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From the link CAS posted:
Since 2021 we classed a raceday fatality as “any horse fatally injured or euthanised on welfare grounds as a direct result of their injuries on raceday or within 48 hours of raceday”
The amount of horses that die after picking up injuries in races but is not counted because of the 48 hr rule would massively increase the statistics in a bad way which is why they have this 48 hr rule in the first place.
If the injury happens in a race why should it not be counted for weeks/months after ?
Celebre D’Allen died on the Tuesday after the national, going by the way it’s currently done the race had nothing to do with his death! We all know this isn’t true
Why the hell is this general discussion continuing on what is meant to be a memorial for Persian Time.
This has come up many times before pilgarlic. As soon as one poster goes beyond simply paying tribute to the deceased horse and makes comments where blame could be implied, it opens up a debate.
Personally as long as posters remain respectful in tone I have no issue with discussion occurring on a memorial thread. Talking through our responses to the horse’s sad death and what can be done to reduce fatalities is important.
I know some people might prefer that it is done elsewhere, but long experience of posting on here makes me believe that this is not a realistic prospect.
My general perception of posters on this forum is that they have the utmost respect for horses, even the oddballs like Mr. Incredible and don’t like to see horses succumb to any injuries, let alone fatalities.
However, injuries and fatalities are part of racing and although a great deal is done to make the sport as safe as possible, they are always going to happen and have to be accepted.
If people are so upset about fatalities, then they shouldn’t be following the sport and it’s time to step out. The loudest give the impression that they watch horse racing waiting for a fatality so they can add it to the Memorial list as quickly as possible.
Others with the same distaste for equine deaths appear to analyse the cause in great detail, to the extent where it appears to have been watched multiple times in slow motion for greater accuracy……….or criticism.
Others feel they have a right to know all the details about the horses demise and feel aggrieved they haven’t been informed in a timely manner. Go and buy a horse and then you can inform whoever you like!!
Horses are bred to race and in some cases they unfortunately die. I accept that, I don’t like it, but I accept it.
What is more of a concern to me is the trading and the disgusting issues found at Shannonside Foods which should never happen in the modern world of horse racing. The regulation, identification and traceability of racehorses by the racing authorities should be an absolute basic in this day and age.
That is what people should be pressuring and criticizing, not some armchair jockey hindsighting and babbling on about a horse not being pulled up early enough.
I’ve followed racing for nearly 70 years griff. Please don’t lecture me or make assumptions about how I feel about it. And don’t tell me that I shouldn’t follow the sport because I get so attached to some of them that I find it heartbreaking when they get injured or die. Thank you.
With all due respect Moehat, I’m not intending to lecture you, but I fail to understand why you put yourself under so much distress.
You have made comments like below a number of times, yet you keep coming back for more. I’m not making assumptions, you told everybody in your own words.
“…..or make assumptions about how I feel about it.”
“I’m afraid that, after over six decades of loving NH racing I no longer get any pleasure from watching it and can’t actually justify doing so, either.”
A phrase comes to mind……’**** or get off the pot’.
I don’t like watching golf or cycling and do you know what I do…….I don’t watch them!!!
I don’t like country music either, and I don’t listen to that.
You are of course perfectly entitled to keep watching a sport that you don’t get pleasure from, but it beats me why do.
If you want to continue to watch horses compete, perhaps eventing or showjumping might be easier for your soul, and they die there as well, so be prepared.
You’re welcome.
Griff, I agree with many of your comments on these threads, but I think you are oversimplifying re those racing fans who agonise over the animal welfare aspects.
Those of us who have loved racing for years know that the highest highs that the sport can give are truly magical, uplifting experiences. Speaking personally, few other things can bring me so much joy. Racing can get ingrained in your soul, and it is not something that is easy to turn your back on after that has happened. However, much like a drug, those highs can be accompanied by some horrible lows.
I doubt many people would tell a football fan whose mood can be determined by the performance of their team to stop following football, even though they may regularly go through agony. I know it’s not quite the same thing with racing where part of the issue relates to ethics, but there are some parallels.
Realistically I know that racing is not going to lose me, but the welfare aspects have always challenged me and always will. Perhaps that makes me an idiot to continue to follow it, but I believe it is worth it, even if that is said through gritted teeth sometimes.
