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Losing a Derby ride to the more experienced Robert Havlin

Home Forums Horse Racing Losing a Derby ride to the more experienced Robert Havlin

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  • #1696621
    Avatar photoGladiateur
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    Guaranteed stayer (certainly wasn’t stopping at the end of the Lingfield trial); should have kicked on when he cruised up to the leaders.

    Not saying that he categorically would have won, but Havlin let Moore get first run on him. It certainly would have been much closer.

    #1696636
    Avatar photoEx RubyLight
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    He didn’t look great, imo. Almost any of the other (senior) jockey would have finished 2nd on him. Just looked a bit arrogant at the 3f pole while Ryan was making up ground on the inside, but the winner was too good and Mr. Gredley will be pleased with a Derby runner-up.
    Though I have to say Havlin looked rather inexperienced.

    #1696669
    LD73
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    Lets be honest……Halvin rode a decent race but you can’t tell me that Shepherd wouldn’t have giving him an equally decent ride to finish in exactly the same position.

    The horse wouldn’t have beaten COT had Halvin kicked earlier and you can easily argue that COT also wasted a fair bit of energy in not settling for a large part of the race. He was maintaining his advantage in the last furlong and the best horse on the day won.

    All in all the daft decision to change to a so called more ‘exerienced’ Epsom jockey to me made absolutely zero difference in where the horse finished.

    #1696673
    Avatar photoRefuse To Bend
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    We’ll never know how Sheppard would have run his race so it is all rather academic.

    The more I know the less I understand.

    #1696684
    Avatar photoGingertipster
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    True RTB.
    One of my concerns today was whether AF would get upset in the prelims and whether he’d settle in the race itself. But Havlin did a great job. As settled as he ever has been despite the big Derby atmosphere. Maybe changing jockey enabled AF to do as well as he did today. Maybe he could have gone for home in earnest a little sooner, but it made no difference to the actual result. COT also has a fine turn of foot.

    Value Is Everything
    #1696687
    Avatar photoCork All Star
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    Connections did opt to use the red hood. I expect that helped to keep him settled.

    #1696709
    zilzal
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    Sorry folk, the lack of elbow work from Tattenham Corner to the 2F mark in an Epsom Derby looks bizarre to me the morning after :wacko: The stewards should have sought an explanation IMHO

    #1696714
    Avatar photoGladiateur
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    Maybe Rab was channelling his inner Pat Eddery?

    #1696715
    mickeyjp
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    He maybe just didn’t see cot on the other side of Los Angeles. Having said that he did get serious at the 2f pole so had plenty of time if good enough.

    #1696719
    Avatar photoCork All Star
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    Megan Nicholls got her wish.

    The owner is entitled to do what he wants but the decision to replace Shepherd with Havlin was difficult to justify. No one can convince me Shepherd would not have finished second on the horse. He may even have finished closer to the winner if he had committed earlier, which he might have done.

    https://x.com/RacingTV/status/1796870222860742936

    #1696726
    apracing
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    Two points:

    1. Is there any evidence that Shepherd was ever actually booked for the ride, or was it just assumed by him, his agent and the media.

    2. Perhaps Havlin was just riding to instructions – what if either the owner or trainers last words in the paddock were ‘don’t hit the front too early’.

    I adnit I might be biased on point 2, as Rab rode plenty of winners for me, but it’s something that critics of his riding seem to overlook, which is that a jockey is given instructions. He seems to be a regular target, such that I’ve a feeling if he’d kicked for home 3F out and been caught by COT, we’d have posts saying he should waited a bit longer!

    #1696733
    Avatar photoCork All Star
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    “Is there any evidence that Shepherd was ever actually booked for the ride, or was it just assumed by him, his agent and the media.”

    Perhaps he wasn’t but he does ride regularly for the Gredleys (I do not know if that is via contract or verbal agreement) and did ride the horse in his trial. It was not unreasonable to assume the ride was his.

    If the Gredleys had jocked Shepherd off for Marquand, I doubt there would have been as much criticism. But to jock him off for Havlin looked strange.

    #1696791
    Avatar photoCork All Star
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    Martin Dwyer on RTV: “Rab was hanging onto him because he had stamina doubts”.

    What is he going on about? He won the Lingfield Derby Trial over the distance. :wacko:

    #1703005
    zilzal
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    Surprised jockey Havlin did not come in for criticism following his ride on 2yo Chancellor this afternoon. Talk about making a 5/6f ride in a field of 5 look complicated. Pat Eddery wouldn’t have been impressed!

    #1706335
    Avatar photoEx RubyLight
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    It’s now Christophe Soumillion’s turn to replace the current jockey. I doubt the Gredleys will tell him what to do. This can only be played by Christophe’s rules…..

    #1706338
    zilzal
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    Belgian riding out of his skin at moment judging by a couple of recent rides I watched

    #1706346
    LD73
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    The way the horse pulled at York you would have thought a drop back in trip might have been the next move and not a step back up to 12F.

    They better hope there is some sort of strong front runner due to contest the Prix Niel as a typical slowly run French race with a sprint off the home turn on a horse that doesn’t really settle too well early buts needs to be dropped in seems like a recipe for disaster.

    Whats the betting that Shepherd is back on him after they decided to miss the Arc (following it once again going pear shaped in the Prix Niel) and head for the Champion Stakes instead?

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