- This topic has 59 replies, 20 voices, and was last updated 12 years, 7 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Exactly. But does Hughes have a written contract with Hannon? If yes then he either honors his contract or Hannon takes him to court!Not likely, because until the Fallon incident nobody went to court over such matters.That was the pool Fallon was swimming in.He did not anticipate a change in the environment.Even McCoy does not expect to be held to a hand shake as I indicated above.Written contracts were not worth the paper they were written on until the Fallon incident.Most jockeys will be reluctant to sign a contract after the Fallon incident.Least of all a contract with an individual owner.Hughes contract with Cecil practically ended his career. He was lucky that Hannon rescued his career.Since joiniung Hannon he rides over a hundred winners a season.Incidentally Fallon without a stable of note is riding over a hundred this year. Something to be proud of.
As I understand it andyod, Fallon is retained by Mr Cumani. With regard to Mr Stoute, Fallon is picking up spare rides for him due to the enforced absence of Ryan Moore. I note that he doesn’t get any of the mounts on Prince Abdullahs horses though , even those with Mr Stoute. Obviously the owners decision, and not the trainers.
- Total Posts 17716
As I understand it andyod, Fallon is retained by Mr Cumani.
No "retainer", I believe; just an informal agreement he’ll ride for him when he can, and when it suits him.
Whether people think it is right or wrong, where is the loyalty to the jockey who has ridden the horse in every run, rides the stable jockeys on the gallops. Find it really really shallow from Manor House. Fully expect Owen to be behind the decision, not Dascombe.
Really do feel for Richard Kingscote.
I never like to see this happen.
It has happened to many a good jockey in the past e.g. the likes of Starkey and Matthias losing out to the likes of Piggott and Eddery.
However in this case, for goodness sake Fallon. Hardly a big race success story anymore.
Chin up Kingscote
I hope Mr Owen gets his just reward !Not for the first time, a jockey is held acountable for the limitations of the horse. Though here it is more a case of inflated expectations of the owners.
A poor decision, though Dascombe’s to tie up wth Owen was hardly a better one.
i think this forum can be very two sided at times. say for example if henry cecil got rid of queally and gave someone like kingscote a chance as stable jockey, and he was on frankel. would you be relieved or worried? then ask yourself if you would be relieved or worried if fallon was on frankel because the owner didn’t want an inexperienced jockey on board. exactly!!!
i suppose most people are like that with queally now though, saying he should binned off because his body language when riding is showing the nerves are getting to him.
In Germany RK’s orders were to make the best of his draw and take up a good position – I think he could have been a victim of circumstance that day.
Top quality jockeys don’t need them sort of orders and then get it wrong, they know what to do. For people to wish Michael Owen ill luck just because he’s changed the jockey after he has pumped millions into the sport is plainly ridiculous.
if fallon was on frankel
That is a definite rofl!
I think hell would freeze over before Henry sanctioned that.
In Germany RK’s orders were to make the best of his draw and take up a good position – I think he could have been a victim of circumstance that day.
Top quality jockeys don’t need them sort of orders and then get it wrong, they know what to do. For people to wish Michael Owen ill luck just because he’s changed the jockey after he has pumped millions into the sport is plainly ridiculous.
It’s irrelevant what jockeys of any stature feel about orders if riding for a trainer who likes giving them. I seriously doubt that K Fallon will go out orderless at Doncaster.
At no point have I wished Michael Owen ill, nor would I. I’ve questioned his decision as a long term strategy for success, but wish him no ill.
Do all jockeys who ride first jockey sign a contract?If so then the present issue is moot.The excuses being given by Richard Hughes today for riding the stable selection in the Leger never mentioned whether he had a contract with Hannon to ride the stable selection or not.He attributed his decision to loyalty.Had he stayed with his stable he would have been leading jockey at Ascot. Is word of mouth considered a contract?Is a hand shake considered a contract?McCoy once said "I have a committment unless I get a better offer" re a ride for Noel Chance in the Gold Cup.Did Gosden have a contract with Fortune?Few go to court on these issues.Did Eddery every repay Walwyn for his loyalty? Did he not dump him for Ballydoyle shortly after?
.
Walwyn told Wildenstein to go and …… find another trainer in 1978. In the five years before 1978, Walwyn trained an average of 104 horses per year. In the five years after 1978, Walwyn trained an average of 111 horses per year. If the Wildenstein incident had any influence at all on Walwyn’s career, it seems that it was positive rather than negative.
andyod – it wasn’t loyalty to Eddery that blighted Mr Walwyn’s fortunes. He suffered terribly at the hands of a persistent virus as I recall
In the end, no. However your assertion that Mr Walwyn’s loyalty to Eddery ended his own career is incorrect
OK.Did Eddery stay loyal to him?
It depends on your definition of loyalty. Anyone’s definition should include how things are done and not just what was done. Eddery left Walwyn. Was he disloyal? It seems that Walwyn thought not.
Peter Walwyn could be quirky and volatile at times (like many trainers) and quite a tough nut (like many trainers) and I have often thought I might buy his autobiography. This thread has prompted me to go to Amazon and do the business. I hope there is plenty in there to answer questions about Eddery’s loyalty to Walwyn and vice versa.
In the meantime, there are couple of pieces of evidence that Walwyn was very friendly with Eddery right up to the end of their respective careers. Right after Eddery went to Ballydoyle, Walwyn used him, especially in big races, when his new jockey, Joe Mercer, was unavailable. Walwyn continued to use him whenever he could right up until his retirement. In 1999 Walwyn wrote a letter for publication about the split between Eddery and Terry Ellis, his agent (and brother-in-law):
"THE parting of Pat Eddery and Terry Ellis is a particularly sad event. During the time Pat rode for me as stable jockey, and ever since, the co-operation between the three of us has been remarkable, without a single disagreement.
A large part of Pat’s success is due to the organising abilities of Terry. Pat will, no doubt in his brilliant and inimitable way, ride as well as ever, but he will be hard-pressed to find an agent of such calibre.
I wish them both the very best. With over 800 winners since the first one-a record partnership between trainer and jockey-I will continue to use Pat on every occasion he is available.
PETER WALWYN
LambournCOPYRIGHT 1999 MGN LTD"
When Eddery retired as a jockey, Walwyn said about him:
"Grundy was the star, but I think we had about 600 winners together. We never had a disagreement in all our time together. Racing is losing one of the finest ambassadors it has ever had and I wish Pat a very happy retirement and great success in whatever he does next."
I think Walwyn was, and still is, an old-fashioned gentleman, who wanted things done properly and honourably. Hence his response to Wildenstein’s public comments about Eddery. I can only assume that Eddery’s leaving Walwyn in 1980, for the top job in Europe, was done properly and honourably without a hint of disloyalty.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.