I think many who follow horse racing have the same feelings to varying degrees Marlingford. All perfectly natural.
What I can’t understand is putting oneself through so much torment and be continually vocal about it, yet never do anything to remedy the situation.
It’s like self-flagellation, because this person in particular has made similar comments to, “I’m afraid that, after over six decades of loving NH racing I no longer get any pleasure from watching it and can’t actually justify doing so, either”, yet continues to do so and will probably continue to make these comments over and over again. Why?
As I understand it, the Memorial Section is a place to inform people of any horses that have suffered a fatality and recognize their loss, I didn’t realize it was a Therapy Centre.
(Note to Admin…..you’re missing out on a useful revenue stream here!!)
I’d like to know what, if any, involvement you have ever had with horses, griff. Bet you’ve never had a beloved horse die in your arms. For what it’s worth, seeing Haiti Coulers win the Irish National brought back to me the feeling of elation that I have felt over the years seeing a spellbinding performance. Which is what brings me back to the sport. Anyway, I will no longer anger you by airing my sorrow on here when I question my involvement with racing ( which has been particularly brutal over the past few weeks). I’d rather be like me than you any day as your remarks have really hurt me. You’ve made me feel very small and stupid. Well done.
Moehat, there are plenty of other people who feel like you, and there is no need to justify yourself or feel stupid. You are a great poster whose contributions I know many appreciate on here, and long may that continue.
Griff is well capable of speaking for himself, but I suspect it was not his intent to cause upset. Possibly you have been on the receiving end of some of his long-running frustrations about these memorial threads, even though you have not actually posted on them often.
Where the content of memorial threads seems to be becoming an increasingly contentious topic, I guess it’s ultimately up to the admins to consider if it’s worth having any guidelines on what is acceptable to post, though that is no easy task when views are clearly quite varied.
I personally don’t give a s**t about other people’s comments. As long as I can criticize a goalie, an athlete, a F1 driver and so on for looking poor some occasion I don’t care if he is a jockey or not.
And by the way, this is no form of after-timing at all: When a jockey rides a brilliant race and you’re full of praise no one calls you an after-timer. But when you dare to write that someone looked bad on a fatally injured horse all of a sudden a bunch of attorneys come to the fore trying to defend him. Why? Are jockeys, especially NH jockeys unfailing? I don’t think so.The “Therapy Centre” part is pure comedy…..
“I’d like to know what, if any, involvement you have ever had with horses”
Well, the family have won a Gold Cup. I used to get a ride to the school bus stop on a Cheltenham HC winner (Hunterchase meeting), while it was doing its roadwork. In times past, I used to annually attend the three days at the Festival, plus other meetings of course and PtP’s every weekend during the season.
“Bet you’ve never had a beloved horse die in your arms.”
No, I’ve never had a horse die in my arms (not sure why that’s relevant), but as a kid I used to walk my old ‘Gypsy’ around and around crushing apples for cider and eventually watched her loaded onto the lorry for a one-way trip.
However, I have had some of my beloved dogs die in my arms over the years. They’re memories, but I don’t carry those memories around with me day to day, it’s just part of life. It’s the same for racehorses, disappointing, sad, but get over it or leave the sport alone.
By the way, please don’t overreact to my comments. I’m not at all angered by your sensibilities, just bewildered at how somebody can self inflict so much distress on themselves and not do anything constructive about it.
Ruby……..
“The “Therapy Centre” part is pure comedy”
I think you’re confusing comedy with reality.
It is the second time on this forum over the past year or so that you have virtually told me that I shouldn’t be involved with racing. Since when have I been ‘continually vocal’ about it? Do you make a note of everything I post? I do actually feel that you’ve singled me out eg you didn’t criticise Marlingford in the same way for partly agreeing with me.And don’t tell me not to ‘overreact’ to your insensitive comments. It rather smacks of ‘calm down dear’ and I find it patronising.
Moe your a great poster and asset to this Forum. Keep posting and doing what your doing, same with Ruby.
I’ve no wish with get into another disagreement with Griff again after last time when he upset me as much as he has you Moe and I’m not ashamed to admit it put me off posting here for a while, but I’m Ok with it now.
Never let anyone take away your spirit and the way you feel about horses.
JacThings turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out...
Jac
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