second greatest flat horse of all time.
You’re kidding, right?
Sprinter Sacre looks like a 2-mile chaser, not a 3-time Cheltenham Gold Cup winner. He also hasn’t faced any horse the likes of Mill House.
I gotcha Corm …..By reduced I did not mean in terms of volume and traffic
you know that …and yet you reach for the stats….poor boy
I meant much reduced in stature , much reduced in terms of the overall quality of threads and posters
Indeed things are so gloomy , that you have to start a thread to get the feathers flying ……
However , in fairness its still a good place to visit , wind up its owner occasionally , even if you think he does a good job overall …..
I gotcha though
Ricky
Another extremely impressive performance today.
But better than Arkle ?
Its a bit like comparing apples and pears.
He is an extremely talented 2 mile chaser.
But better than Arkle…. no way in my opinion.:mrgreen:
I meant much reduced in stature , much reduced in terms of the overall quality of threads and posters
Really? Seems rather a mean thing to say. Why come on here and say something like that?
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
I don’t think anyone in their right mind would say he is better than Arkle right now – of course not.
But are we also saying there can NEVER be another horse as good as Arkle?
IF there was ever going to be a horse to compare to him what would he have to have done so far?
Win his races like SS no? Could he actually have been any more impressive?
He has years to go and must keep doing what he is doing but let’s not say it can’t be done surely.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
Ha, you know an attack on TRF will always have me on the defence RL!
I don’t necessarily think we’ve reduced in ‘stature’ – how would you be measuring/guaging that Ricky? Stature in whose eyes?
My primary goal is focused around ensuring those who come on here enjoy it and just keeping the whole thing going.
There are still plenty of good threads and plenty highly knowledgable posters IMO. I do start the odd thread, not that many overall and certainly a lot less than I did before I was involved in running it, when I was much more prolific. So, if anything, I post significantly less than I did in the past (to answer your implication that I have to seed threads to drive activity- a quick glance at the first few pages of any section of the site will illustrate that). I also have times when I have more and less time on my hands to participate rather than administrate. I also tried to cut down on my posting a bit so I could avoid debates such as these…
I still think it’s one of the very best places on the internet for the average fan (by that I mean anyone can come on here – no barriers, no cost) to come to and participate in open discussion on racing in what I hope is a relatively well-moderated but, hopefully, not stifling environment.
But then I am a little biased!
Anyway – going back to the original discussion – ‘No horse will ever exceed Arkle’ – Why? Given Arkle, who was, after all, just a horse with four legs like any other, achieved what he did, is it not entirely reasonable or logical that another horse could match, or exceed it?
Anyway – going back to the original discussion – ‘No horse will ever exceed Arkle’ – Why? Given Arkle, who was, after all, just a horse with four legs like any other, achieved what he did, is it not entirely reasonable or logical that another horse could match, or exceed it?
This point is obviously correct.
Jumps racing has only been around for a couple of hundred years. Were it to continue for a even just a few tens of thousands of years (a mere blip in human development terms) then the idea that greatest horse of ‘all time’ has appeared in the first 0.5% or whatever of racing’s history is extremely unlikely.
Statistically speaking, Arkle is an absolute certainty to be surpassed.
Mike
Imagine SS vs Moscow Flyer – dont think you can compare different horse from different eras.
There are plenty of other 2m chasers from the past that would give him a race. I would like to see him off the bridle and see what he has in the locker as that engine and style is unbeatable atm unless he makes a jumping error. Horses from the past like Waterloo Boy were real battlers – tough as nails. Whilst SS is the top of his tree if he is challenged, when he gets a bit older, we will see how good he is.
Seems to love his jumping tho
This point is obviously correct.
Jumps racing has only been around for a couple of hundred years. Were it to continue for a even just a few tens of thousands of years (a mere blip in human development terms) then the idea that greatest horse of ‘all time’ has appeared in the first 0.5% or whatever of racing’s history is extremely unlikely.
Statistically speaking, Arkle is an absolute certainty to be surpassed.
Mike
But the Racing game has already changed in that short space of time, with the top class races now at level weights instead of handicaps. Whos to say in another 50 years time there won’t be another rule change to make comparisons of different generations of horses even more difficult.
I gotcha Corm …..
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