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What has he got to lose by running in the Derby?
Yes a very valid point.I think by racing very fierce he may really fold up the last couple of furlongs.The run would most likely knock the stuffing out of him,so in a sense he is devalued if he performs badly.Also i think the aura around him certainly would suffer and i think the bottom line for a trainer is to place his horses to give both owner and horse the best chance of winning.While he keeps winning there is mystique around him being unbeaten.
Re. his style of running – he is clearly versatile as he has been held up fine before and has plenty of time to learn how to settle. Re. how good a guineas it was, well this time last year we were all saying what a weak 3 year old division it was – turned out we were wrong. way too early to say this year too. Won’t know until after Glorious Goodwood.
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Re. his style of running – he is clearly versatile as he has been held up fine before and has plenty of time to learn how to settle. Re. how good a guineas it was, well this time last year we were all saying what a weak 3 year old division it was – turned out we were wrong. way too early to say this year too. Won’t know until after Glorious Goodwood.
Yes he may settle,certainly not in time for the Derby though,and i think the free wheeling in front is his strength,dont know if you could hold him up in a race over a bit more ground,big difference to settling in a 6 or 7f race to getting them to settle in a 10 or 12f race.
Completly disagree re ROC….he has no scope….he wont win a Group 1 this year. He looks like a pony.
All the Rags came to the fore in behind Frankel…hard to know what to make of it
You were saying?
Great stuff already if you ask me.
The horse that trails in 38L behind Frankel in our Guineas comes out and wins a Group 1 next time, with the horse that finished behind Frankel giving the form a solid look to it.
It probably doesn’t add up to much, but better for the Frankel form that RoC and DG finish first and second than not be placed at all.
Great stuff already if you ask me.
The horse that trails in 38L behind Frankel in our Guineas comes out and wins a Group 1 next time, with the horse that finished behind Frankel giving the form a solid look to it.
It probably doesn’t add up to much, but better for the Frankel form that RoC and DG finish first and second than not be placed at all.
Yeah, although to be fair to ‘ruby’ a very weak G1. The Dubawi Gold run behind Frankel is now exposed as a clever ride on the day. I’m now getting very excited about Native Khan for the Derby tbh.
How about ROC for the Derby? If that was a poor Guineas what was the Newmarket one? How about those speedy Galileos!
How about ROC for the Derby? If that was a poor Guineas what was the Newmarket one? How about those speedy Galileos!
I honestly don’t see how that run wins him a Derby, he has beaten trees by a diminishing 2L. Maybe he needs a bit further to show his best, but I couldn’t see him beating Carlton House or Native Khan over any distance tbh. Could be a Leger horse in the offing?
Just in case you missed it – another rebuff to those who have doubts about Frankel’s form. In the Greenham, Frankel beat Excelebration by 4 lengths. People might have wondered if was any good since he was only rated 89 by the BHA handicappers, but he did beat 94, 95, 99 rated horses by 6, 7.5 and 9 lengths (ignoring Strong Suit). Well now he has gone on to win the German 2000 Guineas. As we all know, not exactly a top drawer race (Group 2 £86,000), but he did win it by 7 lengths. Beating the other two UK horses Casual Glimpse rated 97 by 17 lengths, and The Paddyman rated 105 by 24 lengths.
There seems to be a trend – get beaten by Frankel and you’ll improve markedly to run a cracker next time out:
Rainbow Springs – from a one-run maiden to 3rd in a Group 1
Klammer – next time a Group 3 win
Roderic O’Connor – next time a Group 1
Excelebration – win a German Classic
Dubawi Gold – nearly was / should have / could have been an Irish Classic winnerI wonder who will finish second in the St James’s Palace Stakes?
I wonder who will finish second in the St James’s Palace Stakes?
With a bit of luck Frankel…….
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And here is Excelebration winning the German 2000 …
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0S2KwXTPiE
Yes, Goldikova is an exception race mare but I feel that, even at her best, she won’t beat Frankel. In all honesty, I can’t see her getting within two lengths of him.
I think many people are now under the false impression (since the 2000 Guineas) that Frankel is a front runner who lasts a mile … but it clearly isn’t the case. He’s just as effective as a hold-up performer and seems to have the stamina and energy to see out 10 furlongs shoud he be tried at that trip.Frankel has the most majestic, long stride I’ve seen from a racehorse but is shatteringly fast with it.
The way Frankel finishes his races it’s hard to believe he can’t get another furlong or two at least. Although there’s nothing wrong with being a brilliant miler or sprinter and 1 Mile may be Frankels best distance, I think Frankel deserves at least one chance to see if he can go longer.
And if he does not stay it will prove that Galileo can also get pure milers.The super sire.
As I posted 30 minutes earlier on the other thread about Frankel.
"I think we must restrict ourselves to comparing him against milers as that is what he is unbeaten against as a 3 year old to date. Firstly against his peer group and now against probably the best current older miler Canford Cliffs.
If he were to go up agsinst good 10f to 12f colts and horses at those distances in my opinion he might find this difficult. If we look at similar bred colts, sire being Galileo, Damsire being Danehill with a Northern Dancer inbreeding, then we have to compare him with Rip Van Winkle, Roddy O’Conner and Marksmanship.
At 8f he has achieved much much more, but looking at his peer group Roddy O’Conner and Marksmanship in particular, then there is an breeding argument against him ever winning at 10f and 12f".
As I posted 30 minutes earlier on the other thread about Frankel.
"I think we must restrict ourselves to comparing him against milers as that is what he is unbeaten against as a 3 year old to date. Firstly against his peer group and now against probably the best current older miler Canford Cliffs.
If he were to go up agsinst good 10f to 12f colts and horses at those distances in my opinion he might find this difficult.
The converse equally applies. In all probability, the 10 and 12 furlong colts and horses would find it an even more difficult task if they were to drop back and take Frankel on at his preferred distance.
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