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Now, before I lay my cards on the table, I’ll make the point that OF COURSE it is upto any individual bookmaker of what they are willing to lay and what markets they are accepting of opening. I’ve no problem with that per se, which may sound hypocritical when I make my point.
So before the flat season begins, I do tend to take a flyer on one or two purely based on their bloodline. I don’t mind throwing a couple of quid at one bred in the purple if I believe it could follow the right paths and at least (potentially) give me a run for my money. Generally this is an accepted practice. Unraced horses priced up for some fool (ie me) to have a whirl at. This year though the bookies seem to be playing hardball.
What’s going on here exactly? I’ve gone to all my run of the mill firms and asked for price requests on the 2 year old races at Royal Ascot and for next years Guineas. Sure I come off a bit nutty, but this is how I get my kicks on the flat. Bit drab otherwise I find.
No firms seem to want to price anything up though more is the mystery. I made the point back that, particularly with Sky Bet, their #RequestABet section is ridiculously extensive to the point of obscurity, but still no dice.
Does this seem odd to anyone else? This is the first year I’ve not been able to get on.
Not really tbh.
Very few punters want to make these sort of bets, it takes up resource to organise quotes about something it’s impossible to get a rounded book going on, it’s just not a good use of their time.
Plus their fear is that anyone requesting an unusual bet is liable to know something they don’t.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"A lot of bookies like to offer prices for the Guineas after a better bred horse has won first time out. They offer you something around 16-1 and that’s what they do with about 50 other winners.
They get pretty decent books for next year and are paid in advance.Have you ever worked in a bookmakers’ trading room, Ex Rubylight?
Genuine question.
Either way, I think we should both count how many 2yos this year get 2023 Guineas quotes.
I think it will be fewer than 50 for both the 2023 2,000 Guineas and 2023 1,000 Guineas combined.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"They offered prices on Facile Vega before he ever ran, so why don’t they do the same on the flat?
Maybe they’ve had their fingers burned more doing it on the Flat?
I’m not knocking anyone, but bookmakers often get criticised for turning away business, but they always have their reasons for doing it.
Any situation where experience tells them the punter probably knows more then they do and they run for the hills.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Can you still get on with other sporting bets of this kind?
I have just googled the one I remember which was Mark Williams to win the World Snooker by the end of 2000 which he duly did. They put the bet on in 1989 when Williams was 14 – £140 @ 300/1 netting £42K winnings.
Well Ian, I worked with CashPoint during my five year stay in Austria. That was back in 2005. To tell you the truth, there are no genuine bookmakers around. All the odds came at that time from a source called Betradar. All the price changes came also from that source. When one bookie changed the odds the rest did just the same. They work more like banks, minimum risk, quick payout, offering all kind of pay-in possibilities, KYC procedures and so on. The traditional bookie who “dared” to offer 6/4 for an even money shot seems long gone.
Thanks for that, and yes I agree – few “take a view” any more outside, that is, my beloved world of Point-to-Point.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"“The traditional bookie who “dared” to offer 6/4 for an even money shot seems long gone.”
That is true of racecourses here now.
The last bookie I ever encountered who took a view to take on a favourite was Tony Morris at Wimbledon dogs. He was right more often than he was wrong. But when you did win money off him, he paid out with a smile and a “well done”. An old school, gentleman bookie and much missed.
You’re right about Tony Morris, Cork. I used to go to the greyhounds back in the 90s. No matter at what track you were, he was the first one to price up a race. You could see the lads from other pitches waiting for him to provide them with his opinion. Very few others seemed to have an own opinion.
That is my recollection too, Ruby. Tony was always the first to price up at Wimbledon. The other bookies would then follow his lead.
To be fair, after that there was competition between them. They were all proper old school bookies: Del Nash, John Hall, George Reed, John White. There was also a fellow who bet without the favourite but I cannot remember his name.
I was never a big punter on the dogs but I enjoyed the Wimbledon scene, especially when the Derby was on. The old place really came alive for those few weeks.
I got to know Tony quite well. One night I got lucky and backed about four winners with him. After the last of them he just pointed me to the exit!
There were some proper punters at Wimbledon in those days. Tony stood some serious bets. He treated everyone the same, paid out with good grace and never complained if he lost. I believe he had made a fortune when he sold his chain of shops to one of the big firms, so maybe he could afford to indulge punters a little bit – but I was always impressed by him. He was a real, old school gentleman.
Eventually I moved back up north and lost touch with Wimbledon. Then one day I read in the Post that Tony had died. I felt sad but was glad I had known him. I like to think our encounters ended as honours even – but I suppose Tony was slightly ahead!
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