Home › Forums › Horse Racing › Low sun. High time this nonsense stopped!
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greenasgrass.
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October 27, 2024 at 14:03 #1710947
Glad – Not sure they have the resources/money to do that in the first place and I would imagine that they very well might not like the answer they get if they actually did do comparisons.
When there is no tangible evidence to support their case then they can continue on with their line that it is ‘a safety issue’ as they know that most are going to accept that without argument because to not do so clearly means you don’t give a monkeys about horse welfare…..because as we all know perception is reality.
October 27, 2024 at 14:40 #1710958“it actually takes longer for horses eyesight to adjust from dark to light and light to dark than it does for humans… ”
This is definitely a “thing” when jumping from dark into light and vice versa (more so light into dark eg a fence jumping into woodland from a field). Less for constantly bright ambient light even jumping towards the sun.“Possibly rather than probably I reckon as the longer adjustment to light levels might be negated by horses having largely non-overlapping monocular ‘wide angle of view’ vision due to eyes set on the sides of their head rather than the overlapping ‘depth of field’ binocular vision we have with eyes on the front of our head
Therefore ‘head on’ glare from a low sun does not wholly fill a horse’s field of view in the way it does ours”
This is a very important point. They’re not looking directly at the sun. Also, they have built in sun visors in the form of corpora nigra.
October 27, 2024 at 17:49 #1710978Also, they have built in sun visors in the form of corpora nigra.
Interesting, one learns something new everyday, thanks
This article is a good summary:
https://www.westvets.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/corpora-nigra.pdf
October 27, 2024 at 17:56 #1710979My own personal view is that this could be remedied overnight if the BHA ever had someone with a spine in charge.
Order courses to run their races as stated or face 10k per obstacle omitted fines.
But the war has already been lost with regard to this issue! The games up!
I think I might start watching connect 4 world championships to get my thrills from sport!
October 27, 2024 at 18:09 #1710981I don’t know anything about the science of race horse eyes. As domestic horses evolved from largely plains-based equines hunted by species which generally become more active at dusk, you might expect them to be able to cope well with running at speed into the setting sun but who knows?
Regardless of whether it is a real or imagined safety issue, I can’t believe that there is so little appetite to find solutions as I am sure it’s possible for at least some of the courses affected with a bit of will and imagination. Maybe the answer is to commit to refunding racegoers when fences are omitted, as has already been suggested.
October 27, 2024 at 21:06 #1711002Here are a few pieces on a horse’s vision I found:
https://www.extension.iastate.edu/equine/vision-equine
“An unusual feature of the equine eye is the corpora nigra. It is a knobby structure that juts out from the top of the iris and functions to shade the pupil from glare.
The retina is the major determinant of vision. The horse has a rectangular pupil shape which extends the area of visual perception. The size of the pupil determines the amount of light allowed into the back part of the eye. Pupils contract under bright light and enlarge in low light. Compared to other animals, horses have lots of cells in their retinas and have fairly good vision. Horses are thought to have vision somewhere in the range of 20/30 to 20/60. Cones are required for bright light (day light) vision, and rods are required for dim light vision. The horse’s ratio of rods to cones is approximately 20:1, compared to people who have a ratio of 9:1. Thus, equine retinas are designed to detect motion even in low-lighting conditions.Horses are easily blinded by bright light but can see better in dim light”.
And:
“their eyes are slower to adapt to changes in light level than ours, so they stay dazzled for longer than we do”.
And:
“Instead they have corpora nigra – that’s the raggedy part of the iris that hangs into the pupil and is particularly effective at shading out sunlight from above. This design is perfect for a grazing animal whose head is usually on the ground and whose eyes are scanning low across the horizon. The corpora nigra acts as an awning! When a horse’s head is up and in very bright light, the pupil constricts and the corpora nigra partially covers the iris to protect it from being harmed by the sun. It’s like when we try to see through squinted eyes – you see only enough to fumble your way around”.
