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Don’t have RI to run a proper query, but a quick look at the results on the RP website:
Kempton : Opening day – present<br>10f and above = 33 races (all races execpt maidens/banded)
27 winners priced in single figures
<br> if races were as you say Glenn ”unpredictable”, wouldn’t you expect a higher proportion of bigger priced winners?
When i see people slagging off AW racing it does make me laugh tbh, the racing is no worse than the equivalent races on turf.
AW only lacks some of the top quality of turf racing, but Kempton has gone some way to rectify this and hopefully will continue to put on 0-90 and above races.
<br>The each way thieves may not like the smaller fields, but tough luck, it only means you have to work a bit harder.
<br>
(Edited by empty wallet at 5:19 am on July 25, 2006)
Here we go, the knocking of AW and Kempton once again
As AP said, the fixtures are the same as those on the turf there, so whats the problem?
So the crowd was low last week? Well it wasnt when i attended 4 weeks ago. No different to most evening fixtures ive been to over the past few years.
Yes, there is probably some prejudice from casual punters that "aw is rubbish" that might be holding it back, but in time I beleive that will fade. Under lights its a decent spectacle
One problem for Kempton last week was epsom being on the next night. It seemed to attract a big crowd
Obviously all the "quality" merchants were saving themselves for the superb card and excellent track there beloved by all trainers of course…
Interesting that the RP devoted the whole letters page on Sunday to readers responding to the course executive’s "where are the crowds?" plea.<br>I don’t agree with everything Julian Wilson says but his Angry Man article in today’s RP is excellent.<br>In essence Kempton’s PR and marketing types have alienated all their potential customers- professionals, avid racegoers, theme night types and the neck the beers element.<br>He comments on the poor prize money at a recent meeting.<br>Various other factors IMO are :-<br>- gimmicky American marker boards and off times at 7.28 etc<br>- AW track inside the turf now NH track , further away from racegoers and detracts from atmosphere<br>- no crowd= no atmosphere<br>- grandstand facilities like those rejected by a football club post Taylor report<br>- City types face a 12 stop overground rail journey and commuters clog the roads in the rush hour<br>Never the most attractive of tracks in SW London suburbia , nevertheless it used to be a Grade 1. Course exec. state that "they are a year behind schedule" which probably means they are not making money.<br>Basically they have lost many of their former patrons and are disconnected from the local community.<br>I shan’t be battling round the M25 to pay my £15 admission. Why don’t they do a Towcester and offer free admission for a year? realise this puts most execs. into apoplexy though!
(Edited by Lingfield at 11:52 am on July 25, 2006)
grandstand facilities like those rejected by a football club post Taylor report
Absolute rubbish.  i know alot of premiership grounds very well and i can name quite a few clubs that have facilities nothing like kempton. Even recently developed chelsea. Compared with other courses, Kempton is far better than many northern courses ive been to (wetherby and to an extent Ripon’s grandstands are a disgrace) and is on a par with sandown. Not as smart as rowley mile Newmarket but better than Lingfield
(Edited by clivex at 12:14 pm on July 25, 2006)<br>
(Edited by clivex at 12:15 pm on July 25, 2006)
City types face a 12 stop overground rail journey and commuters clog the roads in the rush hour
True. hard to see a away round that. but windsor is no better
gimmicky American marker boards and off times at 7.28 etc <br>- AW track inside the turf now NH track , further away from racegoers and detracts from atmosphere
Fail to see what affect the first point has on attendences
second point. The tighter course leads to better viewing and the floodlights are dramatic. When i was there the atmosphere picked up once these became effective
Prize money?
