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I don’t really want to bring up the Scottish Question again (Ginge), but maybe you
might understand why there is such a staunch following of the SNP. Basically it
doesn’t matter how Scotland votes, we’re going to have a Conservative Govt which
Scotland clearly doesn’t want. Add to that that you have a complete buffoon in charge
of the country, and in general an inept cabinet, this is all manna from heaven for Sturgeon.Whatever you think of Cummings, this is a hand grenade he’s lobbed in and whilst it might
be brushed off just now, it won’t at the subsequent inquiry. He might just be the person
responsible for brexit and Scottish Independance. I wouldn’t mind having the rights to
the book and the film
As Nathan says, Johnson could come out wearing the pelt of his dog as a scarf over a “I killed 160,000” T-Shirt and a substantial proportion of the electorate would still claim he’s done a great job.
They tend to say “it’s not good but Labour would be much worse”..
Charles Darwin to conquer the World
England is a Tory state now, no matter what concoction of truth/half-truths/lies Cummings came up with.
I agree 100% – UK is a Conservative nation state.
I don’t think Starmer is a bad leader – best at PMQs since John Smith used to take John Major apart and, whatever your politics, clearly a more trustworthy honourable man than Johnson.
But his Party is unelectable.
In 1987, on Election Night, the BBC’s David Dimbleby said to Norman Tebbit: “Neil Kinnock is widely believed to have fought a good campaign yet you have beaten him decisively. Why do you think that is?”
“It’s obvious,” replied Tebbit. “If you’ve got your marketing right and done everything right, but your product still won’t sell, you must have a lousy product. A Labour government would be a lousy product.”
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Johnson is a libertarian, which is in most times a good thing. May be in the early stages of the disease he was a bit late locking down, but this has been a once in a lifetime disease. Nobody knew just how bad it was going to get. I remember the talk on Question Time at the time and there was very little – if any – disagreement on what to do (not even from the SNP BigG)
. If Johnson was slow I think the vast majority would’ve been just as slow. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Am sure there are regrets and mistakes were definitely made. Letting patients in to care homes from hospital without a test particularly baffling. However, there is a difference between taking things too slow and not taking things seriously. If looking at Boris Vs Cummings – Cummings Castle visit suggests to me it was he who wasn’t taking the virus seriously enough. It’ll be different if more people come forward to back these stories up, but at the moment Cummings seems desperate – after his own sacking – to settle scores. BBC and the left seem to be taking everything Cummings says as the truth these days. 
Value Is EverythingJohnson was elected on one issue alone and that was BREXIT with his slogan GET BREXIT DONE .
In my opinion, the surrey in 2016 had Leave a narrow winner, a result I don’t think anyone expected otherwise they would have had conditions to it like a two thirds majority. In the first election after both main parties Conservatory and Labour backed the result, Liberals was trying to reverse it. Result was a minority government for MAY, who did a bad job at trying to win. Which meant she had no majority to see BREXIT through. So we had another election, with Boris as Tory leader and Corbyn as Labour leader. Labour was now on the fence about Brexit, promising another vote on Stay or Leave. We hadn’t resolve the first vote.
This Covid happened during his government and Boris has made lots of mistakes (probably still making mistakes), but I don’t think Cummings is as innocent as he’s making out, and has a hidden agenda.
You've got to accentuate the positive.
Eliminate the negative.
Latch on to the affirmative.
Don't mess with mister in between.I think any government, however competent, would struggle to deal with this crisis but having an incompetent Government has made matters worse.
Spot on Paul, and that is borne out by the facts: if deaths per million is assumed to be a robust stat then the UK at 1,873 is now, in Europe, in 15th position in the grim league with 12 above 2,000, including population-comparable Italy at 2,083. The figures for Spain are 1,707 and France 1,667, Germany rather lower at 1,084. Elsewhere, in other populous countries: USA 1,822, Brazil 2,125, Mexico 1,708
All of which suggests some sort of regression (progression?) to a mean regardless of how individual countries have chosen to combat the virus, in the wealthy west anyway
So, if our government’s strategy is deemed shambolic, then so too must must that of many other governments: that, or perhaps the stats indicate the impossibility of mitigating contagion within and between mature heavily populated intimately inter-connected economies
As for Cummings: everyone surely knew he’d let blast at some stage, just a surprise to me that it took him so long after leaving Downing Street way back when last November
All politicians are sh1t, some are just more sh1t than others: take your pick
…this is the most incompetent Government in my lifetime
I had a conversation with an oak tree the other day who was saying the same thing.
When taking in to account population and particularly density of population, I Don’t think this government has done as badly as many believe.
Value Is EverythingDrone you are sneaking a clever one in there.
Previously when I quoted bad comparative figures with Europe ( before the vaccine take up made them more respectable) you said comparisons were not useful because of demographics and varying population densities and clusters etc. I think you dented my argument back then – but now post jab you rely on them. Back of the class mate !
We are not looking so much at other countries failing as an excuse for the blither types in our government – no we are looking at preventable deaths. Scientists told the government to lock down two weeks before they did it. 15 – 20,000 more people were estimated to have died due to this delay. They highlighted the report on the news tonight.
Ginger you need to change the record – it’s rather out of date.
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Anyone know if darren83 is a Native American?
83 was the year that Mclovinyou introduced the chicken 🐓 McNugget. Check Darren’s posts for any reference to chickabiddy !
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Will do
It is highly unlikely locking down two weeks earlier would have made any difference. Infections peaked the week before the lockdown was imposed and deaths peaked on 8th April. The virus was already too well established.
There is a growing body of evidence that lockdowns do not prevent the spread of a virus. But they do clear harm socially, educationally, mentally and physically. Not to mention the economic damage.
@ Cork All Star
Your “growing body of evidence” comes from a body calling itself the American institute
for Economic Research, a “think tank” that portrays the risk of climate change as “minor
and manaageable”. It’s responsible for titles such as “The Real Reason Nobody Takes Enviromental
Activists Seriously” and “Brazilians Should Keep Slashing Their Rainforest” That’s not to mention
funding research on the comparative benefits that sweatshops supplying multinationals bring to
people working in them. They would make BoJo look left wing.Realising the scale of the problem too late cost lives. If you don’t think lockdowns work then
take a look at New Zealand’s lockdown strategy.
. If Johnson was slow I think the vast majority would’ve been just as slow. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Am sure there are regrets and mistakes were definitely made. Letting patients in to care homes from hospital without a test particularly baffling. However, there is a difference between taking things too slow and not taking things seriously. If looking at Boris Vs Cummings – Cummings Castle visit suggests to me it was he who wasn’t taking the virus seriously enough. It’ll be different if more people come forward to back these stories up, but at the moment Cummings seems desperate – after his own sacking – to settle scores. BBC and the left seem to be taking everything Cummings says as the truth these days. 
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