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Thanks for the replies.
Ideas and theories are put out in the open so they can be PROVEN or DESTROYED.
I want the author to be correct and also that his book is still relevent for todays racing.
But i still have an open mind (evidence will win the debate)Hate to be so negative Dynamite but…
(thats okay it makes for an intelligent conversation)
Let the trial continue…
…………………………………………….WHO’S WHO?D21
During LOCKDOWN ive been watching a lot of youtube videos, defo some great content out there.
Prominent Betting Professional was being interviewed (wont mention his name, iam not nasty like that)
>>>DO YOU HAVE ANY SPECIAL ARRANGEMENTS WITH BOOKMAKERS?
“I have three firms I use, that use me as a marker account. They cap though it’s not that a can have as much as I like (£1,000 to £1,500 is fine). And NO liberty taking EW’s”
…
This cosy relationship is just the tip of the iceberg. Most insider dealings are top secret, but to me it shows that 60 year old shenanigans (described in the book) are still alive and kicking.
…The racing industry and press journalist are also thick as thieves. Jobs are past on through the “jobs for mates network”. Trainers very much “keep it in the family” too. Joe Public is only a boot scraping.
All this sort of thing wouldn’t be tolerated in usual, legal, society.
Not complaining it all adds to the rich tapestry, clean up horse racing there would be NO HORSE RACING. Horses will be aimed at certain races. They cannot always be at peak (winning) form. Handicap system encourages dishonesty, can’t beat them join them is the only sensible plan.
A twilight doublespeak world seduces it’s inhabitants
.I think it’s important to take onboard the complete nature of the task of making betting pay.
D21
>>>DO YOU HAVE ANY SPECIAL ARRANGEMENTS WITH BOOKMAKERS?
“I have three firms I use, that use me as a marker account. They cap though it’s not that a can have as much as I like (£1,000 to £1,500 is fine). And NO liberty taking EW’s”
…
This cosy relationship is just the tip of the iceberg. Most insider dealings are top secret, but to me it shows that 60 year old shenanigans (described in the book) are still alive and kicking.Wish I didn’t have my “cosy relationship” with the biggest bookmaker in the land then, Dynamite. LOL
When bookmakers know a punter makes money at the game they’ll either limit or close the account… And it doesn’t take much money for them to act.
If I think a horse has a 20% chance of winning (fair 4/1) which is worth pointing out obviously also an 80% chance of losing… It’s (if my assessment of its chance is correct) value / a bloody good bet @ 6/1. If Laddbrokes are top or joint top price @ 6/1 they’ll only allow me a certain amount on (ie a “cap”)… And it’s nowhere near the £1,000 let alone £1,500 this chap can get on! They’re not making a special price for me, it’s not “insider dealing” or “shenannigins”; it’s been 6/1 for everyone until I’ve backed it. But they’ll immediately cut the price afterwards. They’re not using me to tell them who’s going to win either, just who their odds compilers have probably got wrong – who they’ve over-priced. I don’t like being limited and used as a “marker”; wish they’d allow me any amount on like the vast majority of punters. But if it wasn’t for this “relationship” / “special arrangement” I wouldn’t be able to get anything on any top priced horse at Ladbrokes because they’d probably close the account entirely – knowing there’s nothing in it for them.
Value Is EverythingWhat is (or was) very wrong is so called “no lose” accounts. Quite a few years ago there was a TY documentary about it.
Trainers were given accounts by bookmakers where they could back a horse and get the money back if it lost. ie Bookmakers were using the trainer’s bet to tell them it was very much fancied by connections.
It’s still on Youtube somewhere.
Value Is Everythingand he’s sitting down for cosy chats on William Hill radio. Backing your own tips before they go out on oddschecker is also a bit sly. (open goal lay)
D21
Betting in the USA is totally different. Money goes in to the Tote Board. In Britain we take a price with bookmakers or betfair. Albeit betfair wasn’t around in 1960 or 1972… Which is another reason why this book is out of date.
Following the money – which this book seems to advise – I wouldn’t advise it. Public handicapper and track handicapper have at least looked at all the form and come up with prices they believe each horse should be – a betting forecast… And yet the object of the game here is backing horses at shorter odds than these handicappers believe they should be. Fair enough if the guy has studied the form and disagrees with them… But no, he’s just backing horses the handicappers believe are poor value.
Yes, market moves can be professional or stable money, doesn’t mean it is though.
Tote Board in Britain and Ireland is not used by the vast majority of “smart” investors. It’s too weak and bets to an over-round that’s uncompetitive compared with bookmakers and exchanges. Imagine doing a similar thing but by using bookmakers or betfair in this country. Having a betting strategy that is ALWAYS taking shorter prices than were available.
Value Is Everything1. I am proceeding on the basis that money talks.
2. The tail doesn’t wag the dog.
3. This dusty neglected tome is a betting market rosetta stone.
Later CHAPTERs involve a lot of conventional form studying. That attempts to paint the truth into a corner.
The book majors on highlighting non-triers. This produces a betting market that resembles swiss cheese.
D21
“the proof of the pudding is in the eating”Just at the moment I am in the middle of the highly interesting Jagersro galopp on this double banger weekend which offers little extra but the curtains twitching a bit more often. I have not read the last book extracts on this fast moving thread and with its fast thinking hare contributors. Allow one sleepy giant tortoise to possibly guide you all down a different garden path. Dyna, inevitably your cyborgian approach has the possibility to bear fruit and the proof – one ex governor of California.
Racing calls I must hurry away….
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