The link between that and attendences is tenuous to say the least
Not read JW today, but being the reactionary he is, can imagine that this is simply more anti AW drivel
I think free race nights and cheap race days are the way forward. £15 to watch a bunch of 12 runner 0 – 90 hcaps in no way compares to a similar entrance fee to get into Newmarket on Cambridgeshire day, for a card packed to the rafters with top class racing.<br>Racecourse execs have to come to terms with the fact that the entertainment industry is a competitive marketplace. You have to make your market look an attractive proposition. There is nothing attractive, to a family with three children, about spending £75 plus a fiver to park the car before you have even had a drink! And that is for a wednesday night.<br>I agree, they need to see the Towcester strategy as the way forward. Bums on seats is income in the bar, souvenier shop, resteurant, hot dog stand etc. And, believe it or not, through the bookies satchels LOL<br>I’d rather have 5000 wallets being utilised, with cheap turnstiles, than 500 pro punters looking to make a killing in the 7.56.
Agree RD
Suspect this will be coming
The free night they had there attarcted capacity crowd
one other point is that a lot of this is based on alst wednesday. kempton was in the hottest part of the country and believe me, that day, no one in that area felt fit to do anything…
This is a general trend of the dump being empty at every single fixture. You’re clutching at straws blaming the weather.
For some, racing is not just about betting, and A/W does not have the same appeal as a grass fixture.<br>Perhaps they should colour the surface green?
<br>Wilson’s comments on prize money in his article today are typical of the whole piece – carefully biased to enhance his argument.
He quotes the winning owners prize money for individual races (e.g. £4,304 which is what the owner gets from a race with £8,500 total prize fund) – and compares that with the average total prize money (i.e. including place money and the percentages paid to trainer and jockey) for the the year 2004, which means he’s including NH days like the King George and Racing Post Chase fixtures that are obviously going to offer more money than an evening flat card.
He also whinges about the tight turns, short 2F straight (which is only true for races over 5F and 10F, but why let the facts get in the way) – so presumably he also wants Ascot and Chester closed?
He talks about the prize money for the Jubilee quoting numbers from 1887, quietly ignoring the fact that the race had declined on turf long before the track was dug up.
In fact I now feel quite certain that I’m right, if only because Mr Angry and Glenn are on the other side of the fence.
AP
This is a general trend of the dump being empty at every single fixture. You’re clutching at straws blaming the weather.
Complete rubbish. Simply not true
<br>
The trainers and jockeys have hardly complained about the "tight turns" have they?
Rather listen to them than JW
Frankly if hes been distorting the stats in that way, the RP should not have published the piece and Kempton management will have every right to take that up with them :angry:
<br>What gets me is that the way some are talking Kempton held nothing but Group races and top class handicaps before the AW.
<br>
i suppose we will have to get used to those narrow minded people who will never (or will they ?) accept aw racing, using every opportunity to criticse it. everyone is entitled to their own opinions of course but it would be more reasonable if these people also criticised the other racing of lower quality that goes on, brighton, bath, southwell, poor quality jumps racing, etc, but no, these people cannot be that consistent. kempton is still a great venue for spectators imo and to say 90 rated handicaps at kempton are the equivalent of sellers and claimers elsewhere is utter tosh. i ignore brighton and similar racing these days and have no interest in the sheer lottery of some of the terrible quality jumps, bumper and amateur or apprentice races that go on but that doesn’t mean i’d ever be so vitriolic in criticising it just because i don’t like it because i know some people probably do.
No it isn’t utter tosh.
I’m prepared to put my money where my mouth is here. Favourites will have a worse record at Kempton over the next year than the average for all turf courses.
What prices will you lay me about that statement being proved true?
I asked TDK for a similar offer when he was talking utter tosh about Kempton being punter friendly. He wisely went very quiet. You see, he knows who ordered polyrack to be laid there and why it was chosen.
Clivex,
You mount a staunch defence of your local track,Kempton AW , in your 7 posts!
Why do you feel that Windsor attracts a good turnout on a Monday night (hardly a traditional night out)  while Kempton AW is struggling?
You state that Epsom got a good crowd. If memory serves me the card was nothing special and they charge £20-£23 to get in.
What recommendations or marketing strategy would you suggest to the Kempton course executive apart from mine of free admission for a trial period?
(Edited by Lingfield at 7:28 pm on July 25, 2006)
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