Value Is EverythingOctober 28, 2024 at 09:35 #1711025Good stuff Ginger, ain’t evolution remarkable
This design is perfect for a grazing animal whose head is usually on the ground and whose eyes are scanning low across the horizon. The corpora nigra acts as an awning! When a horse’s head is up and in very bright light, the pupil constricts and the corpora nigra partially covers the iris to protect it from being harmed by the sun
This reminded me of Mary Reveley’s rather lazy but good ol’ stayer Seven Towers, who invariably dropped his head when out in front. Perhaps his corpora nigra weren’t working as they should
The closing stages of this show his unusual head carriage
October 28, 2024 at 12:07 #1711038Hurdles bypassed at Aintree again to, night as well be bumper races
Vf x
October 28, 2024 at 12:28 #1711042Correct me if I’m wrong but in France I think they just let them get on with it with nothing omitted.
Peter Scudamore talked about the issue a couple of years back…
“I can’t in all honesty never remember missing a fence or hurdle out for low sun in my career – or even being concerned about the sun.
I saw an instance at Aintree the other day where obstacles were dolled off and it was clearly ludicrous. The cloud had come back over.
If you have a bet in a race where there are meant to be a certain amount of obstacles you should be able to get your money back. And as a trainer you should be able to withdraw your runner.”I believe, around the same time Scudamore had his say, I saw there was an article written by a racing journalist about goggles jockeys and horses can wear to keep out the sun. Don’t know if that is true though.
A possible solution, which I may have mentioned before, is to change the start time of a big race where low sun was a risk, so it could be run properly.
October 28, 2024 at 15:52 #1711079When Scu (P) was riding, there was a rule of racing that if more than two obstacles in a race were bypassed, the race would be declared void. Which is why he never experienced fences taken out for low sun.
It was only when that rule was removed, at the time when bypassing obstacles to avoid injured horses or jockeys was introduced, that the low sun became an issue – the law of unforseen consequences. That was in the late 90’s.
“And as a trainer you should be able to withdraw your runner.”
The problem with that is that the owner still has to pay the race entry fee, the jockeys riding fee and the cost of transport to and from the racecourse. Which is why connections basically put up with ‘low sun’ in the hope of getting some prize money.
”
October 28, 2024 at 18:08 #1711090Ideally punters should be able to void their bet if obstacles are taken out after their bet has been placed. I appreciate that is probably not possible on course or in the shops but is it impossible online where so much betting takes place nowadays?
I suppose Betfair punters have the option to cash out, even for a small loss.
October 28, 2024 at 22:56 #1711125Agree with CAS that since conditions of a bet are altered when the course is changed then there should be a money back option*. Main topic of conversation amongst the ‘Kelso Rooftoppers’ on Saturday was which horses would be most suited by having less fences to jump!
October 30, 2024 at 19:30 #1711234As mentioned why does French racing apparently not have this issue?
I’ve not stood on a course such as Kelso to see how the low sun affects the home straight but is it feasible to have low weight suspended black netting further up the course in line with the omitted obstacles? Or possibly attached in front of the offending obstacles but not in a way that affects TV viewing etc?
Surely it can’t be beyond the wit of man in the 21st Century to devise a light weight (and low cost) device to stop this from keep happening? Do we not have any inventors out there with a proper solution?
October 31, 2024 at 08:52 #1711245I’ve also wondered why no course has tried blocking tactics to filter the sunlight and thus eliminate the problem. It wouldn’t need a solid barrier, just a mesh I feel.
If you watch American football, when there’s a kick at goal, they run up a black mesh in a few seconds to a height of about forty feet. It’s designed to stop the ball disappearing into the crowd and works fine, but the crowd can still clearly see the action.
And if that’s no good, bring in a couple of enthusiastic amateur drone fliers and get them to suspend something between the sun and the fences for the duration of the race. Of course this would require initiative and testing on the part of a racecourse management, and therefore interfere with the planning for their next concert, or Ladies Day etc.
October 31, 2024 at 09:06 #1711246Thanks for that apracing. Very interesting ideas. Of course the mesh would need to be erected quickly and withstand wind & rain but I still can’t see that being an issue.
Why don’t the BHA ask for suggestions and perhaps experiment with some of those ideas at a couple of the NH racecourses continually affected by low sun?
October 31, 2024 at 15:36 #1711272Interesting comments from Lizzie Kelly on RTV just now, explaining that horses will often spot the shadow of a fence and take off early as a result. This is obviously not ideal.
The lower the sun in the sky, the longer the shadow cast by a fence, and the earlier a horse is likely to take off.
October 31, 2024 at 18:29 #1711284I’ve heard before about horses jumping a shadow but if the sun is side on to an obstacle doesn’t the wing/rail of the obstacle also cast a broken shadow?
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