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I’m sure I read an interview with Lester Piggott a few years back where he said that all horses have a preference, however slight..being Lester I think that he picked up on it as soon as he got on a horse…I suppose it’s like us being right or left handed.
Does anyone who keeps stats take into consideration whether there are undulations, or if the course is tight or galloping ?
One thing to be careful of is the north/south divide – you’ll often see a horse trained in northern England who only seems to have won left-handed but that’s probably because there are so few right-handed tracks oop noorth. There’s Perth and Musselburgh in Scotland but after that you’ve got to come down to Market Rasen/Leicester before finding one. The west country has more than it’s fair share of right-handed circuits – Taunton, Wincanton and Exeter.
There are also one or two tracks that seem to cause horses to jump ‘the other way’, possibly because of the siting of the fences. Plenty of runners at Worcester earn the comment "jumped right" but still win and the last Ascot meeting saw the comment "jumped left" crop up several times – including winners Baseball Ted and Deep Purple.
Interesting stuff this.
In the past I thought a jumper tells us which way around he prefers, right or left handed because of the direction he goes after the fence.
This is why I have not taken too much notice of Kauto Star’s better record right handed than left handed. Just thinking it was coincidence or (before Haydock) may be more to do with an undulating course (worse form) against a flat one (better).
But AP’s explanation of us jumping a barrel or something, which leg would we lead with? And could we do it as easily with the other leg? Has got me thinking. If Kauto Star is more comfortable on right handed courses it does not matter that he goes slightly left after a fence, he will still be better off going right handed.
Have not altogether been converted about Kauto Star’s preference but am now more inclined to the Right handed theory than I was.
EDIT Ooops! Just when I thought I had an original thought, I see another thread has been talking about the same thing for hours.
Move this post or disregard if you wish.
Mark
Value Is Everythingthey seemed pretty sure when they first had him that he preferred going left handed..that’s the confusing bit
An interesting enough topic, but – re. NH races – surely it makes not one bit of difference which leg a horse leads with unless the obstacle the horse jumps is on a bend.
If that is the case (and I’m quite prepared to admit I may be talking out of my backside), until Chester starts having jump racing, the effect can be only minimal.
Okay, so 10% may be minimal but significant nonetheless, but there may be other factors that seem to make a horse perform less well going L or R handed. If a horse seems to do less well going say, LH, might it just be that:-
a) It’s racing in more competitive races when going LH. So does it lose because it can’t go LH or because it’s a harder race?
b) When the beast goes LH is it racing on going that it underperforms on?
c) Does it have a disadvantageous draw? When a horse gets stuffed at Chester, or Beverley say, do you blame the draw first or the bend on the track?
You may detect a bit of scepticism on my part here, especially when NH races are concerned. I doubt if too many horses are seriously discomfitted by going left or right – unless it has only got one eye.
By the way, Brigadier Gerard only raced once around a LH bend and that was at York when he got beat for the only time. . Does that mean he couldn’t handle Left hand bends? I don’t think so.I agree that this is a very interesting subject. I also think that I’ve been looking at things the wrong way for years!
You see, I think animals jump off their back legs, so I haven’t considered the lead foot.
Now, my question is why do some horses jump to one side? I’ve always thought it’s because they are feeling something on the opposite side, but, more likely somewhere in the back.So, do I think the answer lies in the spine? No, not entirely.
My view is that most of it depends on the eye and the brain. We all see things differently, don’t we?
Did you notice that KS did better with the noseband?
I would have thought that the lead leg round the bend would be more important than the jumping leg. They would jum poff the same leg regardless of going left or right. I presume a horse would lead with one leg when galloping and one type of track would be suited to that. Going the other way would mean changing lead leg and possible inconvenience.
Regarding insomniac‘s case of Brigadier Gerard I would merely say ‘case not proven due to lack of evidence’.
In my area stats are slanted by lack of opportunities going right-handed, in that there’s only Musselburgh and Carlisle in the winter and Perth in the summer. A further complication is that the going at Musselburgh and Carlisle is normally very different. Once options are limited then trainers are in the hands of the programme planners. I’ve often seen Scottish trained runners running at courses or distances which don’t ideally suit them due to lack of suitable programmed races.
Rob
Over the last 3 years….
Chasers going left handed who ran left handed last time out 1599-13914=11.49% and +4.29% ROI at BFSP
Chasers going left handed who ran right handed last time out
728-6905=10.54% and -9.53% ROI at BFSPChasers going right handed who ran right handed last time out
804-6937=11.59% and +1.05% ROI at BFSPChasers going right handed who ran left handed last time out
839-7287=11.51% and -1.92% ROI at BFSPSo the effect seems more pronounced on left handed courses for some reason and clearly isn’t fully factored into the market.
WON LTO all ROI at BFSP
Left LTO + Left Today = 333-1725= 19.3% and -3.54% ROI
Right LTO + Left Today = 160-807= 19.83% and -1.61% ROI
Right LTO + Right Today = 187-873= 21.42% and +13.76% ROI
Left LTO + Right Today = 156-730= 21.37% and -5.14 ROILTO winners more or less covered (surprise, surprise) although the RT to RT for LTO winners looks good. I’d want to know the reasons for that before I’d be investing the hard earned in it though.
Deeper digging required methinks.
It’d be interesting to see some stats such as won more than once left or right handed while not winning the opposite way but having run the ‘worng’ way more than twice. For example.
What I’m getting at is trying to eke out those horses who, statistically, might have a glimmer of a preference and then seeing how they fare.
Does that make any sense?
I think there’s something in this.
Without wishing to start a ‘Kauto’ frenzy again Kauto Star is:
5/9 LH
6/6 RHYYYYYYYYYYYYYeeeeeeeeeeeeeesssssssssssssss.
Kauto frenzy.
If KS really is 6 for 6 going righthanded, then maybe they should consider the Irish National.
When is Easter this year?
Gerald
I should have qualified what I posted with ‘his record in most recent runs.’
However, I think Kauto Star prefers going RH.
Desert Orchid is a prime example of a horse who much preferred right handed tracks. His Cheltenham runs illustrate the point well. Yes, I know he won the Gold Cup ( just ) but Fulke Walwyn’s Ten Plus would have won by at least ten lengths had he not fallen when cantering in front.
As for Brigadier Gerard; I agree, case not proven – though it has to be pointed out that he still managed to beat the then course record at York in spite of only finishing second